Hello Chuck,

Thanks for sending us these three studies, below, all of which
oppose the idea that growth hormone causes diabetes. To
me, the biggest support that growth hormone does not
cause or worsen diabetes is found in the fact that in six
years and 9000 posts, this has been a non-issue on
Rejuvenation, ie, only one person has reported he got
diabetes, and he asked if perhaps it was caused by having
taken growth hormone a few months...

No!, I answered. But, even if it was, you should not stop
taking growth hormone, you should control your diabetes.
(Famous last and forgotten words... I think he stopped taking
growth hormone...)

When you take into account that diabetes type II starts to
appear increasingly after age 40, and by age 60 about one in
six persons on planet Earth is a declared diabetic, plus
many more undetected, and by age 90 it is much more... it is
not too unlikely that in a group of more than 1000 persons,
in six years we have had one who got diabetes... But it is
a long shot for anybody to say his diabetes which takes
years to develop was CAUSED by taking growth hormone a few
months... but that is what his doctor probably told him,
referring to the "literature".

In any case... I much prefer the RISK of getting diabetes
than the CERTAINTY of growing older sooner. If you do get
diabetes for whatever reason, be sure to write to me, I'll
tell you what you have to do next... (Hint: You have to get
your glucose levels strictly under control!)

The problem, of course, is that doctors depend on what is
written in their textbooks. I just bought a 1985
edition of "Joslin Diabetes Mellitus" and I can tell you that
it is jam-packed with bad and mistaken advice, at least
in my opinion, based on my experience taking insulin
and 8 to 10 glucose tests per day for more than 1000
days, to keep my glucose under control and to be able to
PREDICT where my glucose levels WILL BE, and what I know
of glycosilation, etc. It is FULL of mistakes, or
statements that I disagree with vehemently... and that
is the 1985 edition, which was not so long ago. So many
doctors have all of this misinformation programmed into
their brains. The only diabetes doctor that I agree almost
completely with is Dr. Richard Bernstein, who also disagrees
with most diabetes doctors. I only disagree with Dr. Bernstein
on minor points, not fundamental points, and I have learned
more from him than from any other diabetes mentor.

Dr. Elliot Joslin, by the way, would have probably
been a great mentor too, if he had been alive today.
Of course he wrote his first manual in 1916, which
was 5 years before insulin was discovered... then he
revised his manual later, when there was only pork and
bovine insulin, and glucose was measured in the urine,
not in the blood... there weren't any glucose meters for
anybody to take thousands of glucose tests like I am
able to do today...

(Dr. Bernstein calls that the Dark Ages of diabetes)

But he had a very good idea of how to treat diabetes
with low carb nutrition and exercise, and he was on the
button in his advice in that respect... later, apparently,
his advice was turned around by other doctors.

I think his manuals are actually better, given the state
of the art of those days, than the newer one I bought (used)
which is written in his name, and which is a showcase for
young doctors to show others how smart they are, all the big
words they know, and how to complicate what is really much
more simple.

For example... DIABETES: A DEFINITION, from the twelfth
edition, 1985, manual (please, just read this with a
grain of salt, so you see what I mean about how some
doctors like to write big words without taking a stand and
they complicate life with what should really be much more
simple.)

======================
DIABETES: A DEFINITION (by George F. Cahill Jr.)

"What is Diabetes Mellitus? A single clear answer cannot
be given...

Ellis: It can't?

But a generalization is that it is a grouping of anatomic
and chemical problems resulting from a number of factors
in which an absolute or relative deficiency of insulin or
its function usually is present.

Ellis: "Usually?..." You don't dare take a stand even on
this one point?

It tends to run in families; is associated with accelerated
atherosclerosis, and predisposes to certain specific
microvascular abnormalities including retinopathy,
nephropathy, and neuropathy. It doubles the risk of
stroke, increases the risk of heart attack 2 to 3 fold,
and for peripheral vascular problems, particularly in the
feet, 50 fold.

(etc.... more description of complications of diabetes...)

========================

I don't know if you get the impression that the author
of this "definition" doesn't really know what diabetes is...
he thinks he knows what it DOES, so he describes it by
what it does, not by what it IS. He is afraid of being
criticized for missing a point, and he makes sure he covers
all possible bases. He generalizes so much that finally
you don't know what diabetes is at all... "it was clear as
mud, but it covered the ground! And the confusion made
me head spin 'round..." (from: Harry Belafonte...)

I will write much more about this, but, the important
thing is not to show what doctors don't know and the
mistakes they are making, but to say what they missed
saying and to correct their mistakes...

That's pretty difficult to do if you are not a doctor,
which I am not... So I hope to give some direction to my
project by revising an old public domain manual by
Dr. Joslin which is really pretty good, keeping all
of the good... and then I want to let some doctors who I
agree with, like Dr. Bernstein if he wants to, and/or his
disciples if he doesn't, help me to set the record straight...
mostly, to say that using insulin is the SOLUTION, and not
the PROBLEM...

(I don't know why I know this and I am not a diabetic or
a doctor, and so many doctors don't know it... or else
they think I'm crazy, or dangerous.)

Just getting this single idea across will be a huge
contribution to diabetes treatment, and to anti-aging
too (because they are one and the same thing)--

Metformin be damned! Avoiding to the end the use of insulin
in diabetes II patients is probably the single biggest and
most serious mistake doctors have ever made in medical
history, because it negatively affects the health of BILLIONS
of people on planet Earth. I want to at least plant the
seed of opposition to this mistake, and let it grow.

Do you know what metformin IS??? Surprise! Read my next post,
coming soon. Again, I am guessing, but: metformin is SUGAR!!!
Pure, unadulterated GLUCOSE + FRUCTOSE, which is 100%
SUGAR in my book... I will even bet it is two parts Glucose
to seven parts Fructose! (I'll tell you soon how I reached
this conclusion, in a different post....)

Man, how stupid could I be not to think of this before?

Now, how many smart diabetes doctors would like to treat diabetes
with SUGAR???

None.

Whoops! That's bad for sales....

So, call in the marketing department...

Put them together and what do you get? Bibetty babetty Boo!
(from Walt Disney... I think: Cinderella, or other...)

Metformin!

Call whatever it is "Metformin" and let's get on with the money
show. Show doctors the right hand, do the trick with the left
hand, and everybody is happy... except diabetics! They're the
ones who pay with their lives, and their money... but let them
pay... as long as they pay with their money, who cares if
diabetics pay with their lives, too?

I do. I really do care about diabetics. And I really do
care about non-diabetics.... So...

I bought a new domaine name, diabetwiki.org (.com and
.net too) and I intend to put up a public domaine (ie,
VERY OLD) Joslin Diabetes manual on a wiki. (A "wiki" is a
website that can be edited by anybody.) I am revising the
manual myself, (you can imagine Dr. Joslin's manual revised
by Toussier, with Toussier's Carbohydrate Thermometer,
Toussier's Poor Man's Glucose Tolerance test, Toussier's
"Non Diabetic use of insulin", etc...) Some doctors will laugh,
or scoff at the idea of ever reading "Toussier's" revised
Joslin Diabetes Manual, but fortunately it is a public domain
manual... so I can do whatever I want to with it, and this is
what I want to do with it, and I am doing with it. As often
is the case, the word will get to them in a roundabout way,
eventually... Then another doctor will take credit for what
we will show them, but that's fine with me...

And then I will let doctors and knowledgeable patients
and anti-aging enthusiasts revise the wiki manual more, so
hopefully we will eventually have a diabetes and anti aging
manual that will be way ahead of "Grow Young With HGH" or
anything else I have ever read in a paper book, and it will
be revised every day, forever hopefully, long after I kick
the bucket (many years from now, I hope.)

All this and much more, coming soon to a website near you.
Don't unsubscribe from Rejuvenation, yet... Big things
are coming... A wiki... A blog... A new forum...
teleconferences... video files... audio files... Much
more interactivity... Customer service... etc... You are
all going to be free "inner circle" members of the soon to
be announced subscription website, which is going to cost
others a pretty penny but I hope it will be well worth it.
In fact, I hope it will break new ground for "VERY STRICT
GLUCOSE CONTROL" and anti aging.... A sort of Alcoholics
Anonymous for glucose control and anti aging.

- Ellis]

--- Don De Shon wrote:

> My business partner and I share the same primary
> care physician. He was the first to ask her if she
> would recommend HGH in his case. She declined
> absolutely saying that taking HGH would be
> "asking for diabetes."

Chuck writes:

The studies listed below are all from this year and
they all relate to GH and/or IGF-1 and diabetes.

{Here is a brand new study that suggests that Higher
levels of IGF-1 may 'REDUCE' the risk diabetes and of
coronary heart disease. Notice the statement "By
contrast, recent prospective 'epidemiological' studies
suggest that relatively higher IGF-I levels may reduce
the risk of type 2 diabetes and coronary heart
disease". This was an examination from epideiologocal
studies. I think Ellis's epidmeologist friend needs to
catch up with the current research}:

Insulin-like growth factor-I and risk of type 2
diabetes and coronary heart disease: molecular
epidemiology.

Sandhu MS.

Department of Public Health and Primary Care,
Institute of Public Health, University of Cambridge,
Strangeways Research Laboratory, Cambridge, UK.

Insulin-like growth factors (IGFs) play a fundamental
role in somatic growth and cellular differentiation,
metabolism and survival. Indeed, the processes linking
nutrition, metabolism and growth are thought to
involve a complex interrelation among insulin, growth
hormone (GH), IGFs and their binding proteins
(IGFBPs). However, accumulating data from both
experimental and molecular epidemiological studies
indicate that these growth factors may also be
important in the pathophysiological processes
underlying chronic disease, including type 2 diabetes
mellitus, coronary heart disease and cancer.

***Experimental and observational studies suggest that
higher levels of circulating IGF-I may increase risk
of several cancers. By contrast, recent prospective
epidemiological studies suggest that relatively higher
IGF-I levels may reduce the risk of type 2 diabetes
and coronary heart disease. However, these relatively
small-scale observational studies are susceptible to
chance, reverse causality and residual or unmeasured
confounding.***

A 'Mendelian randomization' approach based on
large-scale gene association and prospective observational
studies might help determine the possible causal role of
IGF-I and its binding proteins in the aetiology of
type 2 diabetes, coronary heart disease and cancer.

PMID: 15879687 [PubMed - in process]

{Here is one that suggests that GF's (growth factors)
'OR' their secondary messengers (growth hormone
included) may actually be a good treatment for
diabetic retinopathy}:

Treating diabetic retinopathy by tackling growth
factor pathways.

Chiarelli F, Giannini C, Di Marzio D, Mohn A.

Department of Pediatrics, University of Chieti,
Ospedale Policlinico, Via dei Vestini 5, I-66100
Chieti, Italy. chiarelli@...

Diabetic retinopathy (DR) remains a major cause of new
cases of blindness onset in adults. The prevalence of
diabetic eye disease is strongly related to the
duration of diabetes, blood pressure and glycemic
control, although a multifactorial pathogenesis is
likely to be probable.

Despite the effectiveness of current prevention (by
tight metabolic and blood pressure control) and
treatment (with laser photocoagulation) methods, and
with the help of screening programs, diabetic eye
disease is still a problem. Recent advances in our
understanding of the pathogenesis of microvascular
complications and particularly of the role of growth
factors (GFs) in retinal changes have allowed
significant advances in the medical management of DR.

Studies of the biochemical process underlying DR have
clearly demonstrated an important role for a number
of aberrantly expressed GFs or their second messengers
(eg, vascular endothelial growth factor, growth
hormone, insulin-like growth factor-1, protein kinase
C and pigment epithelium derived factor) possibly
acting together in the development of structural
changes characterizing early stages of vascular DR.

The critical role of GF expression has led to new
experimental therapeutic intervention in DR. In fact,
timely pharmacological intervention in GF synthesis
and activities may arrest the development of early
vascular changes.

As the effects of GFs become better understood,
pharmacological manipulation of GF synthesis and
action will be useful in the early stages of vascular
change with the potential to prevent diabetes-related
visual loss.

PMID: 15898347 [PubMed - in process]

================

HERE'S THE REAL KICKER!!!!!!!!!DRUM ROLL PLEASE
!!!!!!!


Insulin-like growth factor-I treatment of growth
disorders, diabetes mellitus and insulin resistance.

Ranke MB.

Paediatric Endocrinology Section, University
Children's Hospital, Hoppe-Seyler-Strasse 1, D-72076
Tubingen, Germany.

Insulin-like growth factor I (IGF-I) has many
potential therapeutic uses because of its varied
effects - growth promotion, insulin-like influence on
glucose metabolism, and neuroprotection resulting from
cell-proliferative and antiapoptotic properties - but
they have not been investigated systematically in
clinical situations.

The growth-promoting effect of recombinant human
IGF-I (rhIGF-I) in the extensively studied growth
hormone insensitivity syndrome (GHIS; Laron syndrome)
signifies an endocrine role for the GH-IGF system.

***The metabolism of (adult) patients with severe insulin
resistance is improved by rhIGF-I, which - together with
insulin therapy - also improves metabolic control in
type 1 and 2 diabetes. ****

Further studies on IGF-I metabolic effects and growing
understanding of the IGF-I-IGF-binding protein system
could open new therapeutic avenues.

PMID: 15860416 [PubMed - as supplied by publisher]


====================
Peace, Chuck

Thanks, same to you, Ellis