HI Allie,
Glad to hear you're not subjecting folks to the same righteous wrath that
Rand subjected to her fictional villains!:)
I suspect that, unless you were a member of Rand's Inner Circle, you'd not be
thought of in terms of good or evil, for the most part--unless you were a
reviewer of her works! I recall a sentence or two that Rand wrote where she met
someone whose ideas were "ordinary" and who was also "ordinary." Rand never
thought of castigating the person.
best always,
Mike R

Alya <alyas17@...> wrote: Just to add my
2 cents on this topic, I agree with Michael about the
fact that AR's work definitely does more good than harm to those who
read it. I found her work immensely useful in shaping the way I
look at the world, politics, people, etc. At the same time, I feel
there was a minor negative impact as well. I don't think I've
judged people quite as harshly, or held them to quite the same high
standards, before reading AR's novels. Perhaps because she was one
of the few influences that actually shaped the way I look at the
world, it seemed to me that her "voice" and the way SHE would think
of things really permeated my brain a bit too much to the point
where I felt like my judgments of people and of events stemmed
strictly from what I'd think SHE would think on the matter. And
because her tone and voice in her novels often seemed very strong
and in some ways harsh, I felt that my pattern of thinking and
judging things became harsh as well. Luckily, this little effect is
wearing off now (I think) and I don't think that it damaged me in
any significant way. For the most part, I continue to be very
grateful to AR for sort of waking me up a bit and opening my eyes to
a lot of things and just giving me some sort of framework for how I
view the world.

Interesting thread....

Allie

--- In nathaniel_branden@yahoogroups.com, "Michael Lee"
<mikelee.home@...> wrote:
>
> Stephanie responded about Rand's harms:
>
> > > Anyone who is not thriving in this world is struggling because
of
> > following poor ideas. This is his/her own fault. S/he is either
very
> > badly mistaken or (much more likely) evil.
> > >
> > > The problem is that the real world does not work that way, and
if
> > people believe these premises they tend to end up disillusioned,
> > depressed, and isolated.
> > >
> > > I think that Rand's lack of compassion for people in general is
> > harmful to the people who most need her philosophy.
>
> But what I was asking about specifically, was about specific
harms. Who do
> you know who has been derailed and ruined by reading Rand? No
question,
> Rand's ideas are powerful, and therefore should have consequences,
but what
> bad consequences have actually occurred?
>
> Since originally posting this question, I've thought some more
about it, and
> I think that people who joined the Rand/Peikoff cult may be able
to point to
> actual harm, but the rest of us can't. And probably most people in
the cult
> were more helped than harmed, especially if they walked away
voluntarily,
> which I bet most people do after a while. The rest of
her "victims" should
> probably be glad they're not Scientologists.
>
> Who has read Atlas Shrugged and can say that doing so in itself
screwed them
> up or did them more harm than good? Sure, it may have made them a
little
> pissy for a while, but so what?
>
> Atlas Shrugged caused me to be forever alienated from my church,
my in-laws
> and most people I knew. Thank, you Aynie! What a bunch of
jackasses you
> helped me jettison!
>
> Perhaps I would have figured out soon enough that I needed to make
some
> serious changes without reading Rand, but there's no question that
she was a
> salubrious shock to my system just when I needed her most. The
thing she
> gets harshed on the most about is her harsh attitude. But it's
also the
> thing I needed to make me stand up and speak truth to assholes.
Rand is
> daunting and insipiring.
>
> Who's been seriously daunted by Rand? Especially compared against
all of us
> who have been seriously inspired by her?
>
> Mike Lee
> Rand is the Donald Trump of Philosophy
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> People whose
> > lives have gone off-track are the ones who are looking for the
> > answer as to how to get back to what they wanted and expected
their
> > lives to be. But if the truth is bundled with the idea that the
> > person doing the looking is "evil" for not having lived properly
> > prior to learning these ideas, that only adds to his/her burden.
And
> > yet such people will cling to her philosophy because the good in
it
> > can help them heal. This can cause a chain reaction in which
people
> > are healed to an extent, but not fully--because Rand's ideas
require
> > them to live in isolation, to view people who already have the
> > answers as superior to those wo are struggling, to view
themselves
> > as good only insofar as they follow her ideas perfectly. These
> > people experience personal growth without developing compassion;
> > instead of sharing their inner light with others, they keep it to
> > > themselves. I do not believe this is good for either the
person
> > doing it or the world in general.
> > >
> > > Of course, in a perfect world, it wouldn't matter if Rand
> > emphasized isolation and non-compassion, because in the long
run, it
> > is what each person thinks is important that should drive his/her
> > actions. But to take the good and dismiss the bad in someone
else's
> > ideas--especially someone with as powerful a way of expressing
their
> > ideas as Ayn Rand--requires a strong sense of self to begin with.
> > And again, those people who come to Rand because they're looking
for
> > something just aren't going to have the inner strength to examine
> > the implications of her ideas.
> > >
> > > The deeper truth, really, is that asking if Rand's ideas are
> > harmful are like asking if Jesus Christ's are. Christ emphasized
> > following the spirit of the law over the letter; a similar caveat
> > applies to Rand's ideas. The spirit of Rand's ideas requires
> > respect fo the individual, and yet a literal interpretation
requires
> > one to dismiss others as unimportant or unworthy and evil. It is
> > this interpretation that is harmful, more so than the ideas
> > themselves.
> > >
> > > Stephanie
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > There's enough room in this world for everybody to be
successful.
> > > In memory of David Newton (1962-2006)
> > >
> > > Stephanie Silberstein: Writer, Author, Thinker - the official
> > homepage
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message ----
> > > From: Michael Lee <mikelee.home@>
> > > To: nathaniel_branden@yahoogroups.com
> > > Sent: Friday, May 4, 2007 12:10:46 AM
> > > Subject: RE: [nathaniel_branden] on objectivist self-torture
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Mr Rael asks a great question:
> > >
> > > > What part of Rand's thinking, specifically, was deleterious,
in
> > your
> > > > opinion?
> > >
> > > I would love to see some thoughtful, specific answers in this
> > forum to this
> > > question.
> > >
> > > <snip>
> > >
> > > In my life, Rand was an intellectual terrorista. She's the
> > Tarantino of
> > > philosophy: the conversion of the conventionally evil to the
> > righteous, the
> > > Ezekiel 25:17 sense of vengeance and redemption, the sympathy
for
> > people who
> > > are confused and aren't making it in the world they're
supposed to
> > thrive
> > > in.
> > >
> > > On balance, way overbalanced, Rand helped me, not harmed me.
> > >
> > > Mike Lee
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