Hi,

Does any one has experience treating Morton's Neuroma?  What points/treatments
have you used?  What degree of sucsess?

Thanks,
Revital

___________________________________________________________________
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Hi Al - I wrote this. The formula modifications were collected from various
places and lectures over the years. The phrase anima-animus was a moment of
hyper-extended metaphor and it hasn't been used on this list before.

W

----- Original Message -----
From: "Al Stone" <alstone@...>
To: <PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, January 31, 2005 11:30 AM
Subject: Re: [PulseDiagnosis] Coffee now si ni san


>
>
> On Jan 30, 2005, at 4:53 PM, Will wrote:
>
> > Si Ni San (Four Counterflows Powder)
>
> Hey Will.
>
> Where did you get this?  I like the format.
>
> > Bupleurum and Chih Shih (Si Ni San) is the archetypal Bupleurum
> > compound. It is a botanical 'anima-animus' through pairing Bupleurum
> > (Chai Hu) and Peony alba (Bai Shao).
>
> Has "anima-animus" been defined on this list as applied to herbal
> formulas?  I'm not sure what the author is trying to say. There's a
> yin-yang balance perhaps?  Diaphoretic and astringent used together?
>
> --
> Al Stone, L.Ac.
> Pain is inevitable, suffering is optional.
> -Adlai Stevenson
>
>

Hi David -

I loved your article in AT. And, yes to emotions and qi gung regarding jing.
For me without question.

W

> Do you believe Qi Gong or Nei Gong can influence Jing? If yes than Qi
> influences Jing regardless of the form. Also, do you think emotional
> energy influences one Jing, both favorable or unfavorable, especially
> over the long-term?
>
> regards,
> david
>
>
> --- In PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com, WMorris116@A... wrote:
> > Dose this suggest that the herbs can really affect jing? If so, then
> how
> > about whole left sided weak pulses or left chi position weak pulses?
> >
> > Will
> >
> >
> > Annual Review of Nutrition
> > Vol. 25 (Volume publication date August 2005)
> > (doi:10.1146/annurev.nutr.25.050304.092639)
> >
> > Regulation of Gene Transcription by Botanicals: Novel Regulatory
> > Mechanisms
> >
> > Neil F. Shay
> > Department of Biological Sciences, University of Notre Dame, Notre
> > Dame, IN 46556 nshay1@n...
> >
> > William J. Banz
> > Department of Animal Science, Southern Illnois University,
> > Carbondale, IL 62901
> >
> > Early investigations of gene regulation revealed that nutrients could
> > modulate gene expression, an example being the discovery of metal-
> > regulated gene transcription (11, 19, 44). Only more recently have we
> > focused on the ability of non-nutritional botanicals or functional
> > food components to affect gene expression at the transcriptional
> > level. Significant findings include the discovery that hyperforin is
> > an active ingredient of the herbal remedy St. John's Wort, and
> > activates gene transcription of cytochrome p450-3A4, causing
> > significant botanical-drug interactions. Recently, the lipid-
> > regulating peroxisome proliferator-activated receptors (PPARs) have
> > been studied as receptors activated by soy isoflavones, perhaps
> > explaining the lipid-lowering effect of soy intake. Epigallocatechin
> > gallate (EGCG) has been shown to be an inhibitor of the protealytic
> > activity of the proteasome; this inhibition has significant
> > implication on cell proliferation and the stability of transcription
> > factors in the nucleus. Very recently, the effects of botanicals have
> > been studied as activators of sirtuins, important deacetylation
> > enzymes that have been shown to enhance lifespan in a variety of
> > organisms. Sirtuins have been implicated in the lifespan-enhancing
> > effect of caloric restriction. Originally presumed to act mainly on
> > compaction or accessibility of DNA, recent evidence showns important
> > activity of sirtuins as controllers of transcriptional coactivator
> > availability. This review will focus on novel mechanisms by which
> > botanical products regulate cell function via gene transcription.
> > Investigating these newly-appreciated mechanisms will assist with
> > characterization and clarification of specific effects of botanicals
> > on gene expression.
> >
> > Expected online publication date for the Annual Review of Nutrition
> > Volume 25 is July 17, 2005
> >
> > Annual Review of Nutrition
> > Vol. 25 (Volume publication date August 2005)
> > (doi:10.1146/annurev.nutr.25.050304.092639)
> >
> > Regulation of Gene Transcription by Botanicals: Novel Regulatory
> > Mechanisms
> >
> > Neil F. Shay
> > Department of Biological Sciences, University of Notre Dame, Notre
> > Dame, IN 46556 nshay1@n...
> >
> > William J. Banz
> > Department of Animal Science, Southern Illnois University,
> > Carbondale, IL 62901
> >
> > Early investigations of gene regulation revealed that nutrients could
> > modulate gene expression, an example being the discovery of metal-
> > regulated gene transcription (11, 19, 44). Only more recently have we
> > focused on the ability of non-nutritional botanicals or functional
> > food components to affect gene expression at the transcriptional
> > level. Significant findings include the discovery that hyperforin is
> > an active ingredient of the herbal remedy St. John's Wort, and
> > activates gene transcription of cytochrome p450-3A4, causing
> > significant botanical-drug interactions. Recently, the lipid-
> > regulating peroxisome proliferator-activated receptors (PPARs) have
> > been studied as receptors activated by soy isoflavones, perhaps
> > explaining the lipid-lowering effect of soy intake. Epigallocatechin
> > gallate (EGCG) has been shown to be an inhibitor of the protealytic
> > activity of the proteasome; this inhibition has significant
> > implication on cell proliferation and the stability of transcription
> > factors in the nucleus. Very recently, the effects of botanicals have
> > been studied as activators of sirtuins, important deacetylation
> > enzymes that have been shown to enhance lifespan in a variety of
> > organisms. Sirtuins have been implicated in the lifespan-enhancing
> > effect of caloric restriction. Originally presumed to act mainly on
> > compaction or accessibility of DNA, recent evidence showns important
> > activity of sirtuins as controllers of transcriptional coactivator
> > availability. This review will focus on novel mechanisms by which
> > botanical products regulate cell function via gene transcription.
> > Investigating these newly-appreciated mechanisms will assist with
> > characterization and clarification of specific effects of botanicals
> > on gene expression.
> >
> > Expected online publication date for the Annual Review of Nutrition
> > Volume 25 is July 17, 2005
> >
> > William R. Morris, LAc., OMD, MSEd
> > President, AAOM
> > 310-453-8300 phone
> > 310-829-3838 fax
> >
> > "How do we know it is destiny? Because it is."
> >
> > This message is a PRIVATE communication. This e-mail and any
> attachments may
> > be confidential and/or legally privileged. If you are not the intended
> > recipient, do not read, copy, or use it, and do not disclose it to
> others. Please
> > notify the sender of the delivery error by replying to this message
> with the word
> > delete in the subject column, and then delete it and any attachments
> from
> > your system. Thank you.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> The mission of this group is to provide a forum for the discussion of
pulse diagnosis so that a depth of understanding is furthered.
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Good Morning Will,
This is a fascinating article, showing the relationship of foods and
botanicals and DNA. Do you know of similar research showing the effects of
"botanicals" on ovarian and sperm health ? I would like to see a similar
discussion to show the fertility doctor I work with.
Thanks,
Susanna

----- Original Message -----
From: "flyingstarsfengshui" <flyingstarsfengshui@...>
To: <PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, January 31, 2005 8:44 AM
Subject: [PulseDiagnosis] Re: Regulation of Gene Transcription by Botanicals


>
>
> Hi Will:
>
> Do you believe Qi Gong or Nei Gong can influence Jing? If yes than Qi
> influences Jing regardless of the form. Also, do you think emotional
> energy influences one Jing, both favorable or unfavorable, especially
> over the long-term?
>
> regards,
> david
>
>
> --- In PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com, WMorris116@A... wrote:
> > Dose this suggest that the herbs can really affect jing? If so, then
> how
> > about whole left sided weak pulses or left chi position weak pulses?
> >
> > Will
> >
> >
> > Annual Review of Nutrition
> > Vol. 25 (Volume publication date August 2005)
> > (doi:10.1146/annurev.nutr.25.050304.092639)
> >
> > Regulation of Gene Transcription by Botanicals: Novel Regulatory
> > Mechanisms
> >
> > Neil F. Shay
> > Department of Biological Sciences, University of Notre Dame, Notre
> > Dame, IN 46556 nshay1@n...
> >
> > William J. Banz
> > Department of Animal Science, Southern Illnois University,
> > Carbondale, IL 62901
> >
> > Early investigations of gene regulation revealed that nutrients could
> > modulate gene expression, an example being the discovery of metal-
> > regulated gene transcription (11, 19, 44). Only more recently have we
> > focused on the ability of non-nutritional botanicals or functional
> > food components to affect gene expression at the transcriptional
> > level. Significant findings include the discovery that hyperforin is
> > an active ingredient of the herbal remedy St. John's Wort, and
> > activates gene transcription of cytochrome p450-3A4, causing
> > significant botanical-drug interactions. Recently, the lipid-
> > regulating peroxisome proliferator-activated receptors (PPARs) have
> > been studied as receptors activated by soy isoflavones, perhaps
> > explaining the lipid-lowering effect of soy intake. Epigallocatechin
> > gallate (EGCG) has been shown to be an inhibitor of the protealytic
> > activity of the proteasome; this inhibition has significant
> > implication on cell proliferation and the stability of transcription
> > factors in the nucleus. Very recently, the effects of botanicals have
> > been studied as activators of sirtuins, important deacetylation
> > enzymes that have been shown to enhance lifespan in a variety of
> > organisms. Sirtuins have been implicated in the lifespan-enhancing
> > effect of caloric restriction. Originally presumed to act mainly on
> > compaction or accessibility of DNA, recent evidence showns important
> > activity of sirtuins as controllers of transcriptional coactivator
> > availability. This review will focus on novel mechanisms by which
> > botanical products regulate cell function via gene transcription.
> > Investigating these newly-appreciated mechanisms will assist with
> > characterization and clarification of specific effects of botanicals
> > on gene expression.
> >
> > Expected online publication date for the Annual Review of Nutrition
> > Volume 25 is July 17, 2005
> >
> > Annual Review of Nutrition
> > Vol. 25 (Volume publication date August 2005)
> > (doi:10.1146/annurev.nutr.25.050304.092639)
> >
> > Regulation of Gene Transcription by Botanicals: Novel Regulatory
> > Mechanisms
> >
> > Neil F. Shay
> > Department of Biological Sciences, University of Notre Dame, Notre
> > Dame, IN 46556 nshay1@n...
> >
> > William J. Banz
> > Department of Animal Science, Southern Illnois University,
> > Carbondale, IL 62901
> >
> > Early investigations of gene regulation revealed that nutrients could
> > modulate gene expression, an example being the discovery of metal-
> > regulated gene transcription (11, 19, 44). Only more recently have we
> > focused on the ability of non-nutritional botanicals or functional
> > food components to affect gene expression at the transcriptional
> > level. Significant findings include the discovery that hyperforin is
> > an active ingredient of the herbal remedy St. John's Wort, and
> > activates gene transcription of cytochrome p450-3A4, causing
> > significant botanical-drug interactions. Recently, the lipid-
> > regulating peroxisome proliferator-activated receptors (PPARs) have
> > been studied as receptors activated by soy isoflavones, perhaps
> > explaining the lipid-lowering effect of soy intake. Epigallocatechin
> > gallate (EGCG) has been shown to be an inhibitor of the protealytic
> > activity of the proteasome; this inhibition has significant
> > implication on cell proliferation and the stability of transcription
> > factors in the nucleus. Very recently, the effects of botanicals have
> > been studied as activators of sirtuins, important deacetylation
> > enzymes that have been shown to enhance lifespan in a variety of
> > organisms. Sirtuins have been implicated in the lifespan-enhancing
> > effect of caloric restriction. Originally presumed to act mainly on
> > compaction or accessibility of DNA, recent evidence showns important
> > activity of sirtuins as controllers of transcriptional coactivator
> > availability. This review will focus on novel mechanisms by which
> > botanical products regulate cell function via gene transcription.
> > Investigating these newly-appreciated mechanisms will assist with
> > characterization and clarification of specific effects of botanicals
> > on gene expression.
> >
> > Expected online publication date for the Annual Review of Nutrition
> > Volume 25 is July 17, 2005
> >
> > William R. Morris, LAc., OMD, MSEd
> > President, AAOM
> > 310-453-8300 phone
> > 310-829-3838 fax
> >
> > "How do we know it is destiny? Because it is."
> >
> > This message is a PRIVATE communication. This e-mail and any
> attachments may
> > be confidential and/or legally privileged. If you are not the intended
> > recipient, do not read, copy, or use it, and do not disclose it to
> others. Please
> > notify the sender of the delivery error by replying to this message
> with the word
> > delete in the subject column, and then delete it and any attachments
> from
> > your system. Thank you.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> The mission of this group is to provide a forum for the discussion of
pulse diagnosis so that a depth of understanding is furthered.
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

On Jan 30, 2005, at 4:53 PM, Will wrote:

>  Si Ni San (Four Counterflows Powder)

Hey Will.

Where did you get this?  I like the format.

> Bupleurum and Chih Shih (Si Ni San) is the archetypal Bupleurum
> compound. It is a botanical 'anima-animus'  through pairing Bupleurum
> (Chai Hu) and Peony alba (Bai Shao).

Has "anima-animus" been defined on this list as applied to herbal
formulas?  I'm not sure what the author is trying to say. There's a
yin-yang balance perhaps?  Diaphoretic and astringent used together?

--
Al Stone, L.Ac.
Pain is inevitable, suffering is optional.
-Adlai Stevenson

Hi Will:

Do you believe Qi Gong or Nei Gong can influence Jing? If yes than Qi
influences Jing regardless of the form. Also, do you think emotional
energy influences one Jing, both favorable or unfavorable, especially
over the long-term?

regards,
david


--- In PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com, WMorris116@A... wrote:
> Dose this suggest that the herbs can really affect jing? If so, then
how
> about whole left sided weak pulses or left chi position weak pulses?
>
> Will
>
>
> Annual Review of Nutrition
> Vol. 25 (Volume publication date August 2005)
> (doi:10.1146/annurev.nutr.25.050304.092639)
>
> Regulation of Gene Transcription by Botanicals: Novel Regulatory
> Mechanisms
>
> Neil F. Shay
> Department of Biological Sciences, University of Notre Dame, Notre
> Dame, IN 46556 nshay1@n...
>
> William J. Banz
> Department of Animal Science, Southern Illnois University,
> Carbondale, IL 62901
>
> Early investigations of gene regulation revealed that nutrients could
> modulate gene expression, an example being the discovery of metal-
> regulated gene transcription (11, 19, 44). Only more recently have we
> focused on the ability of non-nutritional botanicals or functional
> food components to affect gene expression at the transcriptional
> level. Significant findings include the discovery that hyperforin is
> an active ingredient of the herbal remedy St. John's Wort, and
> activates gene transcription of cytochrome p450-3A4, causing
> significant botanical-drug interactions. Recently, the lipid-
> regulating peroxisome proliferator-activated receptors (PPARs) have
> been studied as receptors activated by soy isoflavones, perhaps
> explaining the lipid-lowering effect of soy intake. Epigallocatechin
> gallate (EGCG) has been shown to be an inhibitor of the protealytic
> activity of the proteasome; this inhibition has significant
> implication on cell proliferation and the stability of transcription
> factors in the nucleus. Very recently, the effects of botanicals have
> been studied as activators of sirtuins, important deacetylation
> enzymes that have been shown to enhance lifespan in a variety of
> organisms. Sirtuins have been implicated in the lifespan-enhancing
> effect of caloric restriction. Originally presumed to act mainly on
> compaction or accessibility of DNA, recent evidence showns important
> activity of sirtuins as controllers of transcriptional coactivator
> availability. This review will focus on novel mechanisms by which
> botanical products regulate cell function via gene transcription.
> Investigating these newly-appreciated mechanisms will assist with
> characterization and clarification of specific effects of botanicals
> on gene expression.
>
> Expected online publication date for the Annual Review of Nutrition
> Volume 25 is July 17, 2005
>
> Annual Review of Nutrition
> Vol. 25 (Volume publication date August 2005)
> (doi:10.1146/annurev.nutr.25.050304.092639)
>
> Regulation of Gene Transcription by Botanicals: Novel Regulatory
> Mechanisms
>
> Neil F. Shay
> Department of Biological Sciences, University of Notre Dame, Notre
> Dame, IN 46556 nshay1@n...
>
> William J. Banz
> Department of Animal Science, Southern Illnois University,
> Carbondale, IL 62901
>
> Early investigations of gene regulation revealed that nutrients could
> modulate gene expression, an example being the discovery of metal-
> regulated gene transcription (11, 19, 44). Only more recently have we
> focused on the ability of non-nutritional botanicals or functional
> food components to affect gene expression at the transcriptional
> level. Significant findings include the discovery that hyperforin is
> an active ingredient of the herbal remedy St. John's Wort, and
> activates gene transcription of cytochrome p450-3A4, causing
> significant botanical-drug interactions. Recently, the lipid-
> regulating peroxisome proliferator-activated receptors (PPARs) have
> been studied as receptors activated by soy isoflavones, perhaps
> explaining the lipid-lowering effect of soy intake. Epigallocatechin
> gallate (EGCG) has been shown to be an inhibitor of the protealytic
> activity of the proteasome; this inhibition has significant
> implication on cell proliferation and the stability of transcription
> factors in the nucleus. Very recently, the effects of botanicals have
> been studied as activators of sirtuins, important deacetylation
> enzymes that have been shown to enhance lifespan in a variety of
> organisms. Sirtuins have been implicated in the lifespan-enhancing
> effect of caloric restriction. Originally presumed to act mainly on
> compaction or accessibility of DNA, recent evidence showns important
> activity of sirtuins as controllers of transcriptional coactivator
> availability. This review will focus on novel mechanisms by which
> botanical products regulate cell function via gene transcription.
> Investigating these newly-appreciated mechanisms will assist with
> characterization and clarification of specific effects of botanicals
> on gene expression.
>
> Expected online publication date for the Annual Review of Nutrition
> Volume 25 is July 17, 2005
>
> William R. Morris, LAc., OMD, MSEd
> President, AAOM
> 310-453-8300 phone
> 310-829-3838 fax
>
> "How do we know it is destiny? Because it is."
>
> This message is a PRIVATE communication. This e-mail and any
attachments may
> be confidential and/or legally privileged. If you are not the intended
> recipient, do not read, copy, or use it, and do not disclose it to
others. Please
> notify the sender of the delivery error by replying to this message
with the word
> delete in the subject column, and then delete it and any attachments
from
> your system. Thank you.

So what would a si ni pulse feel like?  Slight above a dai mai?








--- In PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com, WMorris116@A... wrote:
> I must see Henry Fool then. For me, the si ni san form of heat
clumping is a
> result of the qi stagnation rather than the 'reverse,' e.g. heat
clumping
> leading to qi stagnation. It is an archetypal qi stagnation formula
in Kaptchuk's
> terms. I would have to understand why and how the heat clumped and
would
> probably use herbs that clear heat from the interior, were that the
center of
> pathology.
>
> Will
>
> In a message dated 1/28/05 6:11:16 PM Pacific Standard Time,
> alstone@b... writes:
>
>
> > Si Ni as treated by Si Ni San is for "heat
> > clumping" which is Qi stagnation due to heat in the abdomen, though I
> > use it for any abdominal qi stagnation.  Perhaps the coffee causes
that
> > heat clumping.
> >
>
>
> William R. Morris, LAc., OMD, MSEd

Back in a lengthy discussion of coffee/caffeine on the TCM forum, the
following article was pointed out, which provides a good historical and
theoretical basis:

COFFEE IN CHINA -- and the Analysis of Coffee According to Traditional
Chinese Medicine, by Subhuti Dharmananda

http://www.itmonline.org/arts/coffee.htm

----- Original Message -----

From: Will

To: PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Friday, January 28, 2005 10:00 AM

Subject: [PulseDiagnosis] Coffee

 

http://articles.health.msn.com/id/100098752/site/100000000

 

 

William R. Morris, L.Ac., OMD, MSEd

The mission of this group is to provide a forum for the discussion of pulse diagnosis so that a depth of understanding is furthered.

On Jan 28, 2005, at 12:27 PM, Will wrote:

> Hi Al -
>  
> I use coffee as prevention for diabetes, gallstones, colon cancer,
> liver disease, Parkinson’s disease.....and suicide prevention!
>  It enhances my cognitive function and performance. Whew.
>  
> On coffee, my pulse gains in what Hammer calls 'pounding,' Tang Tiande
> calls 'urgency,'
>  Wang Shuhe calls 'faster rate of arrival,' and Floyer calls
> 'celerity.' In my experience, the beats per minute only raise slightly
> unless
>  there is an allergy. Either way, the heart is pumping either with
> greater velocity or more BPM or both under the influence of coffee.
>  Is it heat? The vasoconstriction that occurs makes my limbs slightly
> colder as in liver qi type four reversals (si ni).

I think that its heat. It makes me feel hot, causes a slight sweat
(though I'm not sure I'd call it "diaphoretic" perhaps it is) and if
one drinks too much of it, expect damp heat to come exploding out of
the rectum.  For more on that, see the movie "Henry Fool" for the
definitive coffee induced damp-heat diarrhea scene. Its well worth the
price of a video rental.  Si Ni as treated by Si Ni San is for "heat
clumping" which is Qi stagnation due to heat in the abdomen, though I
use it for any abdominal qi stagnation.  Perhaps the coffee causes that
heat clumping.

-al.

>   
>  Will
>  
>  
> >
> > I think that the key item to keep in mind with pulse diagnosis is
> that
> > coffee consumption can increase the heart rate. This may suggest that
> > coffee has a warm to hot herbal energetic. This is consistent with
> the
> > light sweat that I get with a cup of coffee in the afternoon.
> >
> > But it is a transitory issue that isn't too important to me in
> regards
> > to the overall health of a patient. The worse thing I guess would be
> > that I think that a rapid pulse is due to coffee when in fact it is
> > something that I can and should treat.
> >
> > Had a patient the other day. Second time that I saw her. Pulse rate
> was
>  > 108 beats per minute. This was about the same as the first time I
> saw
> > her. She does look red, but she is also from Ireland where there are
> a
> > lot of naturally red complexions. But that rapid pulse concerned me.
> >
> > The first treatment, I wrote it off to her first acupuncture
> treatment
> > jitters. But when it was there the second time, I began to ask more
> > questions. Her tongue is red with a somewhat scanty coat.  She's a
> bit
> > overweight too. That yin xu with phlegm damp accumulation can spell
> > adult onset diabetes in my experience, but there were no other signs
> to
> > support the diabetes idea. Probably a good idea to have her check
> into
> > that all the same.
> >
>  > Point is, after more questioning, I learned that she likes to have a
>  > cigarette before her treatment with me. This can also cause a rapid
>  > pulse. We're going to see if it is slower next week when I see her
>  > next.
> >
> > -al.
> >
>
>
> The mission of this group is to provide a forum for the discussion of
> pulse diagnosis so that a depth of understanding is furthered.
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>  •  To visit your group on the web, go to:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PulseDiagnosis/
>  
>  • 	 To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> PulseDiagnosis-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>  
>  • 	 Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
> Service.
>
>
--
Al Stone, L.Ac.
Pain is inevitable, suffering is optional.
-Adlai Stevenson

I think that the key item to keep in mind with pulse diagnosis is that
coffee consumption can increase the heart rate. This may suggest that
coffee has a warm to hot herbal energetic. This is consistent with the
light sweat that I get with a cup of coffee in the afternoon.

But it is a transitory issue that isn't too important to me in regards
to the overall health of a patient. The worse thing I guess would be
that I think that a rapid pulse is due to coffee when in fact it is
something that I can and should treat.

Had a patient the other day. Second time that I saw her. Pulse rate was
108 beats per minute. This was about the same as the first time I saw
her. She does look red, but she is also from Ireland where there are a
lot of naturally red complexions. But that rapid pulse concerned me.

The first treatment, I wrote it off to her first acupuncture treatment
jitters. But when it was there the second time, I began to ask more
questions. Her tongue is red with a somewhat scanty coat.  She's a bit
overweight too. That yin xu with phlegm damp accumulation can spell
adult onset diabetes in my experience, but there were no other signs to
support the diabetes idea. Probably a good idea to have her check into
that all the same.

Point is, after more questioning, I learned that she likes to have a
cigarette before her treatment with me. This can also cause a rapid
pulse. We're going to see if it is slower next week when I see her
next.

-al.

On Jan 28, 2005, at 10:00 AM, Will wrote:

>  
> http://articles.health.msn.com/id/100098752/site/100000000
>  
>  
> William R. Morris, L.Ac., OMD, MSEd
>
>
> The mission of this group is to provide a forum for the discussion of
> pulse diagnosis so that a depth of understanding is furthered.
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>  •  To visit your group on the web, go to:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PulseDiagnosis/
>  
>  • 	 To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> PulseDiagnosis-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>  
>  • 	 Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
> Service.
>
>
--
Al Stone, L.Ac.
Pain is inevitable, suffering is optional.
-Adlai Stevenson

The device is pretty good.
Would you kind enough to tell me how can we buy it?
Thanks.

lisheng


--- Phil Rogers <philrogers@...> wrote:

> Hi acubeach
>
> > http://www3.sympatico.ca/renn_scott/pulse-i.html
> Don't forget to
> > click on the "more details..." link.
>
> Have any of you assessed the diagnostic value of
> that system?
>
> How does one contact the inventor?
>
>
> Best regards,
> Phil Rogers MRCVS
> Email: <philrogers@...>
>
> WORK : Teagasc, c/o 1 Esker Lawns, Lucan, Dublin,
> Ireland
> Mobile: 353-87-286-8277; [in the Republic:
> 087-286-8277]
>
> HOME : 1 Esker Lawns, Lucan, Dublin, Ireland
> Tel  : 353-1-6281-222; [in the Republic:
> 01-6281-222]
> WWW  :
> http://homepage.eircom.net/~progers/searchap.htm
>
> Chinese Proverb: "Man who says it can't be done,
> should not interrupt man doing it"
>


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Dear Sean Walsh,

I can not download the attachment.
Would you kind enough to mail me the attachment to my
e-mail?

Thanks and Regards,
lisheng


--- Sean Walsh <sean.walsh@...> wrote:

> This looks interesting however there are several
> assumptions and questions that need to be answered
> before this device is deemed valid -
>
> "The small peizo-electric pressure sensor on each of
> the pulse positions" stated on the website used in
> the machine appears to be pressure dependent - that
> is, relatively more pressure equates to more +++
> signs while less pressure equates to more - - -
> signs.  The question is, is this what is felt by a
> practitioner when the pulse is palpated using the
> Zang/fu//five phase pulse approach??
>
> A problem with peizo-electric pressure sensors is
> the need for these to be accurately placed over the
> blood vessel.  Imagine, if the sensor was placed
> incorrectly then the pulse would be perceived as a
> - ve sign, or, if there is too much movement by the
> subject, then this creates what is termed 'movement
> artefact'.  This would give you a negative +ve sign.
>
> Another difficulty with these devices lays in the
> clarity of the signal - that is, if there is no
> support under the artery, as with the radius or a
> ligament, then the pulse is felt weak or -ve,
> whereas, if this was palpated manually at a slighty
> different angle the pulse maybe perceived as
> stronger than that being showed on the device.
>
> Paramount however, is the question: -  is the
> relative pressure strength, as inferred on the
> website and measured by this machine, what we define
> as 'strong' or 'weak' when we palpate the pulse
> manually??  What about how 'fast' the pressure wave
> hits the finger?  Imagine two pressure waves of
> equal strength - one reaches its maximum amplitude
> quicker than the other.  Which would be perceived
> stronger when palpated manually?  Accordingly, have
> there been studies to correlate the findings from
> these machines against manual palpation.  What was
> the sample size?
>
> As such, I would request that whomever manages to
> contact these people please pose the above questions
> to them.
>
>
> Take care.
>
> Sean.
>
>
>
>
> Dr Sean Walsh, PhD
> Lecturer
> College of TCM
> Department of Health Sciences
> University of Technology, Sydney
>
>
> --
> UTS CRICOS Provider Code:  00099F
> DISCLAIMER: This email message and any accompanying
> attachments may contain
> confidential information.  If you are not the
> intended recipient, do not
> read, use, disseminate, distribute or copy this
> message or attachments.  If
> you have received this message in error, please
> notify the sender immediately
> and delete this message. Any views expressed in this
> message are those of the
> individual sender, except where the sender
> expressly, and with authority,
> states them to be the views the University of
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> opening any attachments, please check them for
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>

> ATTACHMENT part 2 message/rfc822
> Date: Mon, 20 Dec 2004 03:18:05 +0000
> From: Phil Rogers <philrogers@...>
> Subject: [PulseDiagnosis] Re: The future of pulse
> diagnosis?
> To: PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com
>

---------------------------------
Hi acubeach

> http://www3.sympatico.ca/renn_scott/pulse-i.html
Don't forget to
> click on the "more details..." link.

Have any of you assessed the diagnostic value of that
system?

How does one contact the inventor?


Best regards,
Phil Rogers MRCVS
Email: <philrogers@...>

WORK : Teagasc, c/o 1 Esker Lawns, Lucan, Dublin,
Ireland
Mobile: 353-87-286-8277; [in the Republic:
087-286-8277]

HOME : 1 Esker Lawns, Lucan, Dublin, Ireland
Tel  : 353-1-6281-222; [in the Republic: 01-6281-222]
WWW  :
http://homepage.eircom.net/~progers/searchap.htm

Chinese Proverb: "Man who says it can't be done,
should not interrupt man doing it"


The mission of this group is to provide a forum for
the discussion of pulse diagnosis so that a depth of
understanding is furthered.




---------------------------------

UTS CRICOS Provider Code:  00099F
DISCLAIMER: This email message and any accompanying
attachments may containconfidential information.  If
you are not the intended recipient, do notread, use,
disseminate, distribute or copy this message or
attachments.  Ifyou have received this message in
error, please notify the sender immediatelyand delete
this message. Any views expressed in this message are
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expressly, and with authority,states them to be the
views the University of Technology Sydney.
Beforeopening any attachments, please check them for
viruses and defects.




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This message was approved by Will.


Contemporary Chinese Pulse Diagnosis: Beginning Course

with Brandt Stickley, DOM & Hamilton Rott, DOM
February 5 & 6 (9am to 5pm)



Brandt Stickley & Hamilton Rott will present pulse
diagnosis in the lineage of Dr. John HF Shen and Leon
Hammer, MD as described in the book Chinese Pulse
Diagnosis; A Contemporary Approach.  Emphasis in this
2 day intensive training is placed on each student's
ability to palpate the 3 depths and 6 principal
positions associated with Dr. Hammer's system. 
Complementary positions will also be introduced. 
Pulse common qualities, pulse nomenclature and
classification according to sensation wil also be
covered in depth.  Treatment with Dr. Shen's herbal formulas will
be introduced.  Class is limited to 15 students
ensuring in-depth experience with the subtleties of
the pulse.

CONTACT: Dr. Stickley at 321.639.7802 or email
itstheqi@...
A syllabus, handouts and readings for the course will
be available upon registration.

FEES: $180 for licensed practitioners, $150 for
students.

LOCATION: Winter Park, FL

The instructors, Brandt Stickley, DOM and Hamilton
Rott, COM are graduates of American College of Traditional
Chinese Medicine and Dr. Hammer's Master
Course in Contemporary Chinese Pulse Diagnosis, and
continue advanced study closely with Dr. Hammer. 
Hamilton and Brandt are instructors at Dragon Rises
College of Oriental Medicine. They draw upon their
training in both the US and China to make the material
accessible to students with various educational
backgrounds.

Just a quick question for the group.  about a year and half ago,
finnished classes on acupressure and shiatsu and  I was wondering what
are some good books to get started on for pulse diagnosis?  Some thing
that is a little more detailed but easier to read.  I have web that has
no weaver and between heaven and earth  which have been a big help
but as i said  i would like to have more rounded veiw and understanding
of this art.   Thank  you for your help  and great questions and
contributions from everyone.


=====
As always its been a pleasure
Michael



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East Asian neighbours readjusting acupuncture points

Mon Jan 10, 5:08 AM ET

TOKYO (AFP) - Japan, China and South Korea (news - web
sites) plan to standardise "acupuncture points" which
have subtly shifted through their separate practices
in the 2,000-year old Chinese-born therapy.

In a project organised by the World Health
Organisation (WHO) since last March, the three East
Asian nations have found differences in the locations
of 92 of the 361 basic acupuncture points, the Asahi
Shimbun said Monday.

In October, experts from the three countries agreed to
standardise the locations of 77 points with the 15
others to be dealt with by the middle of this year,
the influential Japanese newspaper said.

The WHO is expected to formally determine the basic
acupuncture points in 2006 to help disseminate
Oriental medicine which has been gaining recognition
in the West since the late 1990s, the daily said.

Acupuncture points are said to be located throughout
the body along channels, or "meridians," through which
vital energy circulates to bodily organs.

Illness is attributed to interruption of the energy,
known as qi, and it is treated by inserting needles
into certain acupuncture spots, burning herbs over
them or applying pressures on them.

There are 365 traditionally known acupuncture points
and the WHO has recognised 361 of them.








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Thanks so much Will.  This is very interesting.  I've not had the
chance to study this form of pulse with you but hope I do some time
soon.  I've much enjoyed and benifited from the egroup discussions.

Thanks,

Sharon

On Jan 9, 2005, at 7:11 PM, PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com wrote:

> Hi Sharon -
>
> It's been I think possibly seven years since I've seen you. I hope
> these
> notes find you well and happy.
>
> Downstream in this case would be the direction of qi flow. In this
> conversation (neoclassical pulse diagnosis), it is either ying qi
> inside the vessels or
> wei qi outside the vessels. If it is the spleen that is stagnant and
> preventing free flow of qi, then the night-time wei qi flow towared
> the kidney can be
> effected; if it is the ying qi flow that is blocked then it would be
> from the
> spleen to the heart as an entry/exit block. The back shu point can
> free up the
> flow in the wei qi, ying qi or both.
>
> It could also be the day time wei qi flow, it could be blockage in the
> yang
> ming preventing flow into the yin (yin qiao according to Van Nghi), or
> the
> spleen preventing free flow of return through the yin from the medial
> maleolus to
> the inner canthus, but I think the pulse description was more likeley
> the
> above paragraph.
>
> Confirming symptoms for the wei qi involvement inlcude primarily those
> that
> come and go paroxysmally, or sleep disturbances where the person is up
> and down
> all night, or autoimmune disorders such as interstitial cystitis.
> Confirming
> symptoms for the ying qi cycle include synptoms that extend for
> periods of
> anywhere from 1-6 hours and recur diurnally.
>
> I have never considered in this system the flow along the bladder
> channel,
> but rather movement forward and backward along the generating or
> controlling
> cycle, or movement along the ying qi cycle. This discussion was in the
> Nei Jing
> concerning the penetration of pathogens down the bladder channel.
> However, in
> each burner, say the upper burner it is the heart and lung, a
> controlling cycle
> relation, the middle burner is the spleen and liver again controlling
> cycle.
> And - if we consider the lower burner to maintain some aspects of
> water and
> ministerial fire, it is again controlling cycle.
>
> Regards,
>
> Will
>
>
>
>> Will, what do you mean by the next area downstream? Do you mean the
>> next organ down the Bladder line -- the Stomach?
>
>
Sharon Weizenbaum
86 Henry Street
Amherst, MA  01002
413-549-4021
sweiz@...
www.whitepinehealingarts.com

It seems to me that if, after 3 treatments of an issue that has been
there for 8 years and complicated by aggravating medications and
surgical removal of an organ, you have been able to help her symptoms
for 2-4 days at a time - that's quite incredibly successful.  Don't you
think?  I would continue as I was and encourage her to be encouraged by
such results.  I mean, you may be missing something on the pulse but
you are definitely getting something major too.

Sharon


On Jan 8, 2005, at 8:13 PM, PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com wrote:

>> A 58 y/o female w/ cc of; Extreme gastric pain for 8 years following
>> the removal of her Gb, she awakens every night at 4am w/ extreme
>> nausea, burning and pain on the RUQ. She has a long Hx of anxiety,and
>> has been on the following western meds for the past 8 years
>> (lipitor/antihypertensive, ativan/anxiety & pronactil/GERD).... all
>> of which has GI disorders for side effects.Her diet is horrible, she
>> feels that she only obtains relief from chocolate. She presents w/
>> Dai pulse,topographical is full @ center & spleen channel is very
>> tender on palpitation. Supervisor feels it is Liv overacting on
>> Sp .... I've treated her 3 times, but not able to relieve the 4 am
>> nausea and pain for longer than 2 to 4 days. The more anxious she
>> gets, the quicker the pain & nausea return.I feel as if I'm missing
>> something on the pulse, I can't seem to catch the anxiety or the 4 am
>> timing on the pulse ......... "What am I not seeing, feeling etc,
>> please advise??????"
Sharon Weizenbaum
86 Henry Street
Amherst, MA  01002
413-549-4021
sweiz@...
www.whitepinehealingarts.com