I just wanted to add my $.02. I am also a Christian. I denounce what was said
on this board to the Islamic man. Hal is correct. All too often, misguided
individuals miss the true message of their respective Messiah. In our case,
Jesus taught us to love each other; irrespective of our many differences. Jesus
also taught us to not judge each other, lest we ourselves will be judged. If
everyone lived by these two simple rules, the world would be a much safer and
kinder place! All the best to all my bearded breathern!
Steve P

In a message dated 7/2/2004 11:24:01 AM Eastern Daylight Time, "Hal Doby"
<ThunderChild@...> writes:

>While I do not wish to throw fuel on a fire, I feel as a Shamanic
>Pagan, I should chime in on this religion thread that seems to be
>starting to turn into a bitch-fest over Christianity versus Islam.
>As a person who takes pride in his religious traditions, I can
>understand the desire to share the virtues of what I venerate with
>others, but I do not feel that a Yahoo! Group that is composed of
>primarily Gay men is the proper place for such a discussion. But
>with the door cracked open on this topic, I'd like to share a couple
>of comments their religion to this group.
>
>Both Christianity and Islam are true recognized religions. The
>Christian may not be aware that Islam incorporates many of the
>Christian traditions into its belief system and is a very peaceful
>and honorable religion. There are a lot more Muslims in the world
>than Christians by a 3 to 1 ratio. While most people link the Arab
>world with Islam, all races of man venerate it worldwide.
>
>The practitioners of Islam have been a lot more tolerant to other
>religions than most people would believe. Unlike the invading
>Christians who had no tolerance to other religious traditions,
>Muslims would go to a new town and ask to be allowed to practice
>their religion in peace and harmony along with the other religions.
>If they were accepted, all was well, but if they received the butt
>of intolerance, then the swords were drawn and in the name of Allah,
>they entered into Holy War. The Christians never gave practitioners
>of other religions that much tolerance.
>
>Yes, there are Muslims out there that are violent and do terrorist
>acts, but there are Christians that do the same thing too. What
>about the terrorist acts of bombing abortion clinics, the
>assignations of doctors that perform abortions, the burning at the
>stake of men and women that allegedly practiced alternative
>traditions thought to be witchcraft, and let's not forget the vile
>acts that have been done to our Gay brothers and sisters over the
>ages. Weren't those Christians that strung up that Gay teen in the
>Midwest and left him to die? What about that preacher that is going
>around the US doing those "Die Faggots" protests and wanting to put
>up anti-gay memorials? Praise Jesus!
>
>Christians can be as barbaric as anyone else. It was Christians that
>taught the Indigenous Americans to scalp in order to prove they had
>killed a certain number of people. Wasn't that guy named Hitler
>brought up as a Christian and how many people was he responsible for
>killing? Yea, no Christian has seized a plane and thrown it into a
>building, but I think if the tables were turned, it would not be too
>much of a stretch to think they would be capable of doing it. Just
>as the Middle East is in turmoil over Islamic rights, there is a war
>going on in America over fundamental Christians trying to exert
>their views of societal behavior upon the whole of American society
>where gays cannot marry each other, scientific research cannot
>perform to cure disease, and the spread of disease cannot be
>prevented around the world because people cannot be told to use
>condoms or practice birth control. The point is there are extremists
>in both religions and we all should not make blanket assumptions
>because of that.
>
>Frankly, both religions are pretty intolerant in general to
>homosexuals. I abandoned the Christian faith because of that
>intolerance. I see far too many brothers and sisters having deep
>emotional and psychological issues because it has been hammered into
>their heads they are going to burn in Hellfire for all eternity
>because of their sexual orientation. While I am admittedly not
>familiar with the Islamic views towards homosexuality, I can only
>assume it is a negative one since there is Christian dogma in its
>core belief system. I cannot ally myself to a religion that will not
>accept me as I am, my true self.
>
>Jesus taught his followers to love all their brothers and sisters,
>especially those who were different from them. He never excluded
>anyone and embraced everyone where his path took him. I really
>appreciate a line in the movie K-PAX where the alien Prot tells his
>doctor how everyone on Earth completely lost the core message of
>Jesus' teachings. I feel that was an ultimate truth most are too
>blind to see.
>
>While I do not feel this is the place to talk about religious
>traditions, I did not mind our Muslim friend sharing his views on
>Islam. I do have a problem with friendly sharing of ideas turning
>into something that tries to tell him his religion is either a false
>religion or how all of its followers are bad people. Both
>Christianity and Islam are monotheistic religions and at their core,
>they teach their followers that there is only one true way to The
>Divine. This is a case of two people at opposite ends of a spectrum
>telling the other they are wrong and there is no middle ground. That
>is the whole reason this world is so fucked up with religious
>turmoil.
>
>I will not detail my religious traditions here but rather say that I
>am willing to share my views with anyone that is interested in
>writing me directly. You must come to Paganism as we do not
>evangelically try to convert the masses. I think most would be
>surprised and pleased with it if given the chance.
>
>To be blunt our Christian brother was pretty rude in his diatribe.
>While he is entitled to his viewpoint, we should strive to keep out
>conversations here a bit more tolerant and constructive.
>
>May you touch The Divine and be one with it, whatever your religious
>path is that takes you there.
>
>Blessings to all my brothers
>
>Hal Doby
>Aka ThunderChildga
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>