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#47 From: "billstew" <billstew@...>
Date: Wed Dec 19, 2001 1:50 am
Subject: MRI of sex ... (2000)
billstew
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At http://www.bmj.com/cgi/content/full/319/7225/1596
you can view MRI images of sexual intercourse performed in the
Netherlands along with the scientific commentary.

This is the (in)famous penis=boomerang study, but IMHO that's the
least interesting part of it.

For me the most interesting part of the paper was the following
discussion relating to the filling of the women's bladder during
intercourse:

"Changes during sexual arousal Magnetic resonance imaging showed
strikingly that during female sexual arousal changes occurred in the
anterior vaginal wall. These changes took place in the vaginal wall
itself (the engorgement as such is not visible on the images),
through the raising of the uterus, displacement of the uterus caused
by penetration of the penis, and through gradual filling of the
bladder. Histological studies 11 12 and immunohistochemistry13 have
shown that the anterior wall of the vagina has denser innervation
than the posterior wall. This is supported by clinical studies 14 15
and research into vaginal sensitivity to electric stimuli16 in which
the anterior vaginal wallwith the urethra behind itwas found to be
relatively sensitive. Hoch's concept of a clitoral-vaginal sensory
arm of the orgasmic reflex refers specifically to the anterior
vaginal wall and the deeper tissuesthe urinary bladder, the
periurethral tissues, and Halban's fascia15and our images support
this."

Best,

Zeno
(from another list)

#45 From: Dana <kali_durga7@...>
Date: Wed Apr 4, 2001 7:44 pm
Subject: Kegel Research Paper
kali_durga7@...
Send Email Send Email
 
hi, i thought i would send my final research paper, post it on the
site.
for some reason when i cut and paste, it
any questions? comments? e mail me back.

peace and happy kegeling :)
dana

>

The Pubococcygeus Muscle:
Urinary Incontinence, Uterus Prolapse, Labor, Sexual Dysfunction, and
Orgasm


In the 1940’s Arnold H. Kegel, MD, a surgeon and gynecologist from
California, was trying to help older patients who could not retain
their urine. Previously, the only way of addressing this condition was
with surgical repair (Alexander, 138).  Dr. Kegel developed a technique
that exercised the pubococcygeus muscle and found these exercises could
prevent a lot of unnecessary female surgery.
The pubococcygeus muscle is one of the most important muscles in the
body.
This figure-8 muscle encircles the dorsal of the clitoris, the base of
the urinary bladder, the vaginal opening, as well as, the rectum
(Danforth, 56). The pelvic floor muscle is more like a hammock than a
floor, supporting the pelvic cavity.  The muscles functions are
involved in urinating,  pregnancy, orgasm and sexual intercourse.
Many women are not aware of the pubococcygeus muscle.  The easiest way
to locate the muscle is by stopping the flow of urine midstream.
Whenever urinating the flow of urine should be stopped and started
several times (Sloane, 50).  After awareness of the muscle is
established, the exercises can be practiced outside of urination.  To
practice Kegels, the pubococcygeus muscles should be contracted for 2
to 3 seconds and repeated 10 times.  The seconds held can be gradually
worked up to 10 seconds and there are no limits to the sets that can be
repeated.  Many women find it easiest to do lying down.   It is,
however, possible and even encouraged to practice kegels anywhere as
they are undetectable (AMA, 238).  Practiced consistently, a few times
a day, in proper form, results should be noticed within a month.
It is important to practice Kegels correctly, or the beneficial effect
will not be seen.  Furthermore, just like working any other muscle, the
exercises need to be performed regularly for results.  Kegels will not
work if abdominal, thigh or buttock muscles are being contracted at the
same time.  To make sure the muscle is being practiced correctly, Dr.
Northrup, MD, author of Women’s Bodies, Women’s Wisdom,  advises to
begin practicing using two fingers inside the vagina in order to feel
the muscles contract around the fingers.  At the same time, the other
hand should be placed on the lower abdomen to make sure it is not being
contracted (Northrup, 322).
Vaginal barbells or cones produce faster and more dramatic results, as
strength resistance works any other muscle.  They also make sure the
correct muscles are being contracted, as the vagina will have something
to clamp down on. There are cones made specifically for women with
urinary incontinence.  The cone weight should be increased over time.
(Northrup, 253). Other devices have two to four springs inside and as
the vagina gains increased strength, more springs can be closed.  Due
to the large statistical evidence of effectiveness, some of these
devices are now insurance reimbursable.
Dr. Kegel found that strengthening the pubococcygeus muscle is
effective in preventing and healing involuntary loss of urine.  The
reason is that when the PC muscle is lax, the pelvic organs press down
putting pressure on the bladder.  Kegel exercises also strengthen the
muscles surrounding the urinary opening, giving better control of the
opening and closing of the urethra (Danforth, 975).
Under the slightest physical stress, such as sneezing, laughing or
running, certain women experience an involuntary loss of urine.
Urinary stress incontinence, the involuntary loss of urine, is one of
the most common and also distressing urologic problems that face women
(Shephard, 178).  Incontinence is often caused by relaxation of the
muscles that surround the bladder and urethra.  Often occurring in
women who have had several births, the condition worsens with age
(Derbisnire, 85).
After childbirth, the fibers of the PC muscles are stretched or torn
and no longer meet around the base of the bladder.  Then, even the
slightest abdominal pressure pushes against the bladder and results in
a release of urine that can no longer be controlled by the lax muscles.
  This annoying and embarrassing condition afflicts millions of women
(Sloane, 50).  According to Dr. Northrup, 30 to 50 percent of women
will experience urinary incontinence from time to time.
Even though so many women suffer from incontinence, few talk to their
doctors about the problem.  In one study, Dr. Burgio, coauthor of
Staying Dry: A Practical Guide to Bladder Control, found that only 25
percent of women who suffer from incontinence talked to their doctor.
And oftentimes, these women have had incontinence for 12 to 20 years
(Foley, 225).
Women outnumber men five to one in incontinence.  In a survey of 326
gynecology patients at the University of Michigan, 47 percent of women
were found to be reporting stress incontinence. Also, 31 percent of
pre-menopausal women, younger than forty, had some sort of
incontinence.  Incontinence, however, is not a disease; it is a
symptom.  If the woman suffering from incontinence, is not found to
have a urinary infection, or any other malfunction, incontinence can be
addressed as a lax in the pelvic muscles, which is can be easily
restored.
Pelvic relaxation, or the loss of support by the pelvic muscles, leads
to stress incontinence.  Most surgical treatments are aimed at
restoring the integrity of the PC muscles to surround the urethra.
Kegel exercises can alleviate and even cure many that would otherwise
resort to surgery.  Women with mild urinary incontinence have been
shown to have very positive results by strengthening their PC muscles.
Kegel exercises strengthen the muscles that surround the openings of
the urethra, vagina and anus, preventing leaking of urine and
rebuilding pelvic support  (AMA, 234).  The more firmly toned the
pubococcygeus muscle is, the more a woman is able to avoid urinary
problems (Thompson, 1451).   Incontinence, therefore, is very
treatable.
Dr. Whitmore says that 50 percent of incontinent people can be cured,
while 30 percent greatly improve.  Other studies show even more
dramatic results. When done properly and consistently, Kegels have been
found to help 75 percent of women to overcome urinary incontinence.
In his initial studies, Dr. Kegel reported 90% improvement in stress
incontinence among 455 women trained with this method. Although Kegel
exercises don’t cure every type of incontinence they are worth doing
before resorting to surgery.  Developing strong PC muscles not just
prevents incontinence but increases the blood supply to the pelvis
making the urinary tract more resistant to infection (Northrup, 322).
	 The pubococcygeus muscles make up the pelvic floor, making them vital
in the holding of the pelvic organs in their anatomically correct
positions.  The pelvic organs: the uterus, bladder, urethra, rectum and
vagina, are held in place by ligaments and muscles.  These supporting
tissues are attached to the sides of the pelvis and the opening of the
urethra, vagina and rectum.  If these muscles lose strength they slack,
causing the uterus or bladder to sag (AMA, 234). This overall condition
is called pelvic relaxation.
	 When the pelvic floor can no longer support the pelvic organs, the
ligaments that used to hold the uterus in place weaken, allowing the
uterus to sag, and eventually fall or prolapse into the vagina. This
shortens the vagina and pulls the bladder backwards (Whitney, 330).
This can be accompanied by a falling of the bladder or rectum.
	 The first signs of pelvic relaxation is stress incontinence. Once the
muscles become even more lax, the uterus starts to fall and produces a
heavy feeling in the vagina, creating uterine prolapse. This condition
is both preventable and treatable (Our Bodies, Ourselves, 597).
	 Most women who have given birth have some degree of uterine prolapse
(Shephard, 177).  The reason for this is that during childbirth the
ligaments supporting the uterus become stretched and weakened sometimes
to the point where the uterus drops (Thompson, 274).
	 Uterine prolapse in mild cases can be symptom less.  Common symptoms
include frequent and painful urination, lower back pain, and pressure
on the vagina which is relieved when lying down (Thompson, 714).
	 Treatment of uterine prolapse in the past included the use of a
pessary, a ring placed inside the vagina to keep the uterus in its
correct position.  The rubber ring needs to be removed and cleaned by a
gynecologist every two months  (Danforth, 950).  In cases of uterine
prolapse hysterectomies are sometimes performed, usually in older women
(Whitney, 333).
The best way to prevent pelvic relaxation and uterine prolapse is to
regularly practice Kegel exercises.  Kegel exercises strengthen the
pelvic floor that supports the pelvic organs.  Strengthening these
muscles keeps the organs in place prevent pelvic relaxation and
prolapse of the uterus.
A third area in which the Kegel exercises are important is in
childbirth.  By strengthening the pelvic floor, discomfort is reduced
and the pelvic organs can return to place more easily after birth.
Kegel exercises strengthen and tone the musculature of the pelvic area
in a way that can make vaginal delivery during childbirth easier.
During delivery, the mother who has developed strong pubococcygeus
muscle control is able to release the muscle greatly diminishing the
possibility of rectocele, prolapse of the rectum, or cystocele,
prolapse of the bladder into the vaginal walls, both common
aftereffects of pregnancy that require surgery to recover.
Kegel exercises give control over the pelvic muscles.  Doctors and
midwives counsel women to practice kegels because they provide the
ability to relax the muscles used in childbirth, alleviating discomfort
and reducing risk of tearing  (Foley, 83).   Kegel exercises help keep
the stretched vaginal muscles toned after birth.  According to Dr.
Barnaby Barratt, "… kegeling improves the flow of blood to the vagina,
and for any woman who gets pregnant, it's a way to recover the
elasticity of the vaginal canal."
Practicing kegel exercises prevents and helps in healing sexual
dysfunction. Vaginismus, the third most common cause of sexual
dysfunction in women, involves an involuntary tightening of the muscles
surrounding the opening of the vagina and the outer one third of the
vagina, preventing penetration.  The consequence is painful, if any,
sexual intercourse.  Although some sources claim it has a psychological
basis sexual functioning can be recovered using Kegel exercises.  By
voluntarily tightening and releasing the pelvis muscles, the woman is
given control over the vaginal muscles (Foley, 432).  There has been
shown an 83% of women in one study that reported less pain in sixteen
weeks by progressively learning to relax and rehabilitate the pelvic
muscles.  Dyspareunia, a condition where sex is accompanied by pain has
also been shown to be alleviated by kegel exercises. By giving women
control over their vaginal muscles, they can learn to relax the muscles
(Northrup, 314).
Dr. Arnold Kegel first developed kegels for controlling stress
incontinence in women. After several months of monitoring his patients,
Dr. Kegel found that some women reported having experienced their first
experience of orgasm. Consequently, he found his patients were
experiencing greater frequency and intensity of orgasm.  Kegel
exercises resulted in increased control of the vaginal walls producing
the rhythmic contraction necessary in attaining orgasm. His work proved
that strengthening of the pubococcygeus muscle improved sexual response
and contributed to the attainment of orgasm.  Research has since
demonstrated that this muscle contains specialized nerve endings which
contribute to a satisfactory sexual experience.
According to Betty Dodson, Ph.D., author of Sex for One and sexologist,
  “Orgasm and the PC muscles are related. There is no doubt about that.
The stronger the muscles, the stronger the orgasm.”  Dr. Dodson has
taught thousands of women to increase their orgasmic capacity by
strengthening their PC muscles.  She is coming out with a product
called Betty Dodson’s Vaginal Barbell, a device used in practicing
kegel exercises.
The Midwest Institute of Sexology teaches Kegels as an exercise that
improves capacity for sexual pleasure.   They explain that the health
of the pubococcygeus muscles play a vital role in sexual arousal and
climax.  Every female orgasm involves a vaginal contraction.
Consequently, the PC is the major muscle involved in contraction during
female orgasm.  Women with strong and healthy pelvic muscles are not
just less prone to vaginal problems, but they have more fulfilling
sexual functioning (Northrup, 252). Practicing kegel exercises
increases stimulation and lubrication production.
Kegel exercises help preorgasmic women as well as women who are able to
achieve orgasm with direct clitoral stimulation but not during
intercourse not involving direct clitoral contact.  But, according to
Dr. Barnaby Barratt, “For all women, kegeling improves the quality of
orgasmic responsiveness and intensifies and strengthens orgasmic
capacities.”
Strengthening and gaining control over the pubococcygeus muscle
enhances and intensifies orgasm with oneself as well as with a partner.
Kegel exercises are advocated for improved sexual relations between
couples due to the increased ability of the vaginal sphincter to
contract around the penis during intercourse (Sloane, 50).
Margo Anand, Tantra educator and author of The Art of Sexual Ecstasy,
teaches kegel exercises as a technique for enhancing sexual pleasure
and intimacy.  She teaches the strengthening of the PC muscle benefits
intercourse by being able to hold the penis more tightly.  During
orgasm, the pubococcygeus muscle naturally rhythmically contracts.  By
becoming more conscious and in control of the muscle it is possible to
slow down orgasm, prolonging the pleasurable experience.
Her exercise technique is called the PC pump.  When practicing the PC
pump, women rhythmically contract and release the pelvic muscles in
short intervals (Anand, 178).  During intercourse the woman can draw
the penis deeper into the vagina and create rhythmic contractions
without moving by using the muscles inside the vaginal canal.  With
increased control these muscles can move like a wave, comparable to
fingers milking a cow. (Thompson, 1451)  In high levels of tantric
practice, it is possible to have intercourse while completely still,
the inner muscles doing all the movement.  There are no limits to the
abilities of the pelvic muscle.
The pubococcygeus muscle is vital in a woman’s healthy functioning.
The PC muscle which surrounds the clitoral dorsal, the urinary bladder,
the vaginal and anal opening, is crucial in the functioning of all
these organs. The pelvic muscle also provides a pelvic floor, holding
the pelvic organs in place.  When week or torn due to age or pregnancy,
urinary incontinence, uterus or rectal prolapse, sexual dysfunction and
preorgasmia can occur.
On the other hand, strong pelvic muscles increases blood supply to the
pelvis making the urinary organs more resistant to infection.  Strong
pelvic muscles also contribute to a healthy labor and faster recovery
thereafter. Strengthening of the pubococcygeus muscles also contributes
to heightened orgasmic capacity and enhances sexual functioning.
Practicing Kegels contributes to a person’s overall health.  Kegel
exercises, according to Dr. Northrup, should be part of every woman’s
health care routine.  Although not discussed in traditional exercise
and fitness models, the pubococcygeus muscle is a muscle like any other
and in order to function, needs to be exercised (Alexander, 137).  It
is unfortunate that millions of women are not informed on how to care
for their bodies and inevitably suffer and resort to unnecessary
surgery  (Northrup, 323).  Through educating ourselves we can learn
that our bodies are worthy of our ongoing respect and care.

Bibliography

Alexander, LaRosa, Bader.  New Dimensions in Women’s Health.  Boston:
Jones and
Bartlett Publishers Inc, 2001.

American Medical Association.  Complete Guide to Women’s Health.  New
York:
Random House, 1996.

Anand, Margo.  The Art of Sexual Ecstasy.  New York: Penguin Putnam
Inc, 1989.

Baron-Faust, Rita.  Being Female: What Every Woman Should Know about
Gynecological Health. New York: Quill, 1998.

Boston Women’s Health Book Collective,  The New Our Bodies, Ourselves.
Simon and  Schuster: 1992.

Danforth, David (editor).  Obstetrics and Gynecology.  Harper and Row:
1982.

Derbyshire, Caroline.  The New Woman’s Guide to Health and Medicine.
New York:
Appleton-Centry-Crofts, 1980.

Dodson, Betty Ph.D.  Sex for One: The Joy of Selfloving. New York:
Three Rivers Press,
1996.

Dodson, Betty: phone conversation and e-mail.

Foley D., Nechas E.  Woman’s Encyclopedia of Health and Emotional
Healing.
Pennsylvania: Rodale Press, 1993.

Kegel, Arnold H.  Exercise in the Treatment of Genital Relaxation,
Urinary Stress
Incontinence and Sexual Dysfunction.  Chicago: Year Book Medical
Publishers, 1965.

Northrup, Christiane M.D.  Women’s Bodies, Women’s Wisdom.  New York:
Bantam,
	 1998.

Shephard, Bruce and Carroll M.D.  The Complete Guide to Women’s Health.
  Florida:
Marinor Publishing Co, 1982.

Sloane, H.  Biology of Women.  New York: Wiley Medical Publication,
1980.


Thompson, Douglas M.D.  Every Woman’s Health.  New York: Simon and
Schuster,
1993.

Whitney, Lauerson M.D.  It’s Your Body: A Woman’s Guide to Gynecology.
New
York:  Grossett and Dunlap, 1977.








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#44 From: Kali7Durga@...
Date: Tue Mar 27, 2001 2:17 pm
Subject: Love Muscle Research Paper, please respond....
Kali7Durga@...
Send Email Send Email
 
Hi. I'm so excited to have found this group.

I'm very interested in Kegels and the pubococcogeus muscles.
In fact i'm currently writing a 10-15 page research paper for my Women's Health
class on Kegels and the pelvic floor muscles in relation with urinary
incontinence, uterine collapse, unneccessary hysterectomies, pregnancy and the
pelvic floor,  and the sexual advantages to having strong vaginal muscles...

so basically my outline is to first describe the pelvic muscles and say that
kegels strengthen those muscles, to say how incontinence is really common (due
to age, births etc) and how uterine prolapse happens, how most hysterectomies
are unneccessary, how doing kegels is important for pregnancy, and the wonderful
things strengthening your pc muscles can do to your orgasm/s.

i probably will focus mostly on incontinence and orgasm/sex.

I found a lot of information but i was wondering if anyone had anything to
contribute (especially backed up stats etc.) and i was looking for arnold
kegel's article, if anyone knows how/where i can access those.

Thanks, and what is the kegel 2000?

Dana

#43 From: Kali7Durga@...
Date: Mon Mar 26, 2001 11:21 pm
Subject: Love Muscle Research Paper, please respond....
Kali7Durga@...
Send Email Send Email
 
Hi. I'm so excited to have found this group.  

I'm very interested in Kegels and the pubococcogeus muscles.  
In fact i'm currently writing a 10-15 page research paper for my Women's
Health class  on Kegels and the pelvic floor muscles in relation with urinary
incontinence, uterine collapse, unneccessary hysterectomies, pregnancy and
the pelvic floor,  and the sexual advantages to having strong vaginal
muscles...

so basically my outline is to first describe the pelvic muscles and say that
kegels strengthen those muscles, to say how incontinence is really common
(due to age, births etc) and how uterine prolapse happens, how most
hysterectomies are unneccessary, how doing kegels is important for pregnancy,
and the wonderful things strengthening your pc muscles can do to your
orgasm/s.

i probably will focus mostly on incontinence and orgasm/sex.

I found a lot of information but i was wondering if anyone had anything to
contribute (especially backed up stats etc.)  and i was looking for arnold
kegel's article, if anyone knows how/where i can access those.

Thanks, and what is the kegel 2000?

Dana

#42 From: Doris Bryant <dbryant_07079@...>
Date: Tue Mar 27, 2001 1:26 am
Subject: Re: question about kegel
dbryant_07079@...
Send Email Send Email
 
--- cheng@... wrote:
> if i very good in kegel.Can I use this in bed in
> intercourse? Like
> Can i use this to tease my man ?give him more
> please? Can i make him
> easy to lose control? or slow him down?
>
> Yes.  You can use kegels to drive your man crazy.
You can suck him up in you like a vacuum if you
exercise enough and get your muscles really strong.
My husband loves it when I squeeze my muscles tight
around him and then let go.  It makes him crazy.  He
can't get enough.
>
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#41 From: cheng@...
Date: Mon Mar 26, 2001 2:53 am
Subject: question about the kegel
cheng@...
Send Email Send Email
 
if i doing very good in kegel.Can I use this in bed? tease my man in
intercourse? can I give him more pleasure? make him lose control? or
make him slow down?

#40 From: cheng@...
Date: Mon Mar 26, 2001 3:26 am
Subject: question about kegel
cheng@...
Send Email Send Email
 
if i very good in kegel.Can I use this in bed in intercourse? Like
Can i use this to tease my man ?give him more please? Can i make him
easy to lose control? or slow him down?

#39 From: dbryant_07079@...
Date: Thu Feb 1, 2001 3:43 am
Subject: Re: Fwd: Springs
dbryant_07079@...
Send Email Send Email
 
--- In kegels@y..., Sandy Allen <april@c...> wrote:
> I think some of the examples in the brochure are extreme cases and
probably
> are un-achieveable to the 'normal' vagina.  However, I am happy to
have
> become as strong as I have with this product.  Once I'm completely
able to
> close all 4 springs easily, I will probably try to find stronger
springs
> just so I can keep up and see just how strong I can get.
>
> Sandy
>
>
> >>How many springs comes with the pelvic toner.  I keep reading
messages about 4.  I only received two with mine.  Are you supposed
to hear it click when you close it?  I don't hear anything so I don't
know if I'm able to close it or not.  What examples are you referring
to in the brochure. I got a small flyer with instructions on using
the pelvic toner and that is it.  I didn't get any brochure where
they are giving example of people's results.

> >>I'll ask the question again, in simpler form: Do you need the
second
> >>(stronger) set of springs in order to achieve the more dramatic
guarantees
> >>in the KM-2000 brochure? Thank you for your answer!
> >> 		 bloberfe@s...
>
>
>
**********************************************************************
***
> 	 EAST COAST TELECOMMUNICATIONS
> Complete Internet Marketing Service  Connecting Your Business to
the World!
> 6610 Jarvis Road 	     For Additional Info Contact:
> Sarasota, Florida 34241 	     Sandy Allen
> (941) 921-2137 	    	     april@c...
> Member of HTML Writer's Guild      http://www.gate.net/~april

>
**********************************************************************
***

#38 From: dbryant_07079@...
Date: Thu Feb 1, 2001 3:51 am
Subject: Pelvictoner
dbryant_07079@...
Send Email Send Email
 
Hi everyone,

I just received my pelvictoner today but I only received 2 springs.
I thought that it was supposed to come with four.  How do you know if
you are able to close one spring.  When I try one spring I don't hear
any clicking so I don't know if I am able to close it or not.  Also
I've read some of the comments that people have made about it and
they have made references to examples in the brochure.  What
brochure?  I didn't receive any brochure.  I only received a flyer
instructing me on how to insert it.

#37 From: Sandy Allen <sallen11@...>
Date: Fri Jul 28, 2000 4:35 pm
Subject: Re: Digest Number 0
sallen11@...
Send Email Send Email
 
Yes, they are now available on the order page at
https://www.securewebshopping.com/kegelmaster2000/order.htm

Sandy

At 07:31 AM 7/27/00 -0400, you wrote:
>Are the stronger springs NOW available?????
>I've been waiting for about a YEAR for them to be available.
>Also, has a smaller sized kegel master been designed and produced yet?
>This one is way too difficult to get out and I often do not have time to
>wait 5-10 minutes until my body relaxes enough to "release" it....trying
>to break the suction it creates is painful!
>
>kegels@egroups.com wrote:
>
>> There are 2 messages in this issue.
>>
>> Topics in this digest:
>>
>>       1. test
>>            From: Dan Kegel <dank@...>
>>       2. Re: Fwd: Springs
>>            From: Sandy Allen <april@...>
>>
>> ________________________________________________________________________
>> ________________________________________________________________________
>>
>> Message: 1
>>    Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 08:31:47 -0700
>>    From: Dan Kegel <dank@...>
>> Subject: test
>>
>> Is this list still alive?
>> - Dan
>>
>> ________________________________________________________________________
>> ________________________________________________________________________
>>
>> Message: 2
>>    Date: Mon, 03 Apr 2000 17:31:45 -0400
>>    From: Sandy Allen <april@...>
>> Subject: Re: Fwd: Springs
>>
>> I think some of the examples in the brochure are extreme cases and probably
>> are un-achieveable to the 'normal' vagina.  However, I am happy to have
>> become as strong as I have with this product.  Once I'm completely able to
>> close all 4 springs easily, I will probably try to find stronger springs
>> just so I can keep up and see just how strong I can get.
>>
>> Sandy
>>
>> >>
>> >>I'll ask the question again, in simpler form: Do you need the second
>> >>(stronger) set of springs in order to achieve the more dramatic
guarantees
>> >>in the KM-2000 brochure? Thank you for your answer!
>> >>                              bloberfe@...
>>
>> *************************************************************************
>>                 EAST COAST TELECOMMUNICATIONS
>> Complete Internet Marketing Service  Connecting Your Business to the World!
>> 6610 Jarvis Road                     For Additional Info Contact:
>> Sarasota, Florida 34241              Sandy Allen
>> (941) 921-2137                       april@...
>> Member of HTML Writer's Guild        http://www.gate.net/~april
>> *************************************************************************
>>
>> ________________________________________________________________________
>> ________________________________________________________________________
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

#36 From: Starfire33 <starfire@...>
Date: Thu Jul 27, 2000 11:31 am
Subject: Re: Digest Number 0
starfire@...
Send Email Send Email
 
Are the stronger springs NOW available?????
I've been waiting for about a YEAR for them to be available.
Also, has a smaller sized kegel master been designed and produced yet?
This one is way too difficult to get out and I often do not have time to
wait 5-10 minutes until my body relaxes enough to "release" it....trying
to break the suction it creates is painful!

kegels@egroups.com wrote:

> There are 2 messages in this issue.
>
> Topics in this digest:
>
>       1. test
>            From: Dan Kegel <dank@...>
>       2. Re: Fwd: Springs
>            From: Sandy Allen <april@...>
>
> ________________________________________________________________________
> ________________________________________________________________________
>
> Message: 1
>    Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 08:31:47 -0700
>    From: Dan Kegel <dank@...>
> Subject: test
>
> Is this list still alive?
> - Dan
>
> ________________________________________________________________________
> ________________________________________________________________________
>
> Message: 2
>    Date: Mon, 03 Apr 2000 17:31:45 -0400
>    From: Sandy Allen <april@...>
> Subject: Re: Fwd: Springs
>
> I think some of the examples in the brochure are extreme cases and probably
> are un-achieveable to the 'normal' vagina.  However, I am happy to have
> become as strong as I have with this product.  Once I'm completely able to
> close all 4 springs easily, I will probably try to find stronger springs
> just so I can keep up and see just how strong I can get.
>
> Sandy
>
> >>
> >>I'll ask the question again, in simpler form: Do you need the second
> >>(stronger) set of springs in order to achieve the more dramatic guarantees
> >>in the KM-2000 brochure? Thank you for your answer!
> >>                              bloberfe@...
>
> *************************************************************************
>                 EAST COAST TELECOMMUNICATIONS
> Complete Internet Marketing Service  Connecting Your Business to the World!
> 6610 Jarvis Road                     For Additional Info Contact:
> Sarasota, Florida 34241              Sandy Allen
> (941) 921-2137                       april@...
> Member of HTML Writer's Guild        http://www.gate.net/~april
> *************************************************************************
>
> ________________________________________________________________________
> ________________________________________________________________________

#35 From: Sandy Allen <april@...>
Date: Mon Apr 3, 2000 9:31 pm
Subject: Re: Fwd: Springs
april@...
Send Email Send Email
 
I think some of the examples in the brochure are extreme cases and probably
are un-achieveable to the 'normal' vagina.  However, I am happy to have
become as strong as I have with this product.  Once I'm completely able to
close all 4 springs easily, I will probably try to find stronger springs
just so I can keep up and see just how strong I can get.

Sandy


>>
>>I'll ask the question again, in simpler form: Do you need the second
>>(stronger) set of springs in order to achieve the more dramatic guarantees
>>in the KM-2000 brochure? Thank you for your answer!
>> 		 bloberfe@...


*************************************************************************
		 EAST COAST TELECOMMUNICATIONS
Complete Internet Marketing Service  Connecting Your Business to the World!
6610 Jarvis Road 	     For Additional Info Contact:
Sarasota, Florida 34241 	     Sandy Allen
(941) 921-2137 	    	     april@...
Member of HTML Writer's Guild      http://www.gate.net/~april
*************************************************************************

#34 From: Dan Kegel <dank@...>
Date: Tue Jul 25, 2000 3:31 pm
Subject: test
dank@...
Send Email Send Email
 
Is this list still alive?
- Dan

#33 From: starfire@...
Date: Fri Mar 31, 2000 6:26 pm
Subject: Re: kegelmaster
starfire@...
Send Email Send Email
 
loberfeld <bloberf-@...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/kegels/?start=28
> Has anybody felt the need to order the second (stronger) set of
springs?
> Does it make a difference? Has anyone succeeded with them? (I won't
even
> ask about a third set!)  bloberfe@...
>

Yes, I asked a while ago and was told they are not being made right now.
I am using 4 springs (started with 2 or 3 though)...
my problem is the size....I wanted them to make a smaller one.
I find this extremely difficult to get out at the end of the session.
I have to relax and wait at least 5-15 minutes until I can remove it.
That makes me reluctant to use it (time restraint - and *pain* if I
try to force it out)...
Does anyone else experience this???

#32 From: Loberfeld <bloberfe@...>
Date: Tue Mar 28, 2000 1:45 am
Subject: Springs
bloberfe@...
Send Email Send Email
 
I'll ask the question again, in simpler form: Do you need the second
(stronger) set of springs in order to achieve the more dramatic guarantees
in the KM-2000 brochure? Thank you for your answer!
				 bloberfe@...

#31 From: "Willa Bradshaw" <willabradshaw@...>
Date: Thu Mar 23, 2000 4:45 pm
Subject: Re: Is there anyone in this group?
willabradshaw@...
Send Email Send Email
 
go to kegelmaster on the net you can order one from there. I love mine.

>From: "betty hopson" <bunnyhop255@...>
>Reply-To: kegels@egroups.com
>To: kegels@egroups.com
>Subject: [kegels] Re: Is there anyone in this group?
>Date: Mon, 13 Mar 2000 15:03:38 GMT
>
>
>
>Hey I just saw your message. Would like to know how to order this
>machine.Would love to tone up.
>
>>From: "diane lapick" <lapickdiane@...>
>>Reply-To: kegels@egroups.com
>>To: kegels@egroups.com
>>Subject: [kegels] Re: Is there anyone in this group?
>>Date: Sun, 12 Mar 2000 18:03:01 PST
>>
>>Hi!  Yes, I am just like you, too.  And Tina, also, I started then
>>stopped.
>>But I want to get back in to it because I noticed a "difference" while
>>having an orgasm.  Seemed more intense.  I was using for about 1 month
>>then
>>stopped.  I think it's neat and I plan on doing it "forever!"  (probably
>>will take that long to use all the springs!)  It's definitely worth it to
>>me.  Good luck.
>>
>>
>>
>>>From: "Mullinks" <rawd@...>
>>>Reply-To: kegels@egroups.com
>>>To: kegels@eGroups.com
>>>Subject: [kegels] Is there anyone in this group?
>>>Date: Sat, 11 Mar 2000 08:53:37 -0800
>>>
>>>
>>>Hi,
>>>I just received the kegelmaster and I am wondering how long I will
>>>notice results.  My vaginal tone is so weak that i can't even manage
>>>one spring. I have only just started and I am going to keep at it, but
>>>I was wondering if anyone else has had any difficulty at the begining.
>>>
>>>
>>>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds!  Get rates
>>>as low as 0.0% Intro APR and no hidden fees.
>>>Apply NOW!
>>>http://click.egroups.com/1/975/2/_/15984/_/952875222/
>>>
>>>eGroups.com Home: http://www.egroups.com/group/kegels/
>>>http://www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
>>>
>>
>>______________________________________________________
>>
>>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds!  Get rates as low as 2.9%
>>Intro or 9.9% Fixed APR and no hidden fees.  Apply NOW!
>>http://click.egroups.com/1/936/2/_/15984/_/952913522/
>>
>>-- Create a poll/survey for your group!
>>-- http://www.egroups.com/vote?listname=kegels&m=1
>>
>>
>
>______________________________________________________
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds!  Get rates as low as 2.9%
>Intro or 9.9% Fixed APR and no hidden fees.  Apply NOW!
>http://click.egroups.com/1/936/2/_/15984/_/952963593/
>
>-- Easily schedule meetings and events using the group calendar!
>-- http://www.egroups.com/cal?listname=kegels&m=1
>

______________________________________________________

#30 From: "Willa Bradshaw" <willabradshaw@...>
Date: Thu Mar 23, 2000 4:34 pm
Subject: Re: kegels digest
willabradshaw@...
Send Email Send Email
 
Yes they are for real. it is a i'll say a dildo type of thing used to build
up the muscle in the vagal area.

>From: Diana <salisberry@...>
>Reply-To: kegels@egroups.com
>To: kegels@egroups.com
>Subject: [kegels] Re: kegels digest
>Date: Sun, 12 Mar 2000 18:20:15 -0700
>
>
>what's with all the kegel messages today?  is this
>"spamming"? or are these messages for real?
>
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>MAXIMIZE YOUR CARD, MINIMIZE YOUR RATE!
>Get a NextCard Visa, in 30 seconds!  Get rates as low as
>0.0% Intro or 9.9% Fixed APR and no hidden fees.
>Apply NOW!
>http://click.egroups.com/1/2122/2/_/15984/_/952912210/
>
>-- 20 megs of disk space in your group's Document Vault
>-- http://www.egroups.com/docvault/kegels/?m=1
>

______________________________________________________

#29 From: "Willa Bradshaw" <willabradshaw@...>
Date: Thu Mar 23, 2000 4:20 pm
Subject: Re: Is there anyone in this group?
willabradshaw@...
Send Email Send Email
 
Hi i also have a kegelmaster. I have found that i has useing it on my water
bed and haveing it was not working. I now use it on a reg. bed or the floor
and it works better.  willabradshaw

>From: "Mullinks" <rawd@...>
>Reply-To: kegels@egroups.com
>To: kegels@eGroups.com
>Subject: [kegels] Is there anyone in this group?
>Date: Sat, 11 Mar 2000 08:53:37 -0800
>
>
>Hi,
>I just received the kegelmaster and I am wondering how long I will
>notice results.  My vaginal tone is so weak that i can't even manage
>one spring. I have only just started and I am going to keep at it, but
>I was wondering if anyone else has had any difficulty at the begining.
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds!  Get rates
>as low as 0.0% Intro APR and no hidden fees.
>Apply NOW!
>http://click.egroups.com/1/975/2/_/15984/_/952875222/
>
>eGroups.com Home: http://www.egroups.com/group/kegels/
>http://www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
>

______________________________________________________

#28 From: Loberfeld <bloberfe@...>
Date: Thu Mar 16, 2000 4:43 pm
Subject: kegelmaster
bloberfe@...
Send Email Send Email
 
Has anybody felt the need to order the second (stronger) set of springs?
Does it make a difference? Has anyone succeeded with them? (I won't even
ask about a third set!)  bloberfe@...

#27 From: "Mayra Mora" <mscanela@...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 7:40 am
Subject: Re: Is there anyone in this group?
mscanela@...
Send Email Send Email
 
who the hell is spamming?  that is out of line  ! to assume YOU are being
spammed.........the group is to share ideas and experiences...this is why
people sign up for this type of group.  And who is YOU?????????????????be
specific and check your mail correctly....the e mails are coming fron the
ekegels group....it generates the rest of the email to others who have
signed up.  Don't be part of the group and dont share you experiences . I
for one am glad some people had questions and happy to share experiences,
and hear from others.

>From: Diana <salisberry@...>
>Reply-To: kegels@egroups.com
>To: kegels@egroups.com
>Subject: [kegels] Re: Is there anyone in this group?
>Date: Mon, 13 Mar 2000 20:57:32 -0700
>
>
>Your spamming is out of line.  I have been inundated with
>the same type message for 2 days, and it appears that it is
>coming from you.
>
>I think others out there feel the same way.  If I want to
>buy your machine, I will.  The website is done very well and
>you don't need all these "it's great" messages to sell your
>product.
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>MAXIMIZE YOUR CARD, MINIMIZE YOUR RATE!
>Get a NextCard Visa, in 30 seconds!  Get rates as low as
>0.0% Intro or 9.9% Fixed APR and no hidden fees.
>Apply NOW!
>http://click.egroups.com/1/2122/2/_/15984/_/953037553/
>
>-- Talk to your group with your own voice!
>-- http://www.egroups.com/VoiceChatPage?listName=kegels&m=1
>

______________________________________________________

#26 From: JWW2001@... (JAY WALLER)
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 4:23 am
Subject: Re: kegalmaster RULES !!!!
JWW2001@...
Send Email Send Email
 
Hi Mayra:

My wife and I sort of figured out about the vibrator causing the
involuntary contraction by luck. As I mentioned she was very weak and
couldn't close the Kegelmaster even with one spring in the 1st position.
It was just a hunch that if the Kegelmaster was opened up inside of her
and we just briefly touched her clitoris with the vibrator there would
be a "contraction". It turned out that this "exercise" was all that was
needed to get things moving as far as muscle strength goes.. She was
soon able to close the Kegelmaster without the vibrator. Now that she is
on 2 springs she uses the vibrator for other things! At the rate she's
going she will be on 3 springs in 3 or 4 weeks and I never would have
believed it but she will someday be  closing all 4!

I love the Kegelmaster. My wife loves it. Her mother loves it. I would
suggest it for any woman! She says she is having better orgasms than
before she had our daughter. It seems like she is also on the road to
being tighter and stronger with more control, too! That person who wrote
it was right. The Kegelmaster seem too good to be true.
For the inquirer , asking if the kegalmaster works.

Yes it does honey.  You just need patience and you need to relax.  Once
you do, not only will you enjoy yourself, you will feel yourself
getting stronger.  I can naturally clamp down on two springs but i am
aiming for more tone.  I guess the natural tone comes from not having
been through childbirth.

My reasons for extra toning is for more pleasurable sex for myself and
my partner.
Do try and do your kegels often and you will feel an increase in orgasm.
Enjoy and happy kegals to you !
The product is great !   It should be announced on National TV !

I am going to try what the other couple suggested and try it with a
vibrator to see if the muscles to tense and clamp on the kegal master.

Godd LUCK  !


------------------------------------------------------------------------
MAXIMIZE YOUR CARD, MINIMIZE YOUR RATE!
Get a NextCard Visa, in 30 seconds!  Get rates as low as
0.0% Intro or 9.9% Fixed APR and no hidden fees.
Apply NOW!
http://click.egroups.com/1/2122/2/_/15984/_/953002275/

-- Easily schedule meetings and events using the group calendar!
-- http://www.egroups.com/cal?listname=kegels&m=1

#25 From: Diana <salisberry@...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 3:57 am
Subject: Re: Is there anyone in this group?
salisberry@...
Send Email Send Email
 
Your spamming is out of line.  I have been inundated with
the same type message for 2 days, and it appears that it is
coming from you.

I think others out there feel the same way.  If I want to
buy your machine, I will.  The website is done very well and
you don't need all these "it's great" messages to sell your
product.

#24 From: "Mayra" <mscanela@...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 2:32 am
Subject: Re: Is there anyone in this group?
mscanela@...
Send Email Send Email
 
Betty Hopson:  You will feel a difference  within a week !  I did ! I
actually felt a difference the same day.  But if you need toning give
it some time...it does work sweetie.  Go for it !


"betty hopson" <bunnyhop25-@...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/kegels/?start=21
> this sounds to good .Are you sure this really work? How long did it
take
> before you noticed the difference;
>
>
> >From: DRAYWELLS@...
> >Reply-To: kegels@egroups.com
> >To: kegels@egroups.com
> >Subject: [kegels] Re: Is there anyone in this group?
> >Date: Mon, 13 Mar 2000 12:31:31 -0600 (CST)
> >
> >you can get one online at www.kegelmaster2000.com  when we bought
one it
> >was about 85 dollars with shipping and handling and it has a lifetime
> >warrenty in case you wear it out you can get another one free
> >
> >

#23 From: "Mayra" <mscanela@...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 2:28 am
Subject: kegalmaster RULES !!!!
mscanela@...
Send Email Send Email
 
For the inquirer , asking if the kegalmaster works.

Yes it does honey.  You just need patience and you need to relax.  Once
you do, not only will you enjoy yourself, you will feel yourself
getting stronger.  I can naturally clamp down on two springs but i am
aiming for more tone.  I guess the natural tone comes from not having
been through childbirth.

My reasons for extra toning is for more pleasurable sex for myself and
my partner.
Do try and do your kegels often and you will feel an increase in orgasm.
Enjoy and happy kegals to you !
The product is great !   It should be announced on National TV !

I am going to try what the other couple suggested and try it with a
vibrator to see if the muscles to tense and clamp on the kegal master.

Godd LUCK  !

#22 From: JWW2001@... (JAY WALLER)
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 2:03 am
Subject: Yes, the Kegelmaster works!
JWW2001@...
Send Email Send Email
 
My wife and I both will attest to how well the Kegelmaster works. She
gave one to her Mother! and she loves it too. The Kegelmaster is one of
those ideas so simple it ought to be obvious. Someone just applied
"resistance exercise principles" to muscles which benefit from exercise
probably more than any muscles in the body. If you know the 1st thing
about the value of Kegels, the second you see how the Kegelmaster works,
you'll know how ingenious the idea is. I admit we were frustrated at
first (because she was sooooooo weak to begin with), but now she's
gaining strength (and pleasure) at an incredible rate. Trust me, the
Kegelmaster WORKS!

#21 From: "betty hopson" <bunnyhop255@...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 1:30 am
Subject: Re: Is there anyone in this group?
bunnyhop255@...
Send Email Send Email
 
this sounds to good .Are you sure this really work? How long did it take
before you noticed the difference;


>From: DRAYWELLS@...
>Reply-To: kegels@egroups.com
>To: kegels@egroups.com
>Subject: [kegels] Re: Is there anyone in this group?
>Date: Mon, 13 Mar 2000 12:31:31 -0600 (CST)
>
>you can get one online at www.kegelmaster2000.com  when we bought one it
>was about 85 dollars with shipping and handling and it has a lifetime
>warrenty in case you wear it out you can get another one free
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds!  Get rates as low as 2.9%
>Intro or 9.9% Fixed APR and no hidden fees.  Apply NOW!
>http://click.egroups.com/1/936/2/_/15984/_/952996027/
>
>-- Talk to your group with your own voice!
>-- http://www.egroups.com/VoiceChatPage?listName=kegels&m=1
>
>

______________________________________________________

#20 From: JWW2001@... (JAY WALLER)
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 12:32 am
Subject: Re: Is there anyone in this group?
JWW2001@...
Send Email Send Email
 
My wife was originally as weak as the lady who was having trouble with
one spring. We discovered that if, while the Kegelmaster is inside you,
opened up that if you just touch on or near the clitoris with a vibrator
the vaginal muscles exercise by themselves! I'm not kidding! There's an
involuntary contraction that takes place that partially closed the
Kegelmaster! The muscles started getting stronger this way and now does
it entirely on her own. She's closing 2 springs! We both feel  the
Kegelmaster is going to be bigger than Viagra one day!

#19 From: DRAYWELLS@...
Date: Mon Mar 13, 2000 6:31 pm
Subject: Re: Is there anyone in this group?
DRAYWELLS@...
Send Email Send Email
 
you can get one online at www.kegelmaster2000.com  when we bought one it
was about 85 dollars with shipping and handling and it has a lifetime
warrenty in case you wear it out you can get another one free

#18 From: Sandy Allen <april@...>
Date: Mon Mar 13, 2000 4:59 pm
Subject: Re: Is there anyone in this group?
april@...
Send Email Send Email
 
Go to http://www.kegelmaster2000.com and you can order on line, or call the
phone number.

Sandy



At 03:03 PM 3/13/00 GMT, you wrote:
>
>Hey I just saw your message. Would like to know how to order this
>machine.Would love to tone up.
>
>>From: "diane lapick" <lapickdiane@...>
>>Reply-To: kegels@egroups.com
>>To: kegels@egroups.com
>>Subject: [kegels] Re: Is there anyone in this group?
>>Date: Sun, 12 Mar 2000 18:03:01 PST
>>
>>Hi!  Yes, I am just like you, too.  And Tina, also, I started then stopped.
>>But I want to get back in to it because I noticed a "difference" while
>>having an orgasm.  Seemed more intense.  I was using for about 1 month then
>>stopped.  I think it's neat and I plan on doing it "forever!"  (probably
>>will take that long to use all the springs!)  It's definitely worth it to
>>me.  Good luck.
>>
>>
>>
>>>From: "Mullinks" <rawd@...>
>>>Reply-To: kegels@egroups.com
>>>To: kegels@eGroups.com
>>>Subject: [kegels] Is there anyone in this group?
>>>Date: Sat, 11 Mar 2000 08:53:37 -0800
>>>
>>>
>>>Hi,
>>>I just received the kegelmaster and I am wondering how long I will
>>>notice results.  My vaginal tone is so weak that i can't even manage
>>>one spring. I have only just started and I am going to keep at it, but
>>>I was wondering if anyone else has had any difficulty at the begining.
>>>
>>>
>>>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds!  Get rates
>>>as low as 0.0% Intro APR and no hidden fees.
>>>Apply NOW!
>>>http://click.egroups.com/1/975/2/_/15984/_/952875222/
>>>
>>>eGroups.com Home: http://www.egroups.com/group/kegels/
>>>http://www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
>>>
>>
>>______________________________________________________
>>
>>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds!  Get rates as low as 2.9%
>>Intro or 9.9% Fixed APR and no hidden fees.  Apply NOW!
>>http://click.egroups.com/1/936/2/_/15984/_/952913522/
>>
>>-- Create a poll/survey for your group!
>>-- http://www.egroups.com/vote?listname=kegels&m=1
>>
>>
>
>______________________________________________________
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds!  Get rates as low as 2.9%
>Intro or 9.9% Fixed APR and no hidden fees.  Apply NOW!
>http://click.egroups.com/1/936/2/_/15984/_/952963593/
>
>-- Easily schedule meetings and events using the group calendar!
>-- http://www.egroups.com/cal?listname=kegels&m=1
>
>
>
>

#17 From: "betty hopson" <bunnyhop255@...>
Date: Mon Mar 13, 2000 3:03 pm
Subject: Re: Is there anyone in this group?
bunnyhop255@...
Send Email Send Email
 
Hey I just saw your message. Would like to know how to order this
machine.Would love to tone up.

>From: "diane lapick" <lapickdiane@...>
>Reply-To: kegels@egroups.com
>To: kegels@egroups.com
>Subject: [kegels] Re: Is there anyone in this group?
>Date: Sun, 12 Mar 2000 18:03:01 PST
>
>Hi!  Yes, I am just like you, too.  And Tina, also, I started then stopped.
>But I want to get back in to it because I noticed a "difference" while
>having an orgasm.  Seemed more intense.  I was using for about 1 month then
>stopped.  I think it's neat and I plan on doing it "forever!"  (probably
>will take that long to use all the springs!)  It's definitely worth it to
>me.  Good luck.
>
>
>
>>From: "Mullinks" <rawd@...>
>>Reply-To: kegels@egroups.com
>>To: kegels@eGroups.com
>>Subject: [kegels] Is there anyone in this group?
>>Date: Sat, 11 Mar 2000 08:53:37 -0800
>>
>>
>>Hi,
>>I just received the kegelmaster and I am wondering how long I will
>>notice results.  My vaginal tone is so weak that i can't even manage
>>one spring. I have only just started and I am going to keep at it, but
>>I was wondering if anyone else has had any difficulty at the begining.
>>
>>
>>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds!  Get rates
>>as low as 0.0% Intro APR and no hidden fees.
>>Apply NOW!
>>http://click.egroups.com/1/975/2/_/15984/_/952875222/
>>
>>eGroups.com Home: http://www.egroups.com/group/kegels/
>>http://www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
>>
>
>______________________________________________________
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds!  Get rates as low as 2.9%
>Intro or 9.9% Fixed APR and no hidden fees.  Apply NOW!
>http://click.egroups.com/1/936/2/_/15984/_/952913522/
>
>-- Create a poll/survey for your group!
>-- http://www.egroups.com/vote?listname=kegels&m=1
>
>

______________________________________________________

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