All:
--

On Wed, 31 May 2000 20:52:18
Mark Emdee wrote:

>From your comments it would seem that you now think it is best to
>supplement with only one-half tablespoon of flax each day for all of
>your needed EPA/DHA, is that correct?

With the understanding that there is no EPA/DHA in flax, but that the body will
make some, and that I believe that this figure is a bare-bottom minimum (1T is
more reasonable, perhaps -- see below), then the answer is "yes." This, as noted
below, would be the more conservative approach, based on Canadian "RDAs" and
Simopoulos' published review; 1 T would be more liberal, but not as extreme as
that suggested by S. in her popular book.

And if so, is that based your
>statement below, "if we take the more conservative approach, it's
>more like 3.7-4.6 g (1g ALA -[0.3/0.4 g dha] + 10 [0.3/0.4])", if so
>then I don't follow how you get one-half tablespoon flax oil from
>that calculation,

Well, if (as per S's published review) we need the equivalent of 1g total n3
including 300-400 mg preformed DHA, and the conversion ratio (as per her popular
book) is 10:1, then to cover it all with ALA, we need [1g total n3 - (0.3/0.4g
DHA preformed) + 10(.3/.4){for the conversion ratoi}], which yields us the
3.7-4.6 g ALA quoted above to cover it all.

1T flax oil (in the imperialist running dog system -- ~ 15mL) yields 13.5g oil,
and flax is ~58% ALA, so 0.5 T yields 3.9g ALA, which is at the low end.
Presumably we're all eating some greens, soy, etc and getting a few hundred
milligrams of ALA that way, so that should cover it.

and is the amount of ALA needed based on "Simo's
>more extreme recommendation of 1g EPA/DHA + 2g ALA"?

No: as noted, it is "if we take the more conservative approach." If we go with
S's popular book, it's 2g ALA + 10[1g EPA/DHA]= 12g, or closer to 1.5 T. The
Canadian "RDAs" are closer to 1T's worth; this seems a happy medium.

>
>Since supplementation and food intake of EPA/DHA increases
>mitochondria membrane oxidation, it seems to be best to get almost
>all needed EPA/DHA from Alpha-linolenic Acid (ALA or LNA, 18:3w3),
>is that correct?


IMHO, yes. However, to keep the n6:n3 ratio under control, this also entails
cutting back on n6 very carefully as well -- eg. peanut, canola, and sesame
products are out, although usually considered "high-mono." Soy is too beneficial
to remove from the diet, IMHO, esp. for vegetarians, but low-fat tofu (eg)
should be preferred. That's what I'm working on now. I'm consuming none of the
three "out" foods above, much less flax than I used to, and am using unrefined
high-mono sunflower oil (delicious, but pricey -- though not much worse than
flax oil) and more extra-virgin olive oil than I used to.

If so then, the only way that I know of getting
>enough to convert to EPA/DHA, at the rate of 7.5 ALA to 1.0 EPA/DHA,

Where did you get this ratio?

>is to supplement with the somewhat unnatural (processed food) flax
>seed oil, is that correct? Because even if the best source
>(walnuts) [suck by comparison].

That's the way to go, IMHO.


On Thu, 01 Jun 2000 14:12:15
mike wrote:

Similar questoins to Mark's. I hope the above answers them.

[This is me]:
>> >I should also add that, having double-cheked it, my recent post on n3s
exaggerated the reccomendations of Simopoulos and the Canadian government: the
former suggests 1g n3, including 3-400 mg as EPA or DHA, while the latter gives
varying reccomendations by age and weight, but looks to average ~1.5 g daily
total n3 intake.
>> >
>> Having TRIPLE-checked it, I actually find that Simopuolos is simply
inconsistent. Her popular book, as I'd originally posted, suggests 1g of
DHA/EPA; her review paper (4) has the figure above.
>>
>> >Conclusion: flax, not fish, and perhaps less total EFAs in favor of
monounsaturates.

Key references:

>> (0) Pamplona et al (1998), "Mitochondrial membrane peroxidizability index is
inversely related to maximum life span in mammals." J Lipid Res. 1998
Oct;39(10):1989-94. PMID: 9788245; UI: 99002294
>> >
>> (1) [No authors listed], "Dietary supplementation with n-3 polyunsaturated
fatty acids and vitamin E after myocardial infarction: results of the
GISSI-Prevenzione trial. Gruppo Italiano per lo Studio della Sopravvivenza
nell'Infarto miocardico." Lancet. 1999 Aug 7;354(9177): 447-55. PMID: 10465168;
UI: 99392837
>>
>> (2) de Lorgeril et al "Mediterranean alpha-linolenic acid-rich diet in
secondary prevention of coronary heart disease." Lancet. 1994 Jun
11;343(8911):1454-9. PMID: 7911176; UI: 94260784
>>
>> (3) de Lorgeril et al, "Mediterranean dietary pattern in a randomized trial:
prolonged survival and possible reduced cancer rate." Arch Intern Med. 1998 Jun
8;158(11):1181-7. PMID: 9625397; UI: 98287079
>>
>> (4) Simopoulos, "Omega-3 fatty acids in health and disease and in growth and
development." Am J Clin Nutr. 1991 Sep;54(3):438-63. Review. PMID: 1908631;
UI: 91344899

(5) Stillwell W, Jenski LJ, Crump FT, Ehringer W.
Effect of docosahexaenoic acid on mouse mitochondrial membrane properties.
Lipids. 1997 May;32(5):497-506.
PMID: 9168456; UI: 97311741

(6) Simopoulos A, Robinson J. The Omega Plan/The Omega diet. New York: Harper
Collins, 1998/?.



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