This a "fetish" group catering to those whose like men with long
beards, not a religious debating society, so I do feel this is very
off topic. But since the moderator has not reigned in this
disscussion, Here I am again. I feel I have said what I wish to
say, but after reading what Father Seraphim posted, I wanted to add
just a little more.

As I previously said, the members of the Islamic faith outnumber the
Christians by a 3 to 1 ratio on this planet. If it was so violent as
people contend, this world would be engulfed in a global jihad that
makes what we now are contending with trivial. Just because there
are denominations of the Islamic faith that are more militant and
prone to violence should not damn the entire Islamic community.

While I have fundemental problems with certain extremist Christian
denominations, I do not condemn the whole Christian faith and I do
not feel that every single Christian is an evil misguided soul as
some would do to Muslims. I live in a community with a lot of
Muslims and we are get along just fine. We have had some really
useful and contructive conversations on our respective religions.
With all due respect Father Seraphim, I fear your monothiestic views
are making you look at the Islamic faith with extreme prejudice
whether you are aware of it or not.

As far as the Christian faith being the most persecuted religion in
the world, I have deep feelings about this. Just as you claim the
Islamic faith spread "by violence and ruled its subjugted peoples by
violence". What the heck do you think Christianity did? Look at the
Crusades, look at the Inquisition, look at what they did in the
Americas, and look at how every single civilization that it found in
the new world was considered to be inferior and savage because they
didn't venerate Lord Jesus, The Christ. And you wonder why there is
persecution of the Christian faith?

Both religions, Christianity and Islam are both guilty of
unspeakable wrongs. As the founder of the Satanic Church, Anton
LeVay said, "More people have been killed "In The Name of God" than
for any other reason". That is a very chilling and yet very truthful
statement.

I find it very sad that I have had to learn more about the Christian
Church than my own traditions in order to defend my beliefs because
of the persecution I live with since forsaking my Christianity and
adopted a belief system I feel is a more true religion. The majority
of Christian dogma I have problems with are not things that I feel
are at the core of Christianity, but rather the internal political
policies of a power-monging boys club set up by a Roman Emperor.
From the exclusion in the Holy Bible of the Testamnent of Timothy
that shows Mary Magdelane was one of, if not the most influential
Appostle to Christ in order to subjugate woman to the will of men to
the meddling with foreign powers such as telling American political
officials they can't partake of Holy Communion if they don't vote or
act on policies selectively emphasized by the Vatican says they
should, clearly shows how far from the teachings of Christ the
church that bears his name has strayed.

After watching "The Passion of the Christ", I came away asking
myself "WWJD". What Would Jesus Do if he came back right now? I
would think he would not only be mad, he'd be pissed. He would
probably do to the Vatican what he did to the Jewish temple prior to
his murder. Like then, the "Boys Club" would not recognize him as
the returned Messiah and would probably do the same things to him
once again. They would do such a great smear job that the followers
of the church would be totally unaware of it or be brainwashed into
thinking he was just another David Koresh.

I said this is my final post on this thread because I know I am
talking to stone walls here. I know that nothing I can say here will
make those of us who are so entrenched in thier religious diatribes
will fob off what I say because I am not chanting the mantra of your
monothiestic systems. And yea, because I am not "one of you", I must
be praising some other God-like entity and since there is only one
true God, "Your God", I must be a misguided soul that is unwittingly
giving thanks to Satan or one of his minions.

After saying all of this, I can still say I feel the teachings of
Christianity and Islam are worthy of venerating as our issues here
are with the politics of those who call themselves leaders of those
faiths. We can truly learn and become better people from these
religions, but we can't let the dogma get in the way.

Finally, the liberal media is no more liberal than the corporations
that control them. For decades, I have considered myself to be a
very conservative person and just because I have taken this stance,
does that make me a liberal too? It really is getting bogus for
people to slap a damning liberal label on if you feel the media or
people are against the Christian Church.

Blessings to all
Hal
aka ThunderChildga