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Lower Back Pain Treatment?   Message List  
Reply | Forward Message #126 of 599 |
Re: [magnotherapy] Re: Lower Back Pain Treatment?

In a message dated 6/24/02 10:57:21 AM Eastern Daylight Time, JBainSI@...
writes:


>
> I can see why you conclude that, Bob, the right hand and arm does seem to
> warm up first at the side nearest the magnet.
> But if you look at the other sequence, which I think was a Nikken device on
>
> the arm, just above the elbow, you will see both hands warming at the same
> rate.
> Now the Nikken products are not the same strength, so I would not expect
> the
> field penetration you would get with your products, and the hands are feet
> away from the magnets.
> This suggests to me that the effect is not due to direct action by the
> magnetic field on the hands, but by an effect on the blood which travels to
>
> the hands as part of normal blood circulation.
>
> We could prove it by watching the effects with the arms outstretched, and
> the
> hands 4 feet apart, and see if the effect is the same.
>
> Best wishes
>

Something about your conclusion about the Nikken test doesn't make sense. If
the blood passing the Nikken, or any magnet, is somehow affected so that it
travels to the other hand and causes the observed warming, why didn't it warm
the entire arm and the entire body as it circulated through the body to the
other hand. Blood does not flow directly from one arm to the opposite hand.
It circulates throughout the body. That is why the only thing that does
makes sense is that the radiating magnetic field is causing the right hand to
warm up in the theramagnet sequence. There is no difference to the human
body between being near a strong magnetic field or wearing the magnet causing
the magnetic field, except for a slight difference in field strength measured
at the skin surface. Touching the magnet does not create some kind of magic.
That is why magnets have worked when worn on the outside of one's clothing.


Though I don't know what actually caused the other hand to warm up, I suspect
something else occurred. Possibly the other hand was used to hold the magnet
in place for part of the time and thus had a reaction or the magnet had been
held in that hand before being applied to the other elbow, etc.

Bob Vanson, VP
Theramagnets.com Ltd.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




Mon Jun 24, 2002 5:29 pm

BVanson@...
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Message #126 of 599 |
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In a message dated 6/23/02 2:24:53 PM Eastern Daylight Time, phunkc@... ... That is correct. Only one magnet on the left hand and none on the right. This...
BVanson@...
Send Email
Jun 24, 2002
4:52 pm

In a message dated 6/24/02 10:57:21 AM Eastern Daylight Time, JBainSI@... ... Something about your conclusion about the Nikken test doesn't make sense. If...
BVanson@...
Send Email
Jun 24, 2002
5:29 pm

In respect to bilateral perfusion seen in unilateral application of an MF may indicate a neurovascular effect where the symmetrical vasodilation is not from...
phunkc@...
alwaysmilli
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Jun 24, 2002
6:11 pm

Our tests of refrigerator type and other multi-pole magnet designs, currently being marketed, show that the magnetic field is concentrated along the surface of...
phunkc@...
alwaysmilli
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Jun 24, 2002
6:16 pm

... Because it isn't that simple. And only the hands were really cold and were the focus of attention. Any effect would only be noticed there. ... Agreed. ... ...
JBainSI@...
jbainsi
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Jun 25, 2002
12:07 am

... Yup, could be, but a simpler explanation might be the breakdown of the long 'coin-roll' structures of red blood cells. I have heard of work being done in...
JBainSI@...
jbainsi
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Jun 25, 2002
12:07 am

... currently ... depth ... You are assuming a mechanism. Perhaps the field does not have to reach several inches below the skin. ... I have, Holcomb's work,...
JBainSI@...
jbainsi
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Jun 25, 2002
12:07 am

I know many alternative practitioners that are looking at that process with dark field photography...but blood is not as simple as it seems. The correct ...
phunkc@...
alwaysmilli
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Jun 25, 2002
12:30 am

I have Holcomb's studies as well as many, many others...Steep field gradients are the key. Have you read through the entire content of these studies? I am ...
phunkc@...
alwaysmilli
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Jun 25, 2002
12:37 am

In a message dated 6/24/02 2:13:16 PM Eastern Daylight Time, phunkc@... ... Sorry, but I see that explanation as a stretch. For that to happen, the ...
BVanson@...
Send Email
Jun 25, 2002
4:00 am

In a message dated 6/24/02 2:16:43 PM Eastern Daylight Time, phunkc@... ... You can't change the laws of physics by which if you place a north pole along ...
BVanson@...
Send Email
Jun 25, 2002
4:19 am

In a message dated 6/24/02 8:08:05 PM Eastern Daylight Time, JBainSI@... ... BUT WHAT IF IT DOES! Then the "monopole" is the best design choice. Bob...
BVanson@...
Send Email
Jun 25, 2002
4:32 am

... Quite agree, and one suggestion is that the MF is buffering the pH. Magnotherapy the pHacts, MVDr Vladislav Vaclevec, ISBN 0 9535970 0 8 And we have...
JBainSI@...
jbainsi
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Jun 25, 2002
8:49 am

... Because it also happens with a much weaker Nikken magnet at a much greater distance from the hands. Nope, a CNS or blood or Qi explanation seems more...
JBainSI@...
jbainsi
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Jun 25, 2002
8:50 am

... I don't have access to a research library other than via the internet, so I have mainly abstracts and a limited number of full text studies. And of course...
JBainSI@...
jbainsi
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Jun 25, 2002
8:50 am

... Sagan: "The reliance on carefully designed and controlled experiments is key, as I tried to stress earlier. We will not learn much from mere contemplation....
JBainSI@...
jbainsi
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Jun 25, 2002
8:50 am

To all, Obviously this discussion group is not about science and research but a push for the '"monopole" magnetic devices that you list yourselves as...
phunkc@...
alwaysmilli
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Jun 25, 2002
10:03 am

No truer words have been said...thank you John! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]...
phunkc@...
alwaysmilli
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Jun 25, 2002
11:48 am

Sorry, but I see that explanation as a stretch. For that to happen, the neurovascular effect would have to follow some kind of symmetry to only affect the...
phunkc@...
alwaysmilli
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Jun 25, 2002
4:43 pm

... I am not a 'monopole' salesman, the devices I use are multipole. I state distributor in my sig to ensure there no-one is unaware of possible bias. There...
JBainSI@...
jbainsi
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Jun 25, 2002
7:03 pm

There are studies to compare the monopole and multipole systems. This area is and has been studied, and the facts are clear including the mathematical models...
phunkc@...
alwaysmilli
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Jun 25, 2002
7:11 pm

The unfortunate thing about using this monopole and multipole for showing one or more magnetic poles toward the tissue to be treated is that it is confusing to...
Stefan
SEngstrom
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Jun 29, 2002
4:33 pm

... Can you provide references? I haven't seen a direct comparison of the efficacy of monopole amd multipole systems. And you will find some dispute on the...
JBainSI@...
jbainsi
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Jun 25, 2002
8:22 pm

Stefan I would be most interested in this type of information; it has been my understanding that since the human body is supposedly 'transparent' to magnetic...
tfleming1@...
tonyfleming_...
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Jun 30, 2002
6:10 am

Tony - The human body as such does not attenuate the field but distance from the magnet does make the field decrease. When you are sufficiently far away from a...
Stefan
SEngstrom
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Jul 1, 2002
3:07 pm

I guess I better rephrase that request: can you give some data regarding penetration distance in human tissues for some actual (commercially available)...
tfleming1@...
tonyfleming_...
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Jun 30, 2002
6:28 am

If I take one of my neodymium magnets and place it in the palm of someones hand, and then take a second one and rotate it under that same hand, the one in the...
Theramagnets.com Ltd.
sales@...
Send Email
Jun 30, 2002
12:52 pm

Thanks Marrlyn, very interesting. Can you give any idea of the drop off in field/flux strength? Is this just due to the dipolar structure flanging outwards...
tfleming1@...
tonyfleming_...
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Jun 30, 2002
1:57 pm

I honestly don't know. I just know that this is what happens. I leave the why's and wherefores to you more scientific types. My partner, Bob Vanson, might...
Theramagnets.com Ltd.
sales@...
Send Email
Jul 1, 2002
12:44 pm

Stefan many thanks From my point of view then, I guess it's safe to model the human body as 'transparent'. Do you know of any contemporary studies of either...
tfleming1@...
tonyfleming_...
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Jul 1, 2002
11:20 pm
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