Ellis,

I keep the HGH and HCG separate until I am ready to inject. I am
taking 1 mg (= 3 IU) of HGH daily and 250 U of HCG. The HGH is
6 mg/ml (in the Serostim vial) and I prepare the HCG so it is
1000 U/ml. (Most recently, by putting 30,000 U into a 30 ml vial
of bacteriostatic water for injection)

Using a 1/2 ml insulin syringe, I pull up 0.16 ml of the
HGH solution and then 0.25 ml of the HCG. (0.16 is close enough
to one sixth of a ml.) The syringe then contains 0.41 ml of
solution. Then I inject subcutaneously.

I do this once a day in the morning (not that the time
matters) every day, indefinitely.

The package insert for the HCG says to inject intramuscularly, but
that hurts a lot, and I found an article in the infertility
literature that says subcutaneous injection works just fine for
HCG in women, for fertility purposes.

It is important not to contaminate either vial, but especially the
HCG, since the vial lasts 120 days, which is a long time for any
contaminant to grow (which is why I use bacteriostatic water,
and not just sterile water). Next time I will use a smaller
vial.

I don't know if HGH and HCG are really compatible in solution, but
they are only together for a moment, so I doubt it's an issue.

Yes, I take Arimidex. This is all under the advice of my anti-aging
doctor, and he monitors my hormone levels. My latest labs are
not at hand, and I am due for a recheck, anyway.

It's hard to know if HCG is working to prevent testicular atrophy
because that would be a fairly slow process, anyway. I did not
notice any when I was using testosterone cream for about a year,
and I still have not noticed any,or any rebound growth.

It did affect my sperm count, which is a little better, last
time I checked. This is complicated by the fact that I had
varicoceles (enlarged testicular veins in the scrotum) for a long
time, had a procedure to fix them, and now they are back. They
also sometimes affect fertility.

Now my fertility issue is not so much the sperm count, but a
very low motility. The little wigglers just don't wiggle. The
urologists I have consulted don't know why, but I get the
impression they are not very interested in hormone issues.

I did find a reference that said curcumin decreased sperm
motility, so I quit taking that. On a urologist's advice, I
stopped taking a lot of supplements (see LEF.org) for six months,
which made no difference.

The rationale for using HCG instead of testosterone is that the
testes normally make testosterone, and the concentration in the
testes is normally much higher than elsewhere in the body, and
sperm requires this high level to mature. HCG mimics luteinizing
hormone (LH) which is the pituitary hormone which tells the
testes to make testosterone. If you take testosterone, the
pituitary makes less LH and the testes shut down.

Taking HCG (or LH) instead tells the testes to crank it out.
However, another pituitary hormone, follicle stimulating hormone
(FSH) is the one that tells the testicles to actually increase
the number of sperm they make. FSH is available for injection,
but is extremely expensive, so I can't afford to just try it for
a few months. Of course, these hormones play a different role in
women.

Mike Lenker


Ellis: Thanks for a great post... For those who do not know
this: Mike Lenker is a medical doctor, and he has sent us some
of the best posts we have had about x-rays and radiology. I
am going to study this post very carefully because I do not
know very much about HCG, or LH, or FSH. Thank you, Mike. - Ellis
mlenker27@... wrote:

Tony and Ellis,

I have been using HGH and HCG at the same time for about a year,
without any side effects of which I am aware. I actually mix them
in the syringe and make it a single injection.

Before anyone asks, I am currently using 3 U of HGH (1 mg) and
250 U of HCG daily. I switched from testosterone cream to HCG
to prevent testicular atrophy and hopefully preserve fertility.

Mike Lenker

Ellis: Hello Mike. Wow! I never heard of anybody doing this like
this.

So... How do you do this? When you prepare HCG I suppose you have
1 ml of solution... so... I imagine that you use that 1 ml of HCG
solution to prepare the HGH... Is that what you do? But then you
have 18 iu of HGH and 5000 iu of HCG in 1 ml... if you use one sixth
of that (3 iu) then you get one sixth of 5000, which is about 830 iu
of HCG... so that is NOT how you do it...

So I suppose you prepare the HCG and keep it in a separate vial
and you keep the HGH in its separate vial too... then... each .05
of HCG = 250 iu (5000 divided by 20 = 250... 1.00 divided by 20
equals .05) So you take 3 iu of HGH and then 250 iu of HCG in
the same syringe... question: doesn't that affect either the HCG
or the HGH?

So... with what FREQUENCY do you take this dose of HCG? And for
what length of time? Can you take HCG "forever" instead of
taking testosterone? Does it give you good RESULTS? Does it
have any SIDE EFFECTS if you use it for many years? Do you use
ARIMIDEX to block estrogen?

THANKS for your great input. Dr. Mike Lenker is a DOCTOR, and a
great contributor to this forum. When I refer to doctors who
don't know what they say about growth hormone or other hormones,
I am not refering to Dr. Lenker. - Ellis

-----Original Message-----
From: Tony Correa
To: rejuvenation@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 1:02 pm
Subject: [Rejuvenation] Can I use HGH and HCG at the same time?

Tony: Dear Ellis:

Thanks always for your help... I have this question: Can I use HGH
and HCG at the same time??????? Thanks for your answer. - Tony

Ellis: YES, of course you can. HGH repairs your body... and HCG
will make your testicles produce testosterone, and if your
testicles have "shrunk" because of you were on testosterone for
a long time, they will grow bigger in size again. Neither one
affects the other.

In fact, I think that you can use HGH and anything else you like at
the same time, except it might increase thyroid a little bit. You
can take whichever vitamins you want to. HGH will not affect
insulin... it will not affect blood glucose appreciably.
.. it will not affect testosterone.
.. it will not affect melatonin... it will
not affect DHEA... it might increase red blood cells a little bit if
you are anemic, but it will never increase red blood cells
above 45%.

Testosterone will increase red blood cells... it will not affect
growth hormone, insulin, blood glucose, DHEA, melatonin, vitamins,
or thyroid.

Doctors: I would like for you to agree or disagree with me.

- Ellis