Hi Terijo,

You should be able to contact the device makers (Amplatzer, etc) and ask them to
recommend a surgeon who is experienced with their device.  I went to the
Pediatric Cardiology department at the University of Michigan and saw Dr.
Rocchini.  He has done several hundred of these procedures.  You definitely want
someone who had done more than just a couple.  There are likely a couple of
people in Texas that have done a number of these procedures, it will just
require you to find them.

Good luck,

Mark



--- On Mon, 8/4/08, Terijo Brewton <terijo@...> wrote:

> From: Terijo Brewton <terijo@...>
> Subject: Re: [PFOSupport] Need to understand PFO and best treatments for!
> To: PFOSupport@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Monday, August 4, 2008, 3:43 PM
> It is a nickel mesh, I know that much and I was leery for
> that reason
> alone.
>
> Thank you so much for responding;  I think the doctor's
> don't regularly test
> for allergies.   We have an appointment with a guy who has
> one abour 20 of
> these which doesn't seem like very many.  I'd
> rather travel to someone who
> knows everything and maybe is familiar with various
> devices, not just one.
>
> You know what I mean?
>
> I understand that this procedure is replacing open heart
> surgery - it seems
> like it is the device or lifetime blood thinners.  He got
> clouted with a
> ball last night in softball practice (um.. frequent enough
> occurrence) and
> it raised a large bump - something it would not have done
> earlier.
>
> Thanks so much for your response!  Terijo

Allergy testing for nickel is very quick and easy.  Just go to a
dermatologist and ask for a skin patch test.  If your son is allergic
it will show up as a tiny bump in 2-3 days.  If you are looking for
someone experienced in PFO closures, I would strongly recommend the
UCLA heart institute.  They will do the allergy testing right there.
Good Luck and keep us posted!

Hi there,

I am hosting a call-in Migraine radio show on itunes and Blog Talk
Radio.  It a weekly one hour show that focuses on migraine symptoms,
diagnosis, and treatment.  It will also feature interviews with
prominent US Migraine Specialists and Neurologists.  Please stop by and
check it out http://www.blogtalkradio.com/Migraine
or call in on Monday  at 5 pm eastern at (347) 826-7334

Hope you're having a pain free day!
Solitaire Miles

That is correct. 


----- Original Message ----
From: Violet Flame <violetflame11@...>
To: PFOSupport@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, June 1, 2008 3:41:40 PM
Subject: [PFOSupport] Re: Follow up on the TIA/stroke question.. the second
story..

The MRI will show the damage after if occurs, as far as I know. 

--- In PFOSupport@yahoogroups.com, Sheila Carey <rajalove09@...> wrote:
>
> Should you get an MRI while it is happening, or will it show you've
had a stroke later?
>
>  >^. .^< Meow,
> *~Sheila~*
>
>
>



------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links

The MRI will show the damage after if occurs, as far as I know.

--- In PFOSupport@yahoogroups.com, Sheila Carey <rajalove09@...> wrote:
>
> Should you get an MRI while it is happening, or will it show you've
had a stroke later?
>
>  >^. .^< Meow,
> *~Sheila~*
>
>
>

Hi Nina,

Sorry to hear about what you are going through.  Best
of luck working through the medical system to reach a
definitive diagnosis and get the treatment that makes
YOU comfortable.  The best piece of advice I can give
is to continue to push for what you want.  Working
through the medical system is a terrible experience,
but do not give up until you are satisfied with the
treatment you are getting.  There are always more
doctors and more tests to be run.  Do not give up
until you are comfortable about what is being done to
you.

Unfortunately, I think you are looking for a black and
white answer to a question that is not fully
understood.  As the cause of migraines is not fully
understood, the cause, or even existence of migrainous
stroke is debatable among doctors.  It's kind of like
the treatment of PFO.  Cardiologists typically believe
that it should be aggressively closed to alleviate
stroke risk, while neurologists are much more
conservative about closing it.  The clinical trials
necessary to reach a definitive conclusion are being
run currently, and as such, there is still a lot of
debate about the right course of action.  Until a
"smoking gun" is identified for migranous stroke, i.e.
person undergoing a migrainous stroke while having an
MRI, the very existence of it will be debated.

The cause of stroke is not determined in up to 40% of
cases.  I was lucky in that my stroke occured while
performing a valsalva like manuever (forces the PFO
open) after a long car ride.  This information, along
with a nice white spot on my MRI allowed a reasonably
definitive cause to by hypothesized in my case.

Good luck.

Mark

--- Violet Flame 11 <violetflame11@...> wrote:

> No worry about the rambling, we're here for you.
>   xoxoxoxo
>
> Nina Houston <ninahouston@...> wrote:
>           Mine hasnt had much chance to say much
> about it, he saw me after the initial one and
> ordered the EEG, talked about the follow up with my
> PCm for the second bubble echo(the first wasnt done
> right they dont actually even know how big my PFO
> is, just that i HAVE one.  I may or may not have
> said it in the email before, who knows. Im spacy ..
> so spacy. I know the mechanical/medical differences
> like you explained... One is a clot, etc.. Long
> family history of both stroke and mgiraine actually.
>   I think Im more confused as to how the
> differentiation is made without the clinical
> evidence of damage already done, since i know for a
> fact that there isnt always traces that they can
> find on an MRI. I think that was more my question
> than the actual medical difference between the two,
> cause I actually know that already hehe. Im living
> in a land of semi confusion at the moment, im not
> entirely here. lala land.. Im just sleeping and
> zoning and then sleeping. Sorry I wasnt clear. I
> think I rambled alot. And Im sure that my neuro will
> be able to answer all these rambled questions Im
> asking. I think I know what i was trying to say i
> just wasnt saying what i was trying to say. Not sure
> i am now, either. really. sorry guys I know im
> usually more together. This week has been very
> weird. Thanks for all your answers i appreciate you
> guys puttin up with my rambles LOL! *hugs to
> everyone* you guys are great.
>   I hope it was just a migraine, and one i NEVER
> EVER get again
>   -Nina
>
>
>
>     On May 31, 2008, at 3:11 PM, Violet Flame 11
> wrote:
>
>
>
>   My Neuro, who is from the Mayo Clinic, says that
> people can have brain damage from a prolonged
> migraine.  It is called Migrainous stroke.  It isn't
> really common, but it is caused when the arteries in
> the brain remain closed in the aura phase for too
> long, causing brain damage.  This is very different
> from a typical stroke which is usually caused by a
> blood clot.
>
>   Prolonged migraine auras can cause brain damage,
> thus a stroke.  This is usually diagnosed with an
> MRI.  I take nitroglycerine tablets when I have a
> prolonged aura to stop it, and to keep from having
> brain damage from it.  The nitro gives me a slight
> headache, but I use oxygen with it and that usually
> stops the pain within 3-5 minutes.  I use nitro
> several times a week to stop prolonged migraine
> auras.  I have been having them for 14 years now.
> My neurologist isn't sure if my 2 previous strokes
> were caused by bloodclots from my PFO or from
> prolonged auras.  I have had MRI angiograms while I
> was having an aura, and the scans showed narrowing
> of my arteries.  It's a very confusing picture.  So
> to rule out stroke I use a blood thinner daily, I
> take Verapamil, a calcium channel blocker, to keep
> my arteries relaxed and open, and I use nitro and
> oxygen when I have a prolonged migraine aura.  This
> has kept me from having any new strokes.  I also use
> steroids, a Medrol dose
>  pack,  when I have a cluster of migraine auras.
>   I would reccomend this kind of reigmen to anyone
> having lots of migraine auras or tia's.
>
> Nina Houston <ninahouston@...> wrote:
>       I am actually still veyr confused as to the
> difference of complex migraine and TIA/stroke.
> Obviously I know what a migraine is, the mechanism
> behind it is, and what the different types of
> stroke, but the little I've found with complex
> migraines sound exactly like a TIA/stroke and even
> say that they can cause long term damage and put you
> at a high risk for TIA/stroke?? Im really confused
> at the diagnosis. Is the only difference that I dont
> fit the qualifying "risk factors" in the ER doctors
> eyes and so because I get chronic migraines they
> assume its that because im not a smoker, dont have
> high cholestorol etc? They didn't do an MRI they
> just made sure i wasnt bleeding in my brain.. Im
> fully aware(now that im aware hah) that CTs arent
> conclusive of TIA/stroke they just show if youre
> hemmorhaging.. hence why theyre done immediately(or
> in my case, many hours later..) in the ER.  My neuro
> may order one. he did one not long ago to check for
> damage because I lived in a very
>  toxic environment for about five years, but that
> was  before this so it may be good. he will have a
> before and after picture Idk.   I had my EEG
> yesterday. The tech was very nice. Although realized
> immediately from looking at the monitor that I had a
> migraine, and then had me do a hyperventalating
> exercise to make me aggravate it. That was fun let
> me tell you. She apologized, I think she felt really
> bad. I wonder if they can tell off an EEG? My mom
> had one after her TIA and they saw nothing,
> absolutely nothing, on any of her tests. all of her
> everything was fine. every single test. But it was
> completely, blatantly clear that it was a miniature
> stroke.
>   after they had my hyperventalate to make my
> migraine worse, they flashed strobe lights in my
> eyes. Besides that the test was fine. I guess its a
> good chance for them to really see what my brain
> does when im having one. After six years of those
> theyve never done an EEG so, now they finally have
> medical documented proof that hey, ive got a
> migraine. hahaha. anyways, afterwards she asked me
> if my migraine was on the front right side. i told
> her yes.. and that mine are 98% of the time or more
> left side (on the front) migraines.. Thats pretty
> freaky. She knew where it was without me saying
> anything, they didnt ask me for a pain scale or "are
> you in pain today" none of that stuff before the
> test.. Guess she knew what she was lookin at. I hear
> the actual results when I go back to my doctor of
> course, she knew I had a migraine so could ask about
> that :P.
>   Sorry Im rambling again. ANyways the initial
> question is.. what in the world is the DIFFERENCE?!
> I cant find ANYTHING! between complex migraines and
> a TIA/stroke as far as I can tell they look, feel,
> act the same.. but the diagnosis is one word vs
> another word. Obviously the medical mechanism would
> be different, a clot versus just a migraine that
> causes these neurologic changes, but how do they
> tell. Like in the case of my mom, who had all her
> tests come back clear?
>   Im gonna go back and sleep. Its 9:30 am i just
> woke up i tink im gonna go take a nap haha.
>
>
>             Sometimes it can be very difficult for a
> physician to tell the two
> apart. That's why it's VERY important for the
> patient to have an MRI
> and NOT a CAT scan, because a CAT scan misses little
> bits of damage and
> lesions that the MRI can see.
>
> The other way to tell if you've had a stroke vs. a
> complex migraine is
> if the symptoms don't go away after 24 hours. I have
> had 2 strokes
> now, and I have complex migraines weekly. When I had
> my larger stroke,
> the blindness I was experienced never went away.
> That was 23 years
> ago, and I am still partially blind. I can only see
> with half of my
> visual field. The blindness was caused by a stroke
> to my left
> occipital lobe. For about 3 months after my stroke I
> was unable to
> speak clearly, or count numbers, and I still have
> difficulty with
> math. Also after my stroke, my right side was weak
> and I had
> difficulty walking for about 2 weeks. Not just
> limping, but falling
> over because I had no strength or balance on my
> right side, with my
> left foot dragging behind me, and the corner of my
> mouth still hangs a
> bit to this day, and my smile is lopsided.
>
> The only way a Doctor can SAFELY diagnose a stroke
> is by an MRI.
> Insist on it.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>   http://www.cafepress.com/lechatnoir.94959936
>
>
>
>
>
=== message truncated ===

Mine hasnt had much chance to say much about it, he saw me after the initial one and ordered the EEG, talked about the follow up with my PCm for the second bubble echo(the first wasnt done right they dont actually even know how big my PFO is, just that i HAVE one.

I may or may not have said it in the email before, who knows. Im spacy .. so spacy. I know the mechanical/medical differences like you explained... One is a clot, etc.. Long family history of both stroke and mgiraine actually.

I think Im more confused as to how the differentiation is made without the clinical evidence of damage already done, since i know for a fact that there isnt always traces that they can find on an MRI. I think that was more my question than the actual medical difference between the two, cause I actually know that already hehe. Im living in a land of semi confusion at the moment, im not entirely here. lala land.. Im just sleeping and zoning and then sleeping. Sorry I wasnt clear. I think I rambled alot. And Im sure that my neuro will be able to answer all these rambled questions Im asking. I think I know what i was trying to say i just wasnt saying what i was trying to say. Not sure i am now, either. really. sorry guys I know im usually more together. This week has been very weird. Thanks for all your answers i appreciate you guys puttin up with my rambles LOL! *hugs to everyone* you guys are great.

I hope it was just a migraine, and one i NEVER EVER get again

-Nina

On May 31, 2008, at 3:11 PM, Violet Flame 11 wrote:

My Neuro, who is from the Mayo Clinic, says that people can have brain damage from a prolonged migraine.  It is called Migrainous stroke.  It isn't really common, but it is caused when the arteries in the brain remain closed in the aura phase for too long, causing brain damage.  This is very different from a typical stroke which is usually caused by a blood clot.

 

Prolonged migraine auras can cause brain damage, thus a stroke.  This is usually diagnosed with an MRI.  I take nitroglycerine tablets when I have a prolonged aura to stop it, and to keep from having brain damage from it.  The nitro gives me a slight headache, but I use oxygen with it and that usually stops the pain within 3-5 minutes.  I use nitro several times a week to stop prolonged migraine auras.  I have been having them for 14 years now.  My neurologist isn't sure if my 2 previous strokes were caused by bloodclots from my PFO or from prolonged auras.  I have had MRI angiograms while I was having an aura, and the scans showed narrowing of my arteries.  It's a very confusing picture.  So to rule out stroke I use a blood thinner daily, I take Verapamil, a calcium channel blocker, to keep my arteries relaxed and open, and I use nitro and oxygen when I have a prolonged migraine aura.  This has kept me from having any new strokes.  I also use steroids, a Medrol dose pack,  when I have a cluster of migraine auras.

I would reccomend this kind of reigmen to anyone having lots of migraine auras or tia's.

Nina Houston <ninahouston@hawaii.rr.com> wrote:

I am actually still veyr confused as to the difference of complex migraine and TIA/stroke. Obviously I know what a migraine is, the mechanism behind it is, and what the different types of stroke, but the little I've found with complex migraines sound exactly like a TIA/stroke and even say that they can cause long term damage and put you at a high risk for TIA/stroke?? Im really confused at the diagnosis. Is the only difference that I dont fit the qualifying "risk factors" in the ER doctors eyes and so because I get chronic migraines they assume its that because im not a smoker, dont have high cholestorol etc? They didn't do an MRI they just made sure i wasnt bleeding in my brain.. Im fully aware(now that im aware hah) that CTs arent conclusive of TIA/stroke they just show if youre hemmorhaging.. hence why theyre done immediately(or in my case, many hours later..) in the ER.  My neuro may order one. he did one not long ago to check for damage because I lived in a very toxic environment for about five years, but that was  before this so it may be good. he will have a before and after picture Idk. 

I had my EEG yesterday. The tech was very nice. Although realized immediately from looking at the monitor that I had a migraine, and then had me do a hyperventalating exercise to make me aggravate it. That was fun let me tell you. She apologized, I think she felt really bad. I wonder if they can tell off an EEG? My mom had one after her TIA and they saw nothing, absolutely nothing, on any of her tests. all of her everything was fine. every single test. But it was completely, blatantly clear that it was a miniature stroke. 

after they had my hyperventalate to make my migraine worse, they flashed strobe lights in my eyes. Besides that the test was fine. I guess its a good chance for them to really see what my brain does when im having one. After six years of those theyve never done an EEG so, now they finally have medical documented proof that hey, ive got a migraine. hahaha. anyways, afterwards she asked me if my migraine was on the front right side. i told her yes.. and that mine are 98% of the time or more left side (on the front) migraines.. Thats pretty freaky. She knew where it was without me saying anything, they didnt ask me for a pain scale or "are you in pain today" none of that stuff before the test.. Guess she knew what she was lookin at. I hear the actual results when I go back to my doctor of course, she knew I had a migraine so could ask about that :P.

Sorry Im rambling again. ANyways the initial question is.. what in the world is the DIFFERENCE?! I cant find ANYTHING! between complex migraines and a TIA/stroke as far as I can tell they look, feel, act the same.. but the diagnosis is one word vs another word. Obviously the medical mechanism would be different, a clot versus just a migraine that causes these neurologic changes, but how do they tell. Like in the case of my mom, who had all her tests come back clear? 

Im gonna go back and sleep. Its 9:30 am i just woke up i tink im gonna go take a nap haha.

Sometimes it can be very difficult for a physician to tell the two 
apart. That's why it's VERY important for the patient to have an MRI 
and NOT a CAT scan, because a CAT scan misses little bits of damage and 
lesions that the MRI can see. 

The other way to tell if you've had a stroke vs. a complex migraine is 
if the symptoms don't go away after 24 hours. I have had 2 strokes 
now, and I have complex migraines weekly. When I had my larger stroke, 
the blindness I was experienced never went away. That was 23 years 
ago, and I am still partially blind. I can only see with half of my 
visual field. The blindness was caused by a stroke to my left 
occipital lobe. For about 3 months after my stroke I was unable to 
speak clearly, or count numbers, and I still have difficulty with 
math. Also after my stroke, my right side was weak and I had 
difficulty walking for about 2 weeks. Not just limping, but falling 
over because I had no strength or balance on my right side, with my 
left foot dragging behind me, and the corner of my mouth still hangs a 
bit to this day, and my smile is lopsided. 

The only way a Doctor can SAFELY diagnose a stroke is by an MRI. 
Insist on it.

http://www.cafepress.com/lechatnoir.94959936

I am actually still veyr confused as to the difference of complex migraine and TIA/stroke. Obviously I know what a migraine is, the mechanism behind it is, and what the different types of stroke, but the little I've found with complex migraines sound exactly like a TIA/stroke and even say that they can cause long term damage and put you at a high risk for TIA/stroke?? Im really confused at the diagnosis. Is the only difference that I dont fit the qualifying "risk factors" in the ER doctors eyes and so because I get chronic migraines they assume its that because im not a smoker, dont have high cholestorol etc? They didn't do an MRI they just made sure i wasnt bleeding in my brain.. Im fully aware(now that im aware hah) that CTs arent conclusive of TIA/stroke they just show if youre hemmorhaging.. hence why theyre done immediately(or in my case, many hours later..) in the ER.  My neuro may order one. he did one not long ago to check for damage because I lived in a very toxic environment for about five years, but that was  before this so it may be good. he will have a before and after picture Idk. 

I had my EEG yesterday. The tech was very nice. Although realized immediately from looking at the monitor that I had a migraine, and then had me do a hyperventalating exercise to make me aggravate it. That was fun let me tell you. She apologized, I think she felt really bad. I wonder if they can tell off an EEG? My mom had one after her TIA and they saw nothing, absolutely nothing, on any of her tests. all of her everything was fine. every single test. But it was completely, blatantly clear that it was a miniature stroke. 

after they had my hyperventalate to make my migraine worse, they flashed strobe lights in my eyes. Besides that the test was fine. I guess its a good chance for them to really see what my brain does when im having one. After six years of those theyve never done an EEG so, now they finally have medical documented proof that hey, ive got a migraine. hahaha. anyways, afterwards she asked me if my migraine was on the front right side. i told her yes.. and that mine are 98% of the time or more left side (on the front) migraines.. Thats pretty freaky. She knew where it was without me saying anything, they didnt ask me for a pain scale or "are you in pain today" none of that stuff before the test.. Guess she knew what she was lookin at. I hear the actual results when I go back to my doctor of course, she knew I had a migraine so could ask about that :P.

Sorry Im rambling again. ANyways the initial question is.. what in the world is the DIFFERENCE?! I cant find ANYTHING! between complex migraines and a TIA/stroke as far as I can tell they look, feel, act the same.. but the diagnosis is one word vs another word. Obviously the medical mechanism would be different, a clot versus just a migraine that causes these neurologic changes, but how do they tell. Like in the case of my mom, who had all her tests come back clear? 

Im gonna go back and sleep. Its 9:30 am i just woke up i tink im gonna go take a nap haha.

Sometimes it can be very difficult for a physician to tell the two 
apart. That's why it's VERY important for the patient to have an MRI 
and NOT a CAT scan, because a CAT scan misses little bits of damage and 
lesions that the MRI can see. 

The other way to tell if you've had a stroke vs. a complex migraine is 
if the symptoms don't go away after 24 hours. I have had 2 strokes 
now, and I have complex migraines weekly. When I had my larger stroke, 
the blindness I was experienced never went away. That was 23 years 
ago, and I am still partially blind. I can only see with half of my 
visual field. The blindness was caused by a stroke to my left 
occipital lobe. For about 3 months after my stroke I was unable to 
speak clearly, or count numbers, and I still have difficulty with 
math. Also after my stroke, my right side was weak and I had 
difficulty walking for about 2 weeks. Not just limping, but falling 
over because I had no strength or balance on my right side, with my 
left foot dragging behind me, and the corner of my mouth still hangs a 
bit to this day, and my smile is lopsided. 

The only way a Doctor can SAFELY diagnose a stroke is by an MRI. 
Insist on it.

Hi Sheila,
You have certainly had to deal with alot of health problems in your
young life.  I'm very sorry to hear about them.  I'm glad that your
doctors were able to diagnose the pfo, and if they treat you, it
might save you from having a stroke in the future.  Please get
allergy tested before they stick the implant in you.  Some patients
are allergic to the nickel in the implants.  The testing is safe and
easy, and you can go to a dermatologist for it.  It's called a skin
patch test, and the doc just puts a tiny smear of the metals on your
skin under a band-aid for a few days, and if you are allergic, you
grow a bump.  It's painless and simple, and it's the best way to know
if you'll be allergic to anything in the device.  It's protocol at
UCLA now for anyone having any kind of heart implant, because so many
people are allergic to nickel, which is a key component in the
implants.  You have had so many problems, and with immune system
complications due to your kidney and mono, I would strongly suggest
you air on the safe side.  If you are allergic to the implant once
it's in you, it can make your migraine auras worse, and weaken your
immune system.  A Dr. at UCLA, Jonathan Tobis, published a study
concerning this a few years ago, which is why UCLA is so careful now
to test people.  The allergy can also cause heart palpatations too.

I hope that you are tested, and find that you can take the device.
In the meantime, I hope that your doctors have you on plavix to keep
your blood from clotting.

Let us know how it goes!

Sometimes it can be very difficult for a physician to tell the two
apart.  That's why it's VERY important for the patient to have an MRI
and NOT a CAT scan, because a CAT scan misses little bits of damage and
lesions that the MRI can see.

The other way to tell if you've had a stroke vs. a complex migraine is
if the symptoms don't go away after 24 hours.  I have had 2 strokes
now, and I have complex migraines weekly.  When I had my larger stroke,
the blindness I was experienced never went away.  That was 23 years
ago, and I am still partially blind.  I can only see with half of my
visual field.  The blindness was caused by a stroke to my left
occipital lobe.  For about 3 months after my stroke I was unable to
speak clearly, or count numbers, and I still have difficulty with
math.  Also after my stroke, my right side was weak and I had
difficulty walking for about 2 weeks.  Not just limping, but falling
over because I had no strength or balance on my right side, with my
left foot dragging behind me, and the corner of my mouth still hangs a
bit to this day, and my smile is lopsided.

The only way a Doctor can SAFELY diagnose a stroke is by an MRI.
Insist on it.

Those are the symptoms I have had with my migraines.



--- In PFOSupport@yahoogroups.com, Violet Flame 11 <violetflame11@...>
wrote:
>
> When I had 2 left brain strokes, each time I experienced right sided
numbness and weakness, loss of vision, dizzyness and confusion,
inability to speak or walk or coordinate movement, or remember phone
numbers.  I tried to dial the phone for 911 and couldn't get my brain
to make sense of the numbers.   When I spoke it was jibberish and I
couldn't put sentences together, and I was so dizzy I felt like I was
drunk.
>
> Nina Houston <ninahouston@...> wrote:          can anyone who has
had a left-brain Stroke or TIA please describe it? I had a .. very
unsettling experience a little while ago and its worrying me.  Thankyou.
>   -Nina
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> http://www.cafepress.com/lechatnoir.94959936
>

Hey all. i did get all your responses. I'm just exhausted and too tired to answer every one, but thank you.

Here is a brief over run of the second event. The first was mid afternoon on..... Tuesday? Im still having trouble remembering the days, I have to stop and remember what day it is.. I believe it was about four-ish, I remember calling my mom after to ask her what hers was like , it occured to me that what had happened was BAD and I should call her.. and her call log showed a time shortly after four PM. Besides that I can't be more spacific. The rest of the day is just kind of a fog, not the same kind of fog though just kind of a spacy fog like when you have a bad migraine and youre just out of it. Although for the whole day , looking back, I was really out of it. (24 hour period) Doing really braindead things I wouldnt normally do. I'm sorry if this is repeated stuff. Anyways, its like i've just lost some things. Like, apparantly, I put my Iphone in my pocket of my shorts, which have very shallow pockets, and ended up standing up and it fell top first onto the concrete floor and now its broken. i've always been very careful with it, because its expensive. I swear, even now, I can remember putting the bottle of the rest of my prescription in my door pocket of my car(a really stupid place to put it, thinking about it now, not somewhere i normally put it, its either in my purse or on my desk). But i swear, SWEAR i remember puting it there wednesday (earlier in the day, shortly before the second episode), and I went to get it, KNOWING it was there, and it wasnt. and rather than just looking for it in a calm fashion even though I would naturally worry, I freaked. I mean totally freaked out. Which is.. Not like me. And then after a few minutes of freaking out, I opened my purse and it was right there on top, where I remember it was before the memory of putting it in the door pocket. So, who knows if I ever even PUT it there. Anyways. Those are my spaz moments the day after the initial one and before the second incident. Had a couple other small things I did that jus went .. Huh.. whyd I do that. But nothing that really sticks out in my head the way those do.

The second event.. I still had a migraine from the first keep in mind, I got a migraine AFTER it happened and it continued through the next day.

I was on the phone with my mom, I remember that. Not sure what we were talking about. Or even exactly how it came on. She says I started saying "My head, my head, my head, my head" and then stopped talking. We were out eating, me my dad and my kids, killing time for my refills to be ready(had just seen then neuro). I started responding fairly quickly, from what my dad said. During which, I realized at one point I was holding a phone (I usually hold it with my left hand) and that my mom was talking to me and I should answer. I dont know what she was saying. At some point apparantly she hung up because my dad says she called him when i didnd answer, but my mind wasnt registering things that quickly. I dont remember if anything went numb that time, it could be or not and maybe it was over too quickly. Although, I was not really "back" for hours.  Disoriented, unable to form sentences quickly. Fast heartrate when i went in(most of this is recited from my mom, I have bit and piece memories from the hospital for the first part of the time we were in. Some vague memories and impressions..). I could not remember my husbands birthday(for our insurance they ask sponsors social and birthday, military), i spouted out something that I guess was a mix between his, mine , and some random number.. Could not do simple motor functions like putting on a jacket. When they had me sign in, apparantly i was misspelling my name too, and writing very .. very.. slowly. I have a signature as bad as a doctors most the time hah.  And my mom says when they did the neurological check, she doesnt know about the squeeze this squeeze that parts, how the right -left side compared, but when the doctor had me hold my arms up and put his hand over my eyes, my right arm kept dropping. I vaguely remember that. Ive never had that happen during one of those, even during my worst worst worst worst migraines. 

The ER took .. three? four..? hours to do the CT scan.. They put me in a room and forgot we were even there. im not entirely sure they were taking it very seriously, as their diagnosis came back as complex migraine. My mom had to dog them about the CT scan, and then the results. And by the time they did it, I was alert and coherent again. I do remember evven before not being really alert thinking they wre being really slow, but I also think that my sense of time is really distorted.. and i remember trying to speak and the words feeling very very HEAVY. But I thought i was talking straight. 

Anyways. Like I said alot of the spacifics, i know because my mom told me. I dont even know if this is a very good portrayal of the event, im just tired. My minds tired, by bodys tired, im just tired. i want to just lay down and sleep. Of course, Im home with my kids and my husbands on travel so i have to be awake. Lifes not fair. :P :)

That was the second one. I go in for an EEG today.

-Nina

Please get an MRI right away!

Caffeine Fiend <ninahouston@hawaii.rr.com> wrote:

Hi. Was trying to send this off my email program and its locked up i dont exactly know
why. Copy and pasting it into yahoo directly.. :P

yesterday , i was sitting at my computer and doing.. something. dont remember what right
now. And very suddenly I felt... Like i was here but not here? Im not entirely sure how to
explain it. Like nothing really mattered, and i wasnt really in my body but i was, and
almost surreal. And at first all i knew was that i was supposed to click my mouse. Not that
i was on my computer or at home or anything spacific, just, click the mouse. And i had
some thoughts run through my brain but they were all almost just like.. passing thoughts.
I knew i was supposed to click my mouse and it wasn't clicking, and the realization came
to me that.. well its not clicking because, i cant feel my hand.. why can't i feel my hand..
well i dont think thats good. I thhink that repeated? But it was so.. lala land almost? I
seriously dont know really how to explain it.. then somewhere in there i realized that hey i
cant feel my arm either, I'm not sure if its because I tried to move my arm when i couldnt
mvoe my hand or what but the thought got triggered that it wasnt just my hand.. But i
didnt care it was just like.. a side thought. oh, yeah, k... i dont think thats good.. and then
as suddenly as it was there it was gone and everything was back. a couple minutes later i
got this horrible migriane on my left side, which is where i usually get them.
(to be 100% clear i use the mouse with my right hand , so it was the right side that all this
happened on jus realized i didnt say this spacifically)

The reason it even occured to me that it might be a TIA is because my mom had one in
the left brain a few years back, due to a PFO. I didnt go into ER, the one here is horrible
and by the time i could have gotten in (they dont take anyone seriously unless theyre
dead) i might as well have waited to see my dr this morning which is what i did.
In raelity who knows, the only known risk factor is that i also have a PFO, im only 26, and
eat a decently healthy diet, etc. I saw my PCM today and he basically said, im glad you
have a neuro appnt today or id tell you to get in right away. I wont diagnose it cause im
not a specialist, but my opinion is that it is probably a TIA. So unofficially, thats the
guess... We'll see what the neuro says today i suppose.

-Nina

--- In PFOSupport@yahoogroups.com, Carolina Maldonado <cmaldonado82@...> wrote:
>
> Hello,
> I had a right brain TIA about a year ago. But it all started out with horrible headache
that I thought it was a migraine. And then it was just pain on my right side of my head.
What did you experience? I did not go to the ER right away, I went a couple of days later
when the pain was still there, and they told me right away that I had a stroke. And that I
was lucky that it was on the right side of my brain.
> Carolina
>
> Nina Houston <ninahouston@...> wrote:
> can anyone who has had a left-brain Stroke or TIA please describe it? I had a ..
very unsettling experience a little while ago and its worrying me. Thankyou.
> -Nina
>

http://www.cafepress.com/lechatnoir.94959936

Hi. Was trying to send this off my email program and its locked up i dont exactly know
why. Copy and pasting it into yahoo directly.. :P

yesterday , i was sitting at my computer and doing.. something. dont remember what right
now. And very suddenly I felt... Like i was here but not here? Im not entirely sure how to
explain it. Like nothing really mattered, and i wasnt really in my body but i was, and
almost surreal. And at first all i knew was that i was supposed to click my mouse. Not that
i was on my computer or at home or anything spacific, just, click the mouse. And i had
some thoughts run through my brain but they were all almost just like.. passing thoughts.
I knew i was supposed to click my mouse and it wasn't clicking, and the realization came
to me that.. well its not clicking because, i cant feel my hand.. why can't i feel my hand..
well i dont think thats good. I thhink that repeated? But it was so.. lala land almost? I
seriously dont know really how to explain it.. then somewhere in there i realized that hey i
cant feel my arm either, I'm not sure if its because I tried to move my arm when i couldnt
mvoe my hand or what but the thought got triggered that it wasnt just my hand.. But i
didnt care it was just like.. a side thought. oh, yeah, k... i dont think thats good.. and then
as suddenly as it was there it was gone and everything was back. a couple minutes later i
got this horrible migriane on my left side, which is where i usually get them.
(to be 100% clear i use the mouse with my right hand , so it was the right side that all this
happened on jus realized i didnt say this spacifically)

The reason it even occured to me that it might be a TIA is because my mom had one in
the left brain a few years back, due to a PFO. I didnt go into ER, the one here is horrible
and by the time i could have gotten in (they dont take anyone seriously unless theyre
dead) i might as well have waited to see my dr this morning which is what i did.
In raelity who knows, the only known risk factor is that i also have a PFO, im only 26, and
eat a decently healthy diet, etc. I saw my PCM today and he basically said, im glad you
have a neuro appnt today or id tell you to get in right away. I wont diagnose it cause im
not a specialist, but my opinion is that it is probably a TIA. So unofficially, thats the
guess... We'll see what the neuro says today i suppose.

-Nina

--- In PFOSupport@yahoogroups.com, Carolina Maldonado <cmaldonado82@...> wrote:
>
> Hello,
> I had a right brain TIA about a year ago. But it all started out with horrible headache
that I thought it was a migraine. And then it was just pain on my right side of my head.
What did you experience? I did not go to the ER right away, I went a couple of days later
when the pain was still there, and they told me right away that I had a stroke. And that I
was lucky that it was on the right side of my brain.
> Carolina
>
> Nina Houston <ninahouston@...> wrote:
> can anyone who has had a left-brain Stroke or TIA please describe it? I had a ..
very unsettling experience a little while ago and its worrying me. Thankyou.
> -Nina
>

--- In PFOSupport@yahoogroups.com, Amy Brogna <amybrogna6@...> wrote:
>that is exactly how i would describe it, like an aura ( blochy, like
looking at the sun then looking away) I had 2 one lasted 10 mins one
lasted 1 hour.this was diagnosed as a TIA. but also had loss of
speech the second time. Both after physical activity.
> Was it an aura?
>   At first when I got them I was sure I was having a stroke...
>
> Denise <goldilocks35@...> wrote:
>           I am not sure what a left-brain stroke is.  I have had a
stroke.  If you have concerns, no offense but you should be calling a
doctor and getting looked at.  Why are you holding off?
>
> Nina Houston <ninahouston@...> wrote:       can anyone who has had
a left-brain Stroke or TIA please describe it? I had a .. very
unsettling experience a little while ago and its worrying me.
Thankyou.
>   -Nina
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Life is all about holding on and letting go.
>

I was told that I had migraine with aura. Which didn't
really seem right to me at the time, because there was
never a migraine of any type, absolutely no pain. And
if there is anything I am incredibly familiar with,
that is migraines. I have had one everyday since I was
a teenager. (although not everyday since the PFO
closure).  But for me, I had one small pupil, and one
larger one, and I was acting quite strange, and scared
my boyfriend, and I truly believed and justified that
the entire left side of the world was missing. I
compensated for that by walking sideways (kind of like
a crab) and when I was driving, I was constantly
running over the curb, to try to remain in (what I
thought) was the middle of the road. I was driving
when it all began, and am lucky I didn't kill anyone.
I ended up going to the hospital and they told me it
was aura and gave me an imitrex injection which did
not do anything. We waited and waited and then finally
the doctor asked what I would do if I had a very bad
migraine (which I thought was so weird b/c once again,
I was experiencing no pain) I told him I would down
like 6 aspirin. And so we tried that, and then all of
a sudden it lifted. It was like almost instantly the
room was all there, everyone had a whole face again,
everything that was cut in half was whole again, and I
felt really strange for thinking that way the 4 hours
before. It lasted 4-5 hours and after taking the
aspirin it was gone in about 10-20 minutes. And there
was never a headache or migraine. I was told this was
probably a TIA years later when I was diagnose with a
PFO with bilateral flow.
I hope that helps you out, if you need more examples,
I had another one, but it was much less severe, and as
a result unclear if it was a TIA or aura really.
Leigh Anne DelRay



--- Amy Brogna <amybrogna6@...> wrote:

> Was it an aura?
>   At first when I got them I was sure I was having a
> stroke...
>
> Denise <goldilocks35@...> wrote:
>           I am not sure what a left-brain stroke is.
>  I have had a stroke.  If you have concerns, no
> offense but you should be calling a doctor and
> getting looked at.  Why are you holding off?
>
> Nina Houston <ninahouston@...> wrote:
>  can anyone who has had a left-brain Stroke or TIA
> please describe it? I had a .. very unsettling
> experience a little while ago and its worrying me.
> Thankyou.
>   -Nina
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Life is all about holding on and letting go.
>
>
>
>

can anyone who has had a left-brain Stroke or TIA please describe it? I had a .. very unsettling experience a little while ago and its worrying me.

Thankyou.

-Nina