Hi All,

I'd like to add my two cents to this very interesting and worthwhile discussion.
At present we are very limited when it comes to being able to verify the claims
of Ayurveda using western scientific principles. We are unable to quantatively
measure energies like "prana." However that doesn't mean we can't verify it's
existence for ourselves - we can feel it flow through us and out of us and into
us. Nor does it rule out the possibility of measuring it's effects on other life
forms.

Let me share a spontaneous experiment that occurred many years ago when I was
studying biology at the University of Michigan. It was a lab class where we were
studying the embryonic fetal development of chickens. We were paired up and each
pair was given an egg that had been incubated for varying lengths of time. We
were asked to hatch the egg at whatever stage it was in and observe the
resulting fetus under the microscope. My table happened to have one that was
almost completely mature. We trained the microscope on it and could see the
chick's heart beating and after a couple of minutes it stopped.

I then placed my hand over the fetus and began to consciously channel life
force. Within seconds, the heart started beating again. I removed my hand and
asked my partner to look through the microscope and verify. He saw it beating
and gradually die out. We repeated this process five more times. By now my
partner was getting quite excited. He tried to do the same but nothing happened.
He then called over the TA and had me repeat it again. Again the heart began to
beat. The TA tried - nothing happened. The whole class had gathered around us by
now. The TA tried to come up with a logical explanation. Feeling my hands, he
said, it must be the heat from my hands. So, we took a hot tungsten lamp and
placed it millimeters from the embryo to see if that would reproduce the same
effect. Once again - nada. I put my hand over it - it started right back up. I
told them what I thought was happening - that the flow of life force was
essentially jump starting the heart. The TA looked perplexed. Luckily the bell
rang and we had to move on.

For ethical reasons, I've never repeated this experiment. Western researchers
are beginning to look at concepts like prana and figuring out ways to prove or
disprove their existence and quantify them. I am confident that in time we will
be able to measure these more subtle life energies, just as we can measure
electrical voltage today. The challenge is that they are indeed subtle. That's
why it's easier to detect them with our awareness then it is to objectify them
with relatively crude instruments.

Cheers,

Bhaskar

www.jivakacenter.com

dan_elbourne <splundig73@...> wrote:hi james,
thanks for your reply :) yes i intend to continue my interest.
thai massage looks fascinating.

you said in your post that, "Without a belief or understanding of
Ayurveda (Thai Medicine), a practitioner is not really doing Thai
massage". in your opinion, would it be enough to have an academic
knowledge of where the meridians are / are said to be, and the parts
of the body that they relate to. in this way you would be
saying, "the indians and thais said that if i do technique x to area
y then i will achieve result z. this seems to work, but i'm not
convinced that it works for the reasons that traditional indian /
thai medicine says that it does". aren't you still getting the same
result or am i missing something important?

re: yoga, i have to say that i don't agree with your argument :) i
think that, even without prana, yoga is so much more than just
stretching. what about the meditation, relaxation, breathing,
strength work, ballance and so on. in fact, arguably, relaxation and
meditation are more important / define yoga more than the asanas.
and that's not even mentioning the higher moral ideals and ways of
living that many yogis follow, eg "loving kindness" and "non-
attachment". in my opinion, none of this is dependant on a belief in
prana. though of course if prana does exist, and can be utilised then
it may add to yoga's benefits.

is see from your site (cool - must try kite surf one day :) ) that
you practice the soma veda style of thai massage. is that
signicantly different from traditional thai therapy / an
americanisation or is just copyrighted to preserve standards? i
think that i heard somewhere that it incoroporates myofascial
triggerpoints? is that right?

regards, dan



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