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Jobs & AT Students   Message List  
Reply | Forward Message #2672 of 3451 |
Re: Jobs & AT Students

Greetings,

Forgive me for stepping on my soapbox but I have numerous educational and
professional questions I feel face the profession. These are intended to
evoke discussion and not anger.

Less than 30% of first time BOC Exam participants pass. Compare this to
other allied health care professions of percents in the 80's. It points to a
question of an invalid exam or failure to educate or a disconnection between
the two processes.

50% of ATEP students move on to other fields for all the reasons we are
aware of and I need not list them. If we are losing potentially outstanding
future professionals to age old practices and settings, should we not
consider adjusting these. I don’t have the stats handy but I don’t think 50%
of graduating med students pick a different venue.

As Jim Berry mentioned, I to am a BOC examiner and have been frightened by
what I see. As much as I want to support ATEP directors, etc some students
are not being provided with the knowledge or other skills they will need. If
a student doesn’t know some basic surface anatomy, or taping technique or
cant assess the cranial nerves and they have been cleared to graduate from
an "Accredited" program and sit for the exam.... I worry!

There is also a bit of research out there that assessed the reliability of
site visit teams and inconsistencies between them. This frightens me, there
may be no validity in accreditation. We have more students than we have jobs
or jobs that wont demand the type of things people are leaving the
profession for. Do we need an approved program at all the colleges in the US
or even the number that we have? I think many schools are racing to get an
approved program so they can recruit student assistants (Athletic Training
Students). This is directly contrary to the goal of students not being a
work/labor force. Many liberal arts schools are trying to establish a
program. In doing so they go against their mission statement of "Liberal" or
well rounded and narrow the students focus to one small facet, the area of
AT.

So what is my proposal? Make the entry-level requirement a Masters. Now
before you toss this idea out, read on and I will attempt to defend my
position. Imagine the amount of rigor you could instill in a program with
students a few years more mature. Imagine if they came in to a MS program
with a "liberal" background in science and psychology. They would better
understand patient care and people skills as well as possess a strong grasp
on the sciences (physics/chemistry/A&P) that would permeate in abilities to
understand pharmacological interactions, modalities, etc, etc. You could
have them perform some research and allow them to garner a better
understanding of quality research and less precise research. This improves
the JAT and our education. Remember, the JAT has been denied certain caveats
because of a review of the quality of articles or lack of quality articles
that can be found. The MS degree would limit schools that have or could
house an ATEP. This limits new students and improves the quality of those
graduating. So far so good. Now, for the schools that would be lacking the
number of certified staff to get the job done. HIRE one of the many ATC's
out there that may be looking for a career change. I refuse to accept that
universities cant afford additional staff. Let me remind you to look at the
salaries of head coaches as compared to head ATCs. I see a large discrepancy
and it tells me we need to better sell our selves as vital or important.

This scenario was presented to me during my doctoral comps and it went like
this: We compare out selves to PTs, Chiropractors, MDs, etc. I was asked
what kind of degree do these professions have? Each has a clinical doctoral
degree. The following question was painful to answer. What kind of degree
does an ATC have? I had to say, "A Clinical Bachelors". OUCH! If we have to
go to a congress representative and defend this, we sure did start in a
hole.

Finally, to step off and get back to work, I would like to see the percent
pass rates of candidates from each program. Med schools get ranked by this.
Lets stop protecting institutional autonomy to the level that we are. If I
am working at a high school or college and want to mentor or advise a
future/potential ATC on a great school, I want to know how they are
performing.

Sorry so long but I am passionate about the topic.

Scot

***********************************************
Scot Raab MS, ATC
Office HPR 225
Office Phone: 601-266-5808
E-Mail: scot.raab@...
*************************************************






Wed Jul 12, 2006 8:50 pm

scot.raab@...
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Message #2672 of 3451 |
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Being at the convention last week, I notice that many people aren't applying for the jobs as have been in past years which made wonder about ATEP. Athletic...
abram.357@...
Send Email
Jun 26, 2006
11:46 pm

Dr. Ken Knight has asked me to invite students, faculty, and researchers to submit education-related articles to the new Athletic Training Education Journal...
Donald Fuller
dfuller@...
Send Email
Jun 26, 2006
11:55 pm

Sorry, I forgot the link to the journal. I also wanted to let you know that this is a "free" online journal. Please bookmark this link along with your other...
Donald Fuller
dfuller@...
Send Email
Jun 27, 2006
4:40 am

Great comment. In our program we are seeing an increase in the number of students wishing to use the ATEP as a route to PT school, and, with the increased...
Taylor, Jeffrey Owen
jtcrusader
Offline Send Email
Jun 27, 2006
7:47 pm

I think we all need to consider one thing here. Only 8-9% of all FT placements in athletic training are in the collegiate setting. Our job as educators is to...
jrankinphd
Offline Send Email
Jun 27, 2006
7:48 pm

I think we need to be very cautious with this logic. I believe it was Dr. Schrader who asked the question "are our graduates getting placement in...
Paul Alvarez
alvarezatc
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Jun 30, 2006
6:18 pm

I shouldn't use the term "useless" because nothing we learn can be called useless information. I should have said relevent to what athletic trainers are using...
abram.357@...
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Jun 30, 2006
6:23 pm

Dr. Alvarez and group: This paragraph from your recent email is rather disturbing to me and I was left with one important question in my mind - what exactly IS...
MBTRAINER@...
Send Email
Jul 12, 2006
8:02 pm

I believe I am correctly recalling reading that less than 50% of recent graduates are pursuing a career in Athletic Training after graduating from an ATEP. Our...
docamadeus
Offline Send Email
Jul 12, 2006
8:04 pm

Greetings, Forgive me for stepping on my soapbox but I have numerous educational and professional questions I feel face the profession. These are intended to ...
Scot Raab
scot.raab@...
Send Email
Jul 13, 2006
5:47 pm

It has been intersting to read about what experienced clinicians, educators, all ATC's have posted about this issue. This email is relatively long, so please...
Mary Harbach
starladyatcl
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Jul 21, 2006
10:10 pm

Here's another thought, regarding athletic trainers doing research- in which athletic training positions can research be done? Consider this- who has the TIME,...
Mary Harbach
starladyatcl
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Jul 21, 2006
10:10 pm

Mary- I think you have a good point, however, if you are interested in doing research I'd suggest that you partner up with an ATC who is in the college setting...
jordan_hamson
Offline Send Email
Aug 1, 2006
1:53 am

Every clinician, regardless of setting, should be a researcher. Advances in clinical practice are made through critically examining the research that has been...
Bonnie VanLunen
bvanlunen
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Aug 1, 2006
1:54 am

Group: I would like to inquire how programs are planning to prepare their students for the new BOC examination format. In addition, what media based resources...
speichert@...
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Oct 9, 2006
9:55 pm

Mary makes a good point regarding resources. I commend her for mentioning the "GOOD" research as many of us may produce but not produce well. We have research...
James Leone
jleoneatc@...
Send Email
Aug 1, 2006
2:02 am

Dear All, I usually sit back and watch the verbal "bantering", but this one is too good to pass up....so here are my two cents.... I feel that Mark Gibson's...
Ray Castle
lsuatc
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Jul 21, 2006
10:12 pm

I view it not so much that we need to throw out or replace the training in a "traditional" setting for another setting, but that we need to be sure that...
Melinda Flegel
fleg7
Offline Send Email
Jul 12, 2006
8:17 pm

Mr. Berry makes a good point, but I philosophically stand by my statement. As an educator, I am not here to respond to the latest market trends in the health...
Paul Alvarez
alvarezatc
Offline Send Email
Jul 13, 2006
5:34 pm

My original post was not necessarily to knock down folks that have pursued a degree in another field. It was to make the point the athletic training is...
Mattacola, Carl
indigofarmm
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Aug 1, 2006
1:50 am

Hi everyone! I've also been very interested in the current discussions on the listserv. I am also a newly certified female ATC pursuing a master's degree. My...
Kim Detwiler
quadzillakd@...
Send Email
Aug 1, 2006
2:01 am

Kim and colleagues: I'm glad that Kim went on to pursue her masters in an area she was interested in- and I hope no one got the impression that I was against...
Mary Harbach
starladyatcl
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Aug 6, 2006
3:25 am

Is there much difference between Universal and Standard Precautions for would care? Should our students be taught both, or just one? Just wondering your...
Donald Fuller
dfuller@...
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Aug 6, 2006
9:56 pm
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