Letter to the Expositor Editor <opinion@...>

As a well-known as a high-stakes professional poker player
your Nov 21 2006 article "Thug attacks man near city's
casino" reminded me how it's no fun cashing out and walking
home with five or six thousand dollars in my pockets.

I wrote to the casino management urging them to allow gamers
to leave our cash on deposit like in most other gaming
establishments in Ontario and the world so gamblers don't
risk being mugged carrying all that cash around and so the
casino can make the interest while holding our money.

Sadly, given Brantford Charity Casino management has refused
to permit their poker clientele to switch from slower $20-
bet game at the cheaper $14/hour per player to the faster
$25-bet game at a more profitable $16/hour which has cost
charities over a hundred thousand dollars this year, the
refusal to accept cash on deposit is just more of evidence
of management's loser style that may result in even more
muggings given such lucrative pickings walking out of their
doors.

John C. Turmel, B. Eng.,
8-37 Colborne St. E.,
Brantford ON N3T 2G3,
Tel/fax: 519-753-0645
Email: turmel@...


--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics

JCT: This will be on TV tonight in Britain. I've known
this for years since William Turner and John Christian's
book "The assassination of Robert F. Kennedy" ISBN 1-56025-
058-5. Of course, when it's covered up by Secret Government,
it usually stays covered unless they want it out. Stone's
JFK was also right on the money sheep-dipping him honest so
we'd believe him about 911.

>Did the CIA kill Bobby Kennedy?
>Posted by: "Augustine" a.tulips@... auberzine
>Date: Sun Nov 19, 2006 10:39 pm ((PST))

http://www.guardian.co.uk/usa/story/0,,1952393,00.html

JCT: Guardian, a great paper.

In 1968, Robert Kennedy seemed likely to follow his brother,
John, into the White House. Then, on June 6, he was
assassinated - apparently by a lone gunman. But Shane
O'Sullivan says he has evidence implicating three CIA agents
in the murder

Monday November 20, 2006
Guardian

At first, it seems an open-and-shut case. On June 5 1968,
Robert Kennedy wins the California Democratic primary and is
set to challenge Richard Nixon for the White House. After
midnight, he finishes his victory speech at the Ambassador
hotel in Los Angeles and is shaking hands with kitchen staff
in a crowded pantry when 24-year-old Palestinian Sirhan
Sirhan steps down from a tray-stacker with a "sick,
villainous smile" on his face and starts firing at Kennedy
with an eight-shot revolver.
As Kennedy lies dying on the pantry floor, Sirhan is
arrested as the lone assassin. He carries the motive in his
shirt-pocket (a clipping about Kennedy's plans to sell
bombers to Israel) and notebooks at his house seem to
incriminate him. But the autopsy report suggests Sirhan
could not have fired the shots that killed Kennedy.
Witnesses place Sirhan's gun several feet in front of
Kennedy, but the fatal bullet is fired from one inch behind.
And more bullet-holes are found in the pantry than Sirhan's
gun can hold, suggesting a second gunman is involved.
Sirhan's notebooks show a bizarre series of "automatic
writing" - "RFK must die RFK must be killed - Robert F
Kennedy must be assassinated before 5 June 68" - and even
under hypnosis, he has never been able to remember shooting
Kennedy. He recalls "being led into a dark place by a girl
who wanted coffee", then being choked by an angry mob.
Defence psychiatrists conclude he was in a trance at the
time of the shooting and leading psychiatrists suggest he
may have be a hypnotically programmed assassin.

Three years ago, I started writing a screenplay about the
assassination of Robert Kennedy, caught up in a strange tale
of second guns and "Manchurian candidates" (as the movie
termed brainwashed assassins). As I researched the case, I
uncovered new video and photographic evidence suggesting
that three senior CIA operatives were behind the killing. I
did not buy the official ending that Sirhan acted alone, and
started dipping into the nether-world of "assassination
research", crossing paths with David Sanchez Morales, a
fearsome Yaqui Indian.

Morales was a legendary figure in CIA covert operations.
According to close associate Tom Clines, if you saw Morales
walking down the street in a Latin American capital, you
knew a coup was about to happen. When the subject of the
Kennedys came up in a late-night session with friends in
1973, Morales launched into a tirade that finished: "I was
in Dallas when we got the son of a bitch and I was in Los
Angeles when we got the little bastard." From this line grew
my odyssey into the spook world of the 60s and the secrets
behind the death of Bobby Kennedy.

Working from a Cuban photograph of Morales from 1959, I
viewed news coverage of the assassination to see if I could
spot the man the Cubans called El Gordo - The Fat One.
Fifteen minutes in, there he was, standing at the back of
the ballroom, in the moments between the end of Kennedy's
speech and the shooting. Thirty minutes later, there he was
again, casually floating around the darkened ballroom while
an associate with a pencil moustache took notes.

The source of early research on Morales was Bradley Ayers, a
retired US army captain who had been seconded to JM-Wave,
the CIA's Miami base in 1963, to work closely with chief of
operations Morales on training Cuban exiles to run sabotage
raids on Castro. I tracked Ayers down to a small town in
Wisconsin and emailed him stills of Morales and another guy
I found suspicious - a man who is pictured entering the
ballroom from the direction of the pantry moments after the
shooting, clutching a small container to his body, and being
waved towards an exit by a Latin associate.

Ayers' response was instant. He was 95% sure that the first
figure was Morales and equally sure that the other man was
Gordon Campbell, who worked alongside Morales at JM-Wave in
1963 and was Ayers' case officer shortly before the JFK
assassination.

I put my script aside and flew to the US to interview key
witnesses for a documentary on the unfolding story. In
person, Ayers positively identified Morales and Campbell and
introduced me to David Rabern, a freelance operative who was
part of the Bay of Pigs invasion force in 1961 and was at
the Ambassador hotel that night. He did not know Morales and
Campbell by name but saw them talking to each other out in
the lobby before the shooting and assumed they were
Kennedy's security people. He also saw Campbell around
police stations three or four times in the year before
Robert Kennedy was shot.

This was odd. The CIA had no domestic jurisdiction and
Morales was stationed in Laos in 1968. With no secret
service protection for presidential candidates in those
days, Kennedy was guarded by unarmed Olympic decathlete
champion Rafer Johnson and football tackler Rosey Grier - no
match for an expert assassination team.

Trawling through microfilm of the police investigation, I
found further photographs of Campbell with a third figure,
standing centre-stage in the Ambassador hotel hours before
the shooting. He looked Greek, and I suspected he might be
George Joannides, chief of psychological warfare operations
at JM-Wave. Joannides was called out of retirement in 1978
to act as the CIA liaison to the House Select Committee on
Assassinations (HSCA) investigating the death of John F
Kennedy.

Ed Lopez, now a respected lawyer at Cornell University, came
into close contact with Joannides when he was a young law
student working for the committee. We visit him and show him
the photograph and he is 99% sure it is Joannides. When I
tell him where it was taken, he is not surprised: "If these
guys decided you were bad, they acted on it.

We move to Washington to meet Wayne Smith, a state
department official for 25 years who knew Morales well at
the US embassy in Havana in 1959-60. When we show him the
video in the ballroom, his response is instant: "That's him,
that's Morales." He remembers Morales at a cocktail party in
Buenos Aires in 1975, saying Kennedy got what was coming to
him. Is there a benign explanation for his presence? For
Kennedy's security, maybe? Smith laughs. Morales is the last
person you would want to protect Bobby Kennedy, he says. He
hated the Kennedys, blaming their lack of air support for
the failed Bay of Pigs invasion in 1961.

We meet Clines in a hotel room near CIA headquarters. He
does not want to go on camera and brings a friend, which is
a little unnerving. Clines remembers "Dave" fondly. The guy
in the video looks like Morales but it is not him, he says:
"This guy is fatter and Morales walked with more of a slouch
and his tie down." To me, the guy in the video does walk
with a slouch and his tie is down.

Clines says he knew Joannides and Campbell and it is not
them either, but he fondly remembers Ayers bringing snakes
into JM-Wave to scare the secretaries and seems disturbed at
Smith's identification of Morales. He does not discourage
our investigation and suggests others who might be able to
help. A seasoned journalist cautions that he would expect
Clines "to blow smoke", and yet it seems his honest opinion.

As we leave Los Angeles, I tell the immigration officer that
I am doing a story on Bobby Kennedy. She has seen the
advertisements for the new Emilio Estevez movie about the
assassination, Bobby. "Who do you think did it? I think it
was the Mob," she says before I can answer.

"I definitely think it was more than one man," I say,
discreetly.

Morales died of a heart attack in 1978, weeks before he was
to be called before the HSCA. Joannides died in 1990.
Campbell may still be out there somewhere, in his early 80s.
Given the positive identifications we have gathered on these
three, the CIA and the Los Angeles Police Department need to
explain what they were doing there. Lopez believes the CIA
should call in and interview everybody who knew them,
disclose whether they were on a CIA operation and, if not,
why they were there that night.

Today would have been Robert Kennedy's 81st birthday. The
world is crying out for a compassionate leader like him. If
dark forces were behind his elimination, it needs to be
investigated

Shane O'Sullivan's investigation will be shown tonight on
Newsnight, BBC2, 10.30pm.

JCT: Wow! Mainstream news. Not in Amerika.


--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics

>The GREAT USURY
>Posted by: "Levi Philos" leviphilos@...
>Date: Tue Nov 14, 2006 7:28 am ((PST))
http://www.suijuris.net/forum/banks-collectors-cras/9531-follow-money-9.html

JCT: I know the Professor's no longer with us to defend
himself but it's no excuse to permit his errors to be
propagated and I'll denounce his errors as surely as I'd
denounce every economist's errors (since there's never ever
been a successful economist). Before I get into Professor
Auriti's treatise on usury, I'll remind you of that the
distinction between interest and usury is a function of the
substance of the principle:
From: http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel/pombible.htm

EZEKIEL

Ezekiel in 22, verse 25's the test:
"If you lend money to the needy, charge no interest."
Ezekiel 3:18 adds responsibility,
God states his laws for life with his expected certainty:

"And when I tell the wicked man that "You will surely die,"
You will be held accountable if you don't warn the guy?
But if you speak up and he doesn't change his wicked way,
You will have saved yourself and he will be the one to pay."

In 18:5: "Suppose a man takes not much interest,
He takes no usury. He'll live! His actions I have blessed.
Suppose he has a son who takes excessive interest,
And lends at usury. He'll die! His actions I detest.

But if this son too has a son who doesn't do the same,
He does not take the pledge for loans, his greed he overcame.
He takes no usury nor interest that is too high,
He will not die for his father's sin, the soul that sins will die.

But if a wicked man turns from the sins he did commit,
He gives back what he took in pledge. His sins I will acquit.
Forgotten will be his offences when I come to judge,
Because of good things he does now, I will not hold a grudge.

But if a righteous man turns from my law to evil way,
None of his righteous deeds will count. He'll die! I do inveigh.
So cleanse yourselves of all your sins and cease to be such fools,
I take no pleasure in the death of men who break my rules."

Ezekiel declared that usury and interest,
Could have a different effect, there was a simple test.
If interest demanded is of something that can breed,
Such interest is payable and not sin I concede.

So if you lend a hundred head and ask to get two more,
That might not be excessive action that he would abhor.
But if you gain all of the calves and he still owes you some,
That would be judged excessive. That is more than maximum.

And if the interest is on some silver or some gold,
It's usury because there are no babies to behold!
It's interest if principal can breed to multiply,
It's usury if principal cannot so classify.

JCT: It's interest if principal breed to multiply, it's
usury if principal cannot so classify. That's how The
Engineer distinguishes payable interest from impossible-to-
pay usury. Let's see how the Italian professor explains it
before I parse his words.

By Prof. Giacinto Auriti
http://home.hiwaay.net/~becraft/ProfAuriti.htm

The GREAT USURY

After proving that money is, simultaneously, a measure of
value and the value of the measure, it is unquestionably
true that the monetary mass constitutes a mirror-like
duplicate of the value of real goods, measured or measurable
in terms of their value. This duplicate value can have the
positive sign of an asset (and in this case, it doubles the
people's wealth), or the negative sign of a debt (in which
case it creates a desperate and agonizing situation because
of inevitable insolvency).

When money was made from gold, the bearer was also the
owner. Since the advent of "nominal money", he has without
realizing it become a debtor. All "nominal money" is issued
by the banks in the form of loans. Thus, all money in
circulation is burdened with debt to the central banks.
Therefore, if someone wants to pay off a debt of money with
money, it would be the same as paying a debt with another
debt. IT CANNOT BE DONE. In the long run, he is forced to
pay with his own capital and with the produce of his labor.

With the discovery of induced value as a legal value, it is
not only proven that money must be considered as the
property of the national community, but, also that currently
the central bank, by loaning out what is in fact due,
imposes a cost of 200% on money, at the act of issue: the
initial 100%, because it expropriates the community of the
induced value (only an owner can lend money), and a further
100% by forcing the national community into debt to the same
extent.  Furthermore, it is also evident that banks and
other credit institutions "create" money in a surreptitious
way.

Applying the principle of so-called credit multiplication,
they lend money in an increased proportion to the sums which
have been deposited with them. For example, they lend 100%
with a 20% monetary liquidity reserve. All this can be done
because a great part of the lent money is deposited in a
bank, again, so that a reserve of 20% is usually sufficient
to satisfy a request for money. Hence, it is evident that a
bank can lend money which it does not have to an amount of
80% of the loan.

Consequently, this difference of 80% is, in fact, induced
value (not credit value), which should be represented by
legal-tender, paper money, not by instruments of credit.
Properly considered, its ownership should be attributed to
the community (not to the banks), who could then deposit it
in a bank as creditors and not as debtors.

This principle of credit multiplication expropriates the
people and causes debts... to the extent of the induced
value as explained above, thus it results in "debt
multiplication",  which was a consequence and a corollary of
the scheme developed by Paterson in 1694 for the Bank of
England, founded with the aim of making loans using the
"notes of the bank" (i.e. bills of exchange) in place of
money (gold). These bank-notes were "nominal money" and also
"debt-money". As a result of these practices, the people of
the world have been dispossessed of their own money, forced
into debt, without receiving anything in return.

JCT: There are so many mistakes and false presumptions, it
staggers the mind to think such tripe would be offered to
a social currency engineering group whose members should
know better.

A: The GREAT USURY
After proving that money is, simultaneously, a measure of
value and the value of the measure, it is unquestionably
true that the monetary mass constitutes a mirror-like
duplicate of the value of real goods, measured or measurable
in terms of their value.

JCT: Of course, the mass of poker chips does constitute a
mirror-like duplicate of the value of real goods, measured
or measurable in terms of their value. Casino chips do this
perfectly.

A: This duplicate value

JCT: It's not a duplicate value. It's a token representing
the original value. There's no duplication going on, just
mirroring of value.

A: can have the positive sign of an asset

JCT: Just like chips issued in exchange for cash or assets
like an orthodox material-based collateral banking system.

A: (and in this case, it doubles the people's wealth),

JCT: Pledging their property for tokens does not double
people's wealth. Chips issued out of the bank into
circulation does not double the wealth out there. What a bad
mistake. 100% off.

A: or the negative sign of a debt

JCT: Just like chips issued in exchange for promissory IOUs
like an unorthodox LETS time-based collateral banking
system.

A: (in which case it creates a desperate and agonizing
situation because of inevitable insolvency).

JCT: Trading with gold-based tokens is okay
but trading with LETS promissory acknowledgments (IOUs)
creates a desperate and agonizing situation because of
inevitable insolvency? How silly. Using credits based on
material-based collateral is fine but using credits based on
time-based collateral has all these problems? It does not.
Another silly un-backed argument.

A: When money was made from gold, the bearer was also the
owner. Since the advent of "nominal money", he has without
realizing it become a debtor.

JCT: And Professor Auriti has already explained why gold-
based tokens are good and time-based tokens are bad. Not.

A:All "nominal money" is issued by the banks in the form of
loans. Thus, all money in circulation is burdened with debt
to the central banks.

JCT: Just like LETS. All the tokens you take out must be
returned. How horrible, not. There's nothing wrong with debt
for time and stuff we get.

A: Therefore, if someone wants to pay off a debt of money
with money, it would be the same as paying a debt with
another debt. IT CANNOT BE DONE.

JCT: Sure it can. LETS debts can be transferred to increase
or decrease another member's positive or negative balance
and paid off. What a lot of baloney.

A: In the long run, he is forced to pay with his own capital
and with the produce of his labor.

JCT: That's the deal, paying for the produce of the labor of
others with the produce of your own labor or your own
capital. How horrible? Not. It's the original fair deal.
Right? Why is the professor condemning paying back what you
owe as a systemic flaw in the system? Does he suggest
stiffing our creditors for what we received?

A: With the discovery of induced value as a legal value,

JCT: Having never defined or explained "induced value."

A:  it is not only proven that money must be considered as
the property of the national community,

JCT: Canadian Tire money belongs to Canadian Tire.
Casino Turmel chips too. Toronto Bus Tokens belong to the
TTC. Good tokens do not have to be the property of the
national community. Who owns the tokens is irrelevant.

A: but, also that currently the central bank, by loaning out
what is in fact due, imposes a cost of 200% on money, at the
act of issue: the initial 100%, because it expropriates the
community of the induced value (only an owner can lend
money), and a further 100% by forcing the national community
into debt to the same extent.

JCT: Har har har har. This is wrong in exactly the same way
the professor thinks that the wealth is doubled by the
issuance of chips for that wealth!! The Italian School of
Usury! Off by 100% both times!

A: Furthermore, it is also evident that banks and other
credit institutions "create" money in a surreptitious way.

JCT: Sure, they don't want the suckers to know where money
comes from. They want the suckers to think they work like
piggy banks, waiting for someone else's deposits before they
can lend. They don't want the suckers to know they operate
like casino banks, issuing new chips without needing
someone else's deposits. Of course, interest is charged
whether it goes to people who had to earn their money before
getting interest on their savings or to bankers who did not
have to earn their money before getting interest on their
newly-created money. So of course, it's surreptitious. But
surreptitiousness is not the problem causing too much debt.

A: Applying the principle of so-called credit
multiplication, they lend money in an increased proportion
to the sums which have been deposited with them.

JCT: How do they lend out money in an increased proportion
to the sums deposited with them? By the "multiplication
principle." Not defined or explained explained. See my
explanation of the reserve ratio multiplier effect at
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel/bankmath.htm

A: For example, they lend 100% with a 20% monetary liquidity
reserve.

JCT: How do you lend out your $20 monetary reserve so
there's $100 lent out and owed at the end? It's still not
explained.

A: All this can be done because a great part of the lent
money is deposited in a bank, again, so that a reserve of
20% is usually sufficient to satisfy a request for money.

JCT: So, with $20, he can lend out $100 because the $100 is
deposited in a bank. Having never explained where the other
$80 came from, it all sounds pretty incoherent so far. See
the coherent explanation in my engineering analysis.

A: Hence, it is evident that a bank can lend money which
it does not have to an amount of 80% of the loan.

JCT: How do they lend money they do not have? Is he going to
argue that since they did manage to lend out $100 with only
their $20 to start, they must have created some. So, since
he proves new money did come into existence, no need to explain
how. Its being there is proof it is newly created; without
having to explain how it was done. See how it is done at my
bankmath page.

A: Consequently, this difference of 80% is, in fact, induced
value (not credit value), which should be represented by
legal-tender, paper money, not by instruments of credit.

JCT: Of course, since the only flaw in the malfunctioning
"1/(s-i)" usury banking system is "i," I'll simply
pontificate that anything else he thinks is the problem is
not the real cause. It doesn't matter what the tokens are
made of. It doesn't have to be on paper, legal tender or
credits. It can be both. It could be memory.

A: Properly considered, its ownership should be attributed
to the community (not to the banks), who could then deposit
it in a bank as creditors and not as debtors.

JCT: It doesn't matter who owns the substance of the poker
chips. The best credits have no substance and are made up of
pure memory. Negative "IOU 1 Hour." Positive "UOI 1 Hour."

A: This principle of credit multiplication expropriates the
people and causes debts...

JCT: It does not cause the oppression. A reserve ratio is a
silly governor on how many new chips should be created but
it's not the root of the problem. Sure, chips should be
issued as fast as the collateral comes into the cage. But if
they want to link the number of new chips issued to the
number of old chips saved over in the safety deposit
section, it may be stupid but it's not fatal. Like driving a
bicycle backwards, like doing LETS without a time-based
paper token, that people use it wrongly is no flaw in the
system. Only in the instruction manual.

A: to the extent of the induced value as explained above,
thus it results in "debt multiplication",

JCT: Debt multiplication is due to interest. Multiple debt
creation is due to multiple token creation. There's nothing
wrong with debt for token multiplication when it goes along
with wealth multiplication. It's debt growth with no token
growth that's the problem.

A: which was a consequence and a corollary of the scheme
developed by Paterson in 1694 for the Bank of England,
founded with the aim of making loans using the "notes of the
bank" (i.e. bills of exchange) in place of money (gold).
These bank-notes were "nominal money" and also "debt-money".

JCT: Nothing wrong with the medium, asset or debt, of the
money. It's the feedback on the medium that's the problem.

A: As a result of these practices, the people of the world
have been dispossessed of their own money, forced into debt,
without receiving anything in return.

JCT: Not as a result of the practices he mentioned. The
Professor completely mis-diagnosed the problem in the
"1/(s-i) usury banking system as something other than "i".
Of course, not having the Laplace Transform blueprint of the
banking system engineering, it is less obvious to him that
what is making the debt multiply is positive feedback "i" on
debt.

Sad to do a number on a dead economic philosopher, but a
wrong dead economic philosopher is just as harmful as a live
one. Ezekiel, Christ, Mohammed are all gone but all managed
to figure out the interest trick. If Levi wants to bring
Professor Auriti's errors to public attention, so be it.
Just another economist failure. Nothing new there.


--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics

>Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2006 00:41:28 -0500
>From: iggabod@... (". - Lori - .")
>Subject: Re: [Brantford] TURMEL: Hancock beats Friel by
165,
>To: brantford@yahoogroups.com

L: Mr. Turmel If, in fact, you did pull out, then why was
your name on the voters card still?

JCT: They couldn't remove it at the last minute.

L: And if the cards were already printed when you chose to
pull out, why weren't there signs posted that you were no
longer a candidate?

JCT: What else would you have had me do? I announced it to
the world, I put up a sign viewed by 20,000 cars a day
saying Turmel says Vote Friel, letter to the editor whose
publication editor Judd managed to delay until the very last
day. Sadly, the message did not get out to the last 226
voters and Friel lost by 165. Judd's interference may have
paid off big against Friel, just more journalistic
interference in electioneering.
---

>From: codypytlak@... (Cody Pytlak)
>Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2006 17:18:00 -0800 (PST)
>To: johnturmel@... (John Turmel)
>Subject: Re: Questions for Mr. Turmel

Hello Mr. Turmel,

I'm a Laurier journalism student and I saw you at the debate
last week and spoke with you afterwards, as well I watched
some of your lecture at city hall on Monday night. For one
of my classes on municipal reporting, I have an essay and
one of the options is a candidate analysis. I decided to
chose you as you have a large background and make for an
interesting person to write about.
So if you wouldn't mind answering several questions through
e-mail, then it would help me out quite a bit. If you wish
to not answer these questions, please send an e-mail back
stating so.

1. Why did you choose Brantford to run for mayor?

JCT: Since I was going to run in the 2003 provincial general
election anyway and I was just freed up after my Big Five
medpot appeals at the Ontario Court of Appeal, I ran in
Brantford because they had a downtown casino that offered
Holdem poker. After the election, I stayed. See the
Expositor article by Susan Gamble for a great report:
http://yahoogroups.com/group/turmel/message/1949

2. Was your campaign more of an effort to tell people about
the LETS system than it was to win the election?

JCT: Yes. Winning would be extra but spreading the word of
the financial "life-boat engineering blueprint" is key. In
the 1996 Sheila Copps federal byelection in Hamilton, I kept
saying I only needed one person to go pick up the LETS
freeware and do it yourselves. See:
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel/he96.htm

Exactly one month after the the Jun 18 1996 Ottawa Sun
headline "Super Loser fails again," the July 18 1996
Hamilton Spectator annouced that the Hamilton Self-Help
Group were setting up a Hamilton LETS. "Mission
Accomplished." It's small but when the system crashes,
they'll have an alternative ready to go.
See http://www.letshamilton.on.ca

3. Over the years, who have been your biggest competitors?

JCT: Trying to get the message past media controllers. I
don't expect the other candidates to catch on to social
currency since none ever have but I'd expect the media to
give me a fair hearing. Har har har har. In this last
election, my space in the Nov 7 2006 Brantford Expossitor
election supplement was left blank!

4. What kind of efforts did you put into your campaign?

JCT: I attend all the meetings open to the public whether I
was invited or not. If not, I make them call the police to
take me away. When my opponents get heard through the media
by thousands, I won't be knocking on doors.

5. What do you think of the media coverage of yourself, not
only here in Brantford but nation and world-wide?

JCT: There's been a serious blackout on the guy whose going
to be president, PM, or chief engineer of the planet some
day. I got marijuana charges dropped against 4000 people and
they didn't even mention my name. Ottawa's most notorious
politican, 8 times candidate for mayor, dozens time
candidate for Ottawa-area MP, dozen time candidate for MPP,
and when I got busted at the House of Commons on Parliament
Hill with a life-sentence supply of marijuana, the story
made the Taipei times in China but was killed by all three
of Ottawa's daily newspapers, Citizen, Sun, Le Droit. You
tell me if that doesn't qualify as black-out.

6. What kind of challenges do you face in municipal
elections?

JCT: I keep hoping my opposition will learn something but
most of the time, they didn't get to hear what I was
offering and even if they did, it doesn't stay in mind long.
How to explain social currency sweeping poorer countries?
We're not broke enough to turn to the alternative yet.

Thanks a lot! - Cody Pytlak

JCT: Pretty tough to report that democracy's in good shape
when 95% of the people didn't realize they were being
offered the chance to convert all their interest-bearing
debts for interest-free ones.

Of course, Big Brother played a major part in an unethical
influencing the election. Why should low-tech journalists
get to decide what engineering proposals are worthy of being
published when all should be?

--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics

JCT: In my recent post "Judd censors reply to Philp
attack," I included my threat to complain to the Ontario
Press Council if they didn't print my defence to Tim Philp's
attack on me.

I had included my Philp defence with my announcement of
support for Chris Friel to ensure my Friel announcement
would get it. Then Judd published the Friel support but then
censored my Philp defence.

They printed it under their editorial report on the
election:

His issues are local
Brantford Expositor
John Turmel

In his City Beat column, "Your Guide to the Races," Oct 2
2006, Tim Philp said the mayoral race was "tainted by the
addition of challenger John Turmel who is not so harmless.

Turmel has used his candidacy in the past to tout his
personal crusade for international monetary reform and
marijuana legalisation - issues that have nothing to to with
our municipal election. He does, however, have a right to
run for any office he chooses and the rest of us will just
have to do our best to ignore the noise."

Of course, since marijuana enforcement is municipally
funded, de-funding enforcement is a municipal issue even if
Philp fails to see the link.

The interest-free LETS (Local Employment-Trading System)
timebank software not only can work internationally as
UNILETS but on our municipal database at the City's web site
too.

JCT: I guess that even though the Ontario Press Council
doesn't adjudicate complaints if the newspapers have no
defence and refuse to respond, it must be embarrassing
enough to avoid.


--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics

JCT: What if? Despite my pulling out and supporting former
mayor Chris Major, Mike Hancock got 13,212 votes beating
former mayor Chris Friel's 13,047 votes by 165. 226 people
didn't find out about my pulling out to support Friel in
time and still voted for me.

What if they had found out? Friel would have won!

What if editor David Judd had not delayed the publication of
my announcement in the Brantford Expositor's until the very
last day? How many of the 226 Turmel voters would have
remained in the dark? Would 166 of the 226 Turmel voters had
found out in time to switch to Friel if Judd hadn't spiked
my email-letter in support of Friel because it didn't
include my easily-available address and phone number?

What if I had come out in favor of Friel a week earlier on
the very day he was bold enough to tell the Pauline Johnson
High School students Mr. Turmel had some good ideas with
anti-Turmel reporter Michael Allan Marion in the room? Would
166 of the 226 have found out to switch. Probably yes. Had I
switched the moment Friel sounded positive, he probably
would have won. But it was only nearing the end of the
campaign that he said "I like the Brantford Bucks idea" that
I could in all honesty proclaim my support. Who knows, maybe
his statement to the students didn't mean he supported
Brantford Timebucks, maybe he supported marijuana
legalisation. He's young enough to know the truth about it's
safety and goodness that older pillars of the community
continue to not recognize.

What if Friel come out for Brantford Bucks before the Rogers
debate like I challenged both candidates to do? That would
have been guaranteed that not only would he have gotten all
my votes he did get plus the 226 he didn't and I'd have
worked for his campaign to get him even more. So he could
have won had he come out for Brantford Timebucks sooner too.

And what if the Brantford Expositor had not suppressed every
mention of timebanking from their election reports? I'd bet
that 90% of the city's voters had not had a chance to hear
how timebanking could help the city. A few sparsely-watched
cable TV debates and 500 live listeners at meetings heard
HOW timebanking works. No radio listeners, no newspaper
readers, ever got an explanation of how timebanking works.
But the day they find out, I'm always programmed to point
out David Judd's responsibility in keeping the electorate
ignorant of the incredible things that have been
accomplished in other parts of the world with the wise use
of social currency software.

Of course, I made the same offer of support to Mike Hancock
too. But like most orthodox politicians who've been
conditioned to think I'm a flake, everything I was talking
about, social currency, marijuana, was going in one ear and
out the other. Like federal Liberal M.P. Lloyd St. Amand who
never understood Timebucks after I'd explained it to him.
Like provincial Liberal M.P.P. Dave Levac who never
understood Timebucks after I'd explained it to him how
small-denomination provincial bond currency saved many
Argentine provinces? These aren't evil people, it just
sounds too good to be true so they dismiss it without
thought. A greater man than me forgave them as "forever
hearing without hearing and seeing without seeing or
understanding" so how can I condemn those who cannot see?
Though I delight in enlightening newbies who finally do see
the same Heaven on Earth I do when no one's chasing anyone
for debts and there's tomorrow's bread in the larder.

What if this election is Mayor Mike's wake-up call that I'm
not a flake since even Tim Philp recently admitted at
http://yahoogroups.com/group/brantford/messages that he
easily installed a LETS anti-poverty timebank on his
Brantford Freenet network but didn't because he didn't like
my combative style. "Oops, everybody drowned because I
didn't like the life-boat engineer's style" won't go over
all that well with those who don't have a life-boat when the
flood of debt overwhelms them.

Those living in need won't much fault the combative style of
the guy fighting to lift the yoke of oppression weighing
down on all our necks but may fault Philp for doing nothing
while he had the network to help and let Mayor Mike and
council stay ignorant of a financial mechanism he says he
understood.

What's worse, not building a life-boat because you don't
understand the concept or not building a life-boat because
you do but are angry about style? With lives at stake, not
doing good when you could have done good is as bad as doing
bad. Not saving them when you could have saved them is bad.

Much like Ontario Court of Appeal Justices Doherty, Goudge
and Simmons could have prevented 5000 epileptic deaths over
the past 3 years by admitting their anti-seizure marijuana
medicine was no longer prohibited and instead announced the
court was bringing the prohibition back to life since
Parliament had not. Since only Parliament can enact new
penal sanctions, the court could not and their declaration
fooled all Canada's judges, lawyer, police, and politicians,
who know only Parliament can create new penal law, into
unlearning that still-taught fact and continuing enforcement
of a law that used be to be repealed but which has not been
unrepealed by the courts which have no power to do so. And
thus fraudulently threaten Canada's epileptic population
with continued prosecution for possession of their medicine
causing 1500 of them to die per year for nothing.

Doing nothing when you have the power to do good is bad.
Just as those judges are responsible for the extra epileptic
deaths that would not have happened had they not suppressed
the truth, not setting up LETS interest-free social currency
services on the Brantford Freenet had caused many people to
lose because of Philp's inaction.

One person on the Brantford group just today announced she
had to move and was giving away stuff. I pointed out how it
would have been nice to receive credits she could use to
purchase their stuff. I should have added credits she would
have received had Philp installed a LETS on Brantford
Freenet.

What if? What theatre!

Friel loses by 165 votes, Turmel still gets 226


--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics

>Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2006 17:38:03 -0500 (EST)
>From: wldlfe57@... (Bill Douglas)
>Subject: Re: [Brantford] junk
>To: brantford@yahoogroups.com

JCT: At http://yahoogroups.com/group/brantford

BD: The inserts a waste of paper? The Expos is the waste of
paper. I cancelled it and only get the weekender FOR the
inserts. The Expos refuses to print the truth and only tells
what they feel like telling you. Whether or not you think
Turmel is a goof, he is absolutely correct in what he says
about the paper.

There's more censorship in Brantford than you know about.
Judd, Marion, Philp and Mr *^#)&% himself, Mike Pearce are
responsible for the bull that the residents in this city
have to put up with. If you think for one minute that the
Expos is a responsible and informative media, you are very
ill informed. Certain city councillors are also running the
pages of the Expos in what is being printed and what isn't
being printed.

And more, do you realize how many of the Expos brass is from
out of town, telling you and me and him and her how we
should be spending our municipal tax dollars and telling us
all how much our increase should be to pay for these out of
towners agendas. They are also of the belief that if you are
not a councillor or a journalist that you should "shut your
mouth and keep your views to yourself". Yes, that is a quote
from them.

personna62001 <personna62001@...> wrote:
Between the Pennysaver inserts,,and the Friday expositor
inserts,,,what a waste of paper!?

>Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2006 18:25:23 -0500
>From: tphilp@... (Tim Philp)
>Subject: Re: [Brantford] junk
>To: brantford@yahoogroups.com

TP: Mr. Douglas, as you are someone who has, by his own
admission, cut himself off from a source of information here
in Brantford, I can see that you are now well-placed to
understand current events in our community. As for my
responsibility for what people know, I spend a great deal of
time talking to councillors, candidates, the Mayor, city
staff, and citizens before I write my columns in the paper.

Regardless of whether you agree with my opinions or not, you
cannot say that I am not well-informed. Perhaps Mr. Douglas
could inform the group of what he does to ensure that he is
well-informed and able to render reasonable opinions on
anything. How many city councillors have YOU talked to? Have
you read the city budget? Have you read city reports on the
service review? Can you discuss the city's strategic plan?
Do you attend city council meetings as I do? I thought not.

Regardless of his lack of knowledge, Mr. Douglas is entitled
to his opinion, but it is clear that it is an uninformed
one. Unfortunately, there are others on this forum who have
a similar lack of integrity such as John Turmel.

This forum has been used by him and others to slander myself
and many other people in this community who work hard to
make Brantford a better place to live in.

Turmel is a good example of the kind of thing that I a
talking about. He uses half-truths, and outright lies to
slander myself and others.

He misrepresents other's positions to serve his own ends and
seems to be unable to understand that sometimes people just
disagree with him. That does not make them stupid.

He has criticized me for not understanding the LETS system
of local currency. He claims that I was unable to set it up
on a computer. Actually, I understand it very well and have
never criticized the system. I also set it up on the FreeNet
and had it working well. I did not publish it or make it
available to the public because John spent so much time
demonizing me over the debates at the LAST election.

I find his moniker for me, Furher Philp, to be especially
reprehensible. John is upset because I did not let HIM take
control of the Rogers Television debates that I hosted. Even
so, I let him have his say and treated him fairly.

John is a brilliant man, however, he does not have a sense
of perspective. His well-touted election sign, seen by
20,000 people per day, is a bedsheet outside his window. He
claims to have won and lost millions as a professional
gambler.

He claims that he is a poker expert. Who knows, it might be
true, however, he lives with his mother in a third floor
walkup in the worst slum building in Brantford. I would have
expected something more prosperous for such an expert.

Perhaps he is in one of his 'loss' cycles. The bottom line
is that Brantford is generally well-served by the local
media despite what some people on this forum may think.

I have witnessed many events here in town and have either
written about them in the paper or have read the reported
events and I can tell you that you get the truth in the
paper. Is it perfect... no, it is not, but it is certainly a
damn sight better than ignorance of current events such as
Mr. Douglas seems to advocate.

Regards,Tim Philp


--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics

JCT: I sent a two-part letter to the Brantford editor, one
part in response to an Expositor attack on me and the
other announcing my withdrawal to support Friel.

I remember being asked why I didn't respond to the Philp
attack on me back in early October. It's now halfway through
november. I remember saying I was saving it to play at
another time. They had to print my response to their attack
so I'd wait until I needed to be published before answering
their attack.

Now that my withdrawal could help elect the only one of the
two major candidates who caught on to social currencies, as
if Hancock couldn't have taken it seriously given its world-
wide renown, I knew Judd could decide to not print my
statement of withdrawal. But refusing to print a response to
an attack was unheard of.

So my letter led off with my response to Philp and finished
with my withdrawal as a result of their treatment.

So what does Judd do? He censors my response to the
Expositor attack, the part that he should print, and
publishes only my withdrawal, the part that he didn't have
to print.

Judd censored:

In your City Beat column, "Your Guide to the Races," Oct 2
2006, Tim Philp said the mayoral race was "tainted by the
addition of challenger John Turmel who is not so harmless.
Turmel has used his candidacy in the past to tout his
personal crusade for international monetary reform and
marijuana legalisation - issues that have nothing to to with
our municipal election. He does, however, have a right to
run for any office he chooses and the rest of us will just
have to do our best to ignore the noise."
Of course, since marijuana enforcement is municipally
funded, de-funding enforcement is a municipal issue even if
Mr. Philp fails to see the link. The interest-free LETS
(Local Employment-Trading System) timebank software not only
can work internationally as UNILETS but on our municipal
database at the City's web site too.

JCT: And Judd published:

Since my "Brantford Timebank" community currency program has
not been mentioned in your paper once, since Mayor Hancock
avows he just can't understand how it could work, (like
Canadian Tire money buys in different departments, Brantford
Bucks buy in different stores), and since Chris Friel has
acknowledged in public debate that he does see some
advantages to using local currency to help the local economy
and has proven to be an innovator in the past, I have no
choice but to announce my withdrawal from the mayoral
election and throw my support behind the candidate who is
the better bet to eventually offer Timebank accounts to
Brantford residents.
In 63 election races, I have never before withdrawn but
you'll soon see a first on my building, a sign saying
"Turmel says vote Friel"

JCT: As I pointed out yesterday, journalistic ethics mandate
that he print my defence to Philp's attack and yet if he
thinks me achieving my real purpose will mollify me for their
not printing my response to their attack, he's very wrong. I
just sent this off:

Demand Expositor print reply to Philp attack

Letter to the Expositor <opinion@...>
Nov 12 2006

Dear Sir:

In my letter to the editor dated Nov 9 2006, I responded to
Tim Philp's Oct 2 2006 attack on me in your paper:

<<
"In your City Beat column, "Your Guide to the Races," Oct 2
2006, Tim Philp said the mayoral race was "tainted by the
addition of challenger John Turmel who is not so harmless.
Turmel has used his candidacy in the past to tout his
personal crusade for international monetary reform and
marijuana legalisation - issues that have nothing to to with
our municipal election. He does, however, have a right to
run for any office he chooses and the rest of us will just
have to do our best to ignore the noise."

Of course, since marijuana enforcement is municipally
funded, de-funding enforcement is a municipal issue even if
Mr. Philp fails to see the link. The interest-free LETS
(Local Employment-Trading System) timebank software not only
can work internationally as UNILETS but on our municipal
database at the City's web site too.
>>

If you do not publish my response to Tim Philp's attack on
me in your newspaper, I will send a complaint to the Ontario
Press Council, even if just to have them fail once again in
their mandate to ensure editorial fairness.

John Turmel
8-37 Colborne St. E.
Brantford N3T 2G3
Tel: 519-753-0645

JCT: I've detailed how the Ontario Press Council refused to
adjudicate my complaint when Judd couldn't defend his
refusal to correct the errors after I had submitted audio
tapes to prove the errors in the article. Pretty useless
council for controlling the Ontario press.

But at least now, with my sign being passed by 20,000 cars a
day and the story in the home-town rag, almost everyone in
Brantford does know I've thrown my support to the only other
candidate who caught on to social currency engineering. Just
one ant switching over to help build the bigger hill. But I
bet it helps create a landslide. Everyone who likes what
they heard but wouldn't bother to vote for me because they
don't think I have a chance to win can vote for Friel
because they think he does. It should generate a far more
substantial swing than the almost 400 votes I got against
the major parties in recent federal and provincial races.



--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics

JCT: Yesterday, I sent my announcement of withdrawal from
the Brantford mayoralty race to support Friel to the
Brantford Expositor. A first for me. I've never supported
another candidate before.

Did "Mayoral candidate supports opponent" make the news or
did Brantford Expositor editor David Judd squelch the story?
Considering how Judd's been smearing Friel over failure to
attend the 2003 Veterans Day parade, Judd's choice for our
most important municipal issue judging by the coverage, what
is Judd going to do when an opponent withdraws to support
the candidate Judd's been smearing?

Though there was one letter to the editor lauding Friel in
today's paper, with Judd's editorial endorsing Friel's
opponent, my letter withdrawing from the race and urging my
supporters to vote for Friel did not.

Date: Thu, 09 Nov 2006 09:00:40 -0400
Subject: Re: Letter to Editor: Turmel pulling out of mayoral race
From: "OPINION" <opinion@...>
To: "John Turmel" <johnturmel@...>
Letters to the editor must include the writer's full address
and telephone number. The Expositor does not print street
addresses and telephone numbers but requires them for
authentication.
David Judd Managing editor

JCT: How disingenuous! Even though I've had correspondence
with the Expositor for years, the necessary information is
not only at my web site but also at City Hall's web site,
Judd didn't publish my support because I didn't provide my
address and phone number. Who believes that is his real
reason?

From Random House Webster's College dictionary:
disingenuous: lacking in frankness, candor or sincerity;
insincere.

Disingenuous is when you're lying and everyone knows you're
lying, but you have plausible deniability. He can argue he's
a mere journalist who barely mastered "Tape Recorder 101,"
let alone "Phone Book 101" or "Surf and Search 101?"


--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics

JCT: I have just announced my withdrawal from the Brantford
Mayoral race in order to support former mayor Chris Friel
even though he's been smeared by the local press.

This morning, I sent this letter to the editor in response
to Tim Philp's attack on me in the Expositor at the
beginning of the campaign:

Letter to the Expositor
<opinion@...>
Nov 9 2006

Turmel pulling out of mayoral race

In your City Beat column, "Your Guide to the Races," Oct 2
2006, Tim Philp said the mayoral race was "tainted by the
addition of challenger John Turmel who is not so harmless.
Turmel has used his candidacy in the past to tout his
personal crusade for international monetary reform and
marijuana legalisation - issues that have nothing to to with
our municipal election. He does, however, have a right to
run for any office he chooses and the rest of us will just
have to do our best to ignore the noise."

Of course, since marijuana enforcement is municipally
funded, de-funding enforcement is a municipal issue even if
Mr. Philp fails to see the link. The interest-free LETS
(Local Employment-Trading System) timebank software not only
can work internationally as UNILETS but on our municipal
database at the City's web site too.

Since my "Brantford Timebank" community currency program has
not been mentioned in your paper once, since Mayor Hancock
avows he just can't understand how it could work, (like
Canadian Tire money buys in different departments, Brantford
Bucks buy in different stores), and since Chris Friel has
acknowledged in public debate that he does see some
advantages to using local currency to help the local
economy and has proven to be an innovator in the past, I
have no choice but to announce my withdrawal from the
mayoral election and throw my support behind the candidate
who is the better bet to eventually offer Timebank accounts
to Brantford residents.

In 63 election races, I have never before withdrawn but
you'll soon see a first on my building, a sign saying
"Turmel says vote Friel"


JCT: Of course, journalistic ethics mandate that they print
my defence to Philp's attack but when did being fair ever
matter to editor David Judd? Especially if it helps the guy
Judd's trying to smear.

If he doesn't publish my defence before Monday, I'll
complain to the Ontario Press Council so they can fail in
their mandate to oversee journalistic fairness like they
failed to adjudicate my last complaint against Judd because
Judd refused to defend when I sent in audio tapes to prove
the errors in the article Judd refused to correct.

Let's see if torpedoing Friel is important enough to sit on
the story that Turmel's pulling to support Friel, our best
bet to get City Hall's web site to offer LETS Timebank
services to Brantford residents, me included.



--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics

JCT: Our last Brantford mayoral debates were held yesterday
Tuesday Oct 7. The first was at a 9am class for poli-sci and
journalism students at Laurier University. It was a 3-minute
opening statement and I used The Expositor. They had a big
Election Supplement section with a full page on mayoral
candidates. Almost half the page was on Mike Hancock
including picture, bio and his views, almost half on Chris
Friel with picture, bio and views, picture and short bio on
Winston Ferguson, no views, and picture and blank space for
Turmel! I've never seen such a blatant bias before, even
leaving a blank space to point out they had space but
decided to not use it.

I showed them the previous articles leading up to this final
journalistic corruption pointing out how they never
mentioned my program, a "Brantford Timebank," once. May as
well demonstrate the shoddy journalism while it was current.

Finally, about 50 minutes into the class, with 10 minutes to
go, in swishes Michael Allan Marion, the reporter
responsible for the recent articles ignoring me. From the
podium, I pointed at him as he entered late and snickered to
Hancock how he was going to take a beating.

In my final closing statement, I pointed the guy who came in
50 minutes late as the reporter who couldn't manage to cover
all the candidates and though I originally thought he had
merely been incompetent, there was also the possibility that
he had just come in late and missed my part which explained
the empty space. He had also come in late at our previous
debate at Pauline Johnson High School.

I showed his previous articles from Nov 4 titled: It's a
rematch for mayor; race again shows dramatic contrast in
styles which continued to the other page's "Candidates have
contrasting styles." I pointed out I have no "style" for our
fancy-pants reporter to comment on, only the substance of a
computer program. But what would someone who barely passed
"Tape Recorder 101" know about substance which is why he can
only focus on style. Besides, how much substance can he
report when he comes in 50 minutes late to catch the last 10
minutes of the debate. In-depth coverage, Expositor-style.

Sure, almost no one of the electorate is going to hear what
I said, that's what's so beautiful about censorship in the
press. When it's done, no one gets to read about it.

And Judd's still publishing letters from people who do not
wish to accept Friel's apology for missing the Veteran's Day
parade 3 years ago. Two more today. Full-time swill from
David Judd's full-time full trough.

Sadly, neither candidate would come out in support of a
Brantford Timebank. Although Friel did say he liked the
Brantford Bucks idea, not out loud in time for me to support
him out loud.

He knows I offered either candidate my support if they would
support a Brantford Timebank. I pointed out how, in Ottawa's
mayoralty race, I got over 4000 votes and Bob Chiarelli beat
Peter Clark by only 2000 votes. Hancock beat Friel by 15
votes in 2003, can't be much closer than that. And I'd tell
everyone and change my Vote Turmel sign viewed by 20,000
cars a day to "Turmel voting for Friel" viewed by 20,000
cars a day!!

When Friel made a statement at the high-school that could be
construed as support for a timebank, or for marijuana,
probably the timebank, it re-awakened hope I could pull out.
All I asked him to do if he thought a timebank was a good
idea was, during a meeting, to mention he had done some
research on timebanks, thought it is a good idea, and
promise to set one up too. Then he could urge me to vote for
him because he's got a a better chance to get it done and
I'd have to agree. It could sure have stolen the show.

I usually get around 2% of the vote, the top 2% Mensa crowd,
but as I pointed out in earlier posts, marijuana-, timebank,
gambling-supporters who would never vote for me because I
"can't win" would vote for a major candidate.

Anyway, if Friel loses by 15 votes again, after the
Expositor hatchet job, he'll want to kick himself and I'll
want to help him. I have no ulterior motives. I don't even
want the job of mayor. I just want to set up an interest-
free community currency and move on to bigger installations.

Sadly, I guess he didn't think the people I could bring to
him would exceed those against gambling, herb, and interest-
free loans for all and Friel never said it out loud though
it was witnessed so he's completely ashamed of admitting he
sees some of the uses of social municipal currency. But at
least he said it.

Mike Hancock, though a serious personable person, admitted
he didn't get it. He's got a background in finance so I know
interest-free financing was never taught and goes against
the cognitive dissonance installed in his mental software by
his education. I must sound like a dreamer: Who'd lend money
without any interest?" is what all the realists always have
to get over. "Who will lend money without getting any
interest?" is a truism they cannot shake. That is the reason
the banksters have for so long hidden the source of the
money supply because the answer is: Whoever creates it to
lend, instead of earns it to lend." See
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel/bankmath.htm

If you are creating new chips, what right do you have to
interest that a saver does? You did no work to get it like a
saver did. A creator has a a license to manufacture money,
no saving involved. So why should a creator of new Canadian
money be allowed to charge interest like a saver of old
Canadian money? But since almost no one knows someone
creates the money, everyone thinks it operates like a piggy
bank with money having to come into the bank before it can
be lent out, so no one ever thinks to oppose the injustice
of lending out newly-created money at interest by creators
like lending out newly-earned money at interest by savers.
So if you're hypnotized into believing no one should ever
lend money without getting interest, those who get the money
to lend by working and those who get it to lend by printing,
of course, it sounds like I'm dreaming instead of designing.
I've never pulled out or ever offered to pull out to support
another candidate before. So this certainly an extraordinary
circumstance which will certainly go down in the adventures
of John The Engineer.

Finally, a reminder of how a mayor could use LETS small-
denomination municipal bonds or tax credits for use as local
currency:

From http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel/pomlizas.htm

A mayor faced with rising costs and shrinking revenues,
To study any proposition, he would not refuse.
"So many think the job of being mayor is such a snap,
But the decisions that I'm faced with are an ugly trap.
With tools, materials and trades that cover total range,
Yet one ingredient is lacking, money to exchange.
If snowstorm hits the city and there are no funds to pay,
What does my council have to do to clear the snow away?

We pledge a million dollar bond to banks to get the cash,
With which we pay the skillful men who clear snow in a
flash.
The merchants gladly take the funds for soon they have to
pay,
The taxes for the snow removal that was done that day.

But though a million principle was spent, we must request,
That citizens be taxed for principle and interest.
To budget who gets scarce resources isn't ever fun,
But interest on city's debt is always number one.

Whatever rate the bankers set is due amount I pay,
Unhappily, which projects live or die's my only say.
But if it's true Greendollars serve as well as Locals tell:
Why shouldn't government be one to try it out as well?

When another snowstorm hits without the funds to pay,
We'll test to see if LETS Greendollars are a better way.
This time we pledge the million bond to Treasury instead,
And see if use of Green will get us very much ahead.

The merchant should accept Greendollars as another way,
His taxes needed for the snow removal, he can pay.
Again we'll spend a million but the tax to be assessed,
Including only principle without the interest.

Before the budget allocations are completely spent,
Could LETS Greendollars help reverse project abandonment?
If council members for their tax took part of pay in Green,
We'd have some cash left over which is something rarely
seen.

If civil service took some Green at least for taxes due,
The extra cash would guarantee that extra jobs ensue.
We'd offer Green to fix a pothole to a company,
Wishing to pay their tax with unemployed capacity.

With Green we'd pay for road repairs and all would gladly
take,
Greendollars from the working men so payment all could make;
And we could build our hospitals and all would take as pay,
Greendollars to buy medicine and service they purvey.

Today, in our society, where money clearly lacks,
Who could refuse some paper anyone may use for tax?
Greendollar paychecks could be earned by all desiring work,
The opportunity to pull their weight so few would shirk.

With Green the unemployed around the world will save the
day,
Without it they will idly sit and die their lives away.
And best of all we'd have the Green to save environment,
A way to pay to save our lives and make us affluent.

The only question left is how the tax should be assessed,
For goods and services? A simple formula to test.
For services, we'd levy tax at end of every year.
For assets, tax to pay depreciation. It's so clear.

I told Chris that if he set set up a Brantford Timebank,
he'd be mayor most of his life unless he moved on to bigger
things. I'm sure that with my huge "Vote Turmel" sign
hanging outside my window right across from the Brantford
Bridge with 20,000 cars going by every day, if I switch to
"Turmel voting for Friel" everyone in the city will know in
no time. I'm sure I could have swung not only Timebank
supporters but marijuana supporters who would never vote for
me (who can't win) but would for someone who can win,
gamblers who would never vote for me (who can't win) but
would for someone who can win.

Sad to think the city would end up not helping set up a
Brantford Timebank.


--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics

JCT: I can understand how some people could be upset at the
dog that brings the fleas. This is what sci.engr looks like:

Articles range from 58940 to 59006:  sci.engr
58940. New forum related to engineering                               Morbius
58941. Re: New forum related to engineering                          "Bosson"
58942. no Gamma Ray Pulsar; no Laser Pulsar are tentative proof o|a_plutonium
58943. TURMEL: Rotary Club mayoral debate badly covered by Judd   John Turmel
58944. The Piss Boy                                        w_b_ryan@...
58945. The Piss Boy                                        w_b_ryan@...
58946. TURMEL: #2 Ontario Gov. fixing fatal flaw in Toronto Dolla|John Turmel
58947. TURMEL: McAllister credited with Parker invalidation       John Turmel
58948. The Piss Boy                                        w_b_ryan@...
58949. The Piss Boy                                        w_b_ryan@...
58950. Wood expansion/contraction?                          Everett M. Greene
58951. TURMEL: Venezuela Ministry of Popular Economy Pilots Socia|John Turmel
58952. The Piss Boy                                        w_b_ryan@...
58953. Re: TURMEL: Venezuela Ministry of Popular Economy Pi|"David E. Powell"
58954. The Piss Boy                                        w_b_ryan@...
58955. Re: Wood expansion/contraction?                        "Tom Sanderson"
58956. TURMEL: Editor Judd's hatchet job smear on Friel continues John Turmel
58957. The Piss Boy                                        w_b_ryan@...
58958. P***-Boy Ryan p***ing off sci.engineering group            John Turmel
58959. TURMEL: Brantford poll shows 41% pea-brained and not divin|John Turmel
58960. The Piss Boy                                        w_b_ryan@...
58961. The Piss Boy                                        w_b_ryan@...
58962. Call for papers: Special Issue on: "Microbia|"macleod.roddy@googlemail
58963. Call for papers: Special Issue on: "Modellin|"macleod.roddy@googlemail
58964. Call for papers: Special Issue on: "Digital |"macleod.roddy@googlemail
58965. Call for papers: Special Issue on: "Modellin|"macleod.roddy@googlemail
58966. Re: The Piss Boy                                         "Jeff Rainer"
58967. TURMEL: General Davies can't deny "we're the bad guys" in  John Turmel
58968. Re: TURMEL: General Davies can't deny "we're the bad guy|"Jeff Rainer"
58969. Re: TURMEL: General Davies can't deny "we're the bad guys" |Dave Smith
58970. Re: TURMEL: General Davies can't deny "we're the bad guys" i|alpha hen
58971. TURMEL: Predicted Argentine financial miracle in 2001      John Turmel
58972. Re: TURMEL: General Davies can't deny "we're the bad|Chip Flintknapper
58973. The Piss Boy                                        w_b_ryan@...
58974. TURMEL: Editor Judd's still smearing Friel is bad manners  John Turmel
58975. TURMEL: Peace Prize for Yunus' micro-loansharking to the p|John Turmel
58976. TURMEL: Rogers debate dumbed down to Philp level?          John Turmel
58977. The Piss Boy                                        w_b_ryan@...
58978. The Piss Boy                                        w_b_ryan@...
58979. The Piss Boy                                        w_b_ryan@...
58980. TURMEL: "What inflation isn't" expert rejects what it is   John Turmel
58981. The Piss Boy                                        w_b_ryan@...
58982. TURMEL: Rogers TV producers dictate City Hall debate rules John Turmel
58983. The Piss Boy                                        w_b_ryan@...
58984. TURMEL: Pro-Gambler's confidence is Engineer's confidence  John Turmel
58985. TURMEL: Krieger wins his medpot case at Supreme Court      John Turmel
58986. TURMEL: "David Judd's a pig" blurted on TV debate          John Turmel
58987. Call for papers: Multidisciplinary Approach |"macleod.roddy@googlemail
58988. The Piss Boy                                        w_b_ryan@...
58989. The Piss Boy                                        w_b_ryan@...
58990. The Piss Boy                                        w_b_ryan@...
58991. Internet Resources Newsletter: November Issu|"macleod.roddy@googlemail
58992. **theory-edge** mailing list                          vznuri@...
58993. TURMEL: Fuhrer Philp controls questions for Rogers debate  John Turmel
58994. Positions Offered - L-3 Communications Sonoma EO (Sant|"Amber O'Brien"
58995. The Piss Boy                                 armeenhussain@...
58996. TURMEL: Rogers debate "enlightening, delighting, and excit|John Turmel
58997. The Piss Boy                                        w_b_ryan@...
58998. TURMEL: History Bites Torturers of American Justice        John Turmel
58999. The Piss Boy                                        w_b_ryan@...
59000. TURMEL: Marijuana a hit at Pauline Johnson H.S. debate     John Turmel
59001. Call for papers: Automotive Product Developm|"macleod.roddy@googlemail
59002. The Piss Boy                                        w_b_ryan@...
59003. TURMEL: Last Brantford mayoral debates Tuesday             John Turmel
59004. TURMEL: Brantford Online Timebank softwares to consider:   John Turmel
59005. The Piss Boy                                        w_b_ryan@...
59006. The Piss Boy                                        w_b_ryan@...

JCT: Some discussion but William Ryan hogging (fleaing) the
conversation is quite noticeable. Unfortunately, these fleas
were caught at ijccr. Ah well, it's where the action is.


--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics

JCT: All right Brantford voters. Right now, there are only
two candidates, me and Green Adam King who can promise to
set up a Timebank. If Brantford Council were to set up a
Brantford Timebank, here is a list of different online
softwares being touted around the world.

Take a surf to see how they work and let's discuss which we
should install at http://www.timebankbrantford.com
It now just points to my home page.

>PIPEX
Date: Wed, 29 Jun 2005 19:17:30 +0100
From: ashq87@... (Pipex)
Subject: Re: [ijccr] Turmel: Looking for currency softwares
To: TURMEL@... ("John C. Turmel")
Hi John, This is the UK System i developed for 100% local
currency (4,000 hrs) and used now by 12 groups in UK...
Developed by New Moray LETS - The UK's largest LETS system -
Cumulative turnover = 31,000,000 LETS = UK pounds
Zero balance, no defaulters, expanding exchange limits,
really easy to use does all admin efficiently.

JCT: How nice to hear. No defaulters. Most people just can't
imagine a system which deters cheats from even trying. Zero!
Even the poor have the integrity to want to return the time
they owe for time received! Every bum who'd stiff you for
$50 won't stiff you for a morning's help.

The LETSAM (LETS System Administration Manager)
http://www.cxn.org.uk/letsam/index.htm
Upwards and onwards, Stewart Noble
Stewart@...
Community Exchange Network http//www.cxn.org.uk
60 Woodside Drive, Forres, Moray. IV36 2UF
Tel: (01309) 676128 Mobile: (07966) 019544
(Please save this, my only e-mail address and delete all others)
Virus checked with Symantec Norton Antivirus updated daily
----- Original Message -----
From: John C. Turmel
To: ijccr@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2005 6:55 PM
Subject: [ijccr] Turmel: Looking for currency softwares

I'm upgrading the list of LETS softwares at my home page and would
appreciate a note from anyone citing the home page of such software
so I can provide a maximized list.
---

WILBY
Date: Fri, 25 Jun 2004 17:24:51 -0300
From: "Chris wilby" <wilby_chris@...>
Subject: Re: Timedollar software
Hi Bill, I have an online database driven LETS based system
that might fit your needs, it supports grouping of users.
The flexible pay structure is a monthly user membership fee
based on the systems monetary units (green dollars,
barterbucks, friendly favours...).... so there is no upfront
fees.
I am currently working on the system documentation, which
should be completed within a month. If you would like to
discuss this further, and get more information on all the
system features..... feel free to agive me a call or drop me
an email Thanks,  Chris Wilby 506-457-9193
---

GEEKCREDIT
From: Alexander Komarov <toor@...>
Hi! Here is just another p2p complementary currency
software: http://home.gna.org/geekcredit

It can be used to create a community currency if users have
PCs. Permanent internet connection is not required, e-mail
or instant messenger can be used for payments.
The software is alpha, it has all the features, a minimal
GUI (all options are available in command line only). It was
not widely tested (about ~200 downloads so far), but I am
not aware about any serious bugs now.
The design goal was simplicity and minimalism. This is just
a digital version of the WAT exchange system
( http://www.watsystems.net ) from Japan.
It does not require a central server for processing
transactions, but for larger scale operation it does require
a server for information on frauds and ratings.
I would highly appreciate any comments and suggestions.
Alexander.
---

WAT from Japan.
( http://www.watsystems.net )
---

TIMEDOLLAR
>From: Timedollar@yahoogroups.com
>Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 21:34:47 +0000
>From: kathy-oc@...
>Subject: Re: New Time Dollar Software?
We have a web-based software. I am not on the schedule to
demo it, but would be happy to, if asked. Kathy
time-exchange network http://www.time-exchange.net Denver,CO
---

CYCLOS
>Date: Wed, 19 May 2004 17:11:50 -0000
>From: "Hugo van der Zee" <hugo_van_der_zee@...>
>Subject: Software
Hello, We have published community currency software
(Cyclos) for testing. People that are interested can
register and login at: http://cyclos.momomo.org/cyclos
I will need to activate the accounts before you can log in.
I am doing this daily. For bug reporting you can register
and login at http://bugtracker.momomo.org
(Before bug reporting please read the explanation on the
main page of the bugtracker)
The software can be configured through settings like initial
credit, credit limit, taxes and fees like demurrage and
transaction tax, contributions etc.
Because of this the software can support various models as:
multiple credit (let) system, barter system, a system where
Units are backed with conventional money and combinations of
these models.
We have scheduled various test periods and in august the
software will be published open source. After that we will
continue on software that will interconnect separate systems
(with multiple currencies) and we will work on stronger
security.
More information about the software project can be found at
http://cyclos.momomo.org/project/index.html
---

WEBLETS
>Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2005 21:18:45 -0500
>From: <martin_settle@...>
>Subject: Re: Re: LETS Software
Ottawa LETS created a LETS software system when we were
struggling with QLETS.
Our system was a web-based program that uses PHP and MySQL,
so you need to have a server running both of those programs
(most Linux systems have them preinstalled), and if you want
the most out of the program, an internet connection.
WebLETS (our program) has a script to transfer QLets
accounts to WebLETS (balance, account info, and trade totals
only).
It also allows users to input trades and advertisements
themselves. We used it in Ottawa for two years with very
few issues (most of which related to the computer know-how
of our members).
WebLETS is available as Open Source software from
http://www.sourceforge.net/projects/weblets
There aren't too many directions online, although there is a
set up script that will work if you correct the missing 'T'
in one of the initial files (details on the website).  Once
it is set up it is fairly easy to use, and mostly self-
explanatory.
If you have any specific questions you can e-mail me, but as
I am currently in the middle of a move to England, I may be
slow in replying.
Martin Settle
---

LETS on SQL Ledger
>Date: Mon, 18 Apr 2005 14:06:30 -0700
>From: Todd Boyle <tboyle@...>
>Subject: LETS on SQL Ledger
As you can see, SQL Ledger remains active. Certainly it is
more active and has more users than any other accounting
system running in a browser.
http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum=sql-
ledger-users
Take the test drive.   http://www.sql-ledger.org/
As you can see it handles goods inventory etc. It is a real
system. obviously- -a community could be supported on this,
having mutual payables and receivables on the server and
being able to actually maintain their books, all in a single
integrated system. Todd
---

SQUIRES
>Date: Mon,  4 Apr 2005 10:56:32 -0400
>From: Eric Harris-Braun <eric@...>
>Subject: Re: Fwd: Nuts and Bolts of LETS Development
Les Squires has a very good wiki site operational that
already has lots of work in the arena going on:  Check it
out at: http://ccit.wji.com
---

GOGO
>Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2005 15:43:54 -0700
>From: silviog@... (Hans Eisenkolb)
>Subject: Re: You are invited to preregister with Green
my name is Hans Eisenkolb and I am the inventor of the
Gogos, an usuryfree cash system . You can read about it here
under Gogo English http://www.gogo-regios.com/ and also in
my forum here: http://www.gogo-regios.com/forum/
There are already a few initiatives with such a money
started in Germany. The first one last March in Giessen
Germany and six much larger ones will start this year. It
could even be more because nearly every week I hear from new
ones. Basically Gogos under different names in different
towns are given out by participating business people as
merchandise tokens, backed by their merchandise and held at
a stable purchasing power. This is possible by a small user
fee of 5% for all year. Depending on the speed of turnover
of these tokens it will amount to near nothing for each
sale. Greetings Hans
---

FRIENDLY FAVORS
http://www.favors.org

SANE
http://www.ces.org.za/index.asp

CCLITE
Subject: [ijccr] Digest Number 1114
Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 17:13:09 -0000
From: "Hugh Barnard" <hughbarnardlists@...>
Subject: Just to introduce myself
Hi I'm a non-academic alt-money enthusiast and software
developer. I'm part of a group that meets in Limehouse Town
Hall in the East End of London (next one 7pm 18th August,
ask me if you want more details..).
I'm also slowly developing a Perl LETS and alt-money package
called cclite:
http://hughbarnard.org/index.cgi?name=cclite.html which now
has a draft manual at: http://hughbarnard.org/cclite/
I'm also a member of Richard Kay's list at:
http://copsewood.net/mailman/listinfo/mrsdev which has
bursts of useful activity and is software-oriented.
Hope that's not too boring, I'm an anorak I LIKE many
apparently boring things.. Best regards Hugh

YACUB
Date: Sat, 21 May 2005 10:58:07 -0700
From: yacinfo@... (ernie yacub)
Subject: Re: [ijccr] Turmel: Looking for currency softwares
To: TURMEL@... ("John C. Turmel")
On Saturday 21 May 2005 10:55, you wrote:
> I'm upgrading the list of LETS softwares at my home page
> and would appreciate a note from anyone citing the home
> page of such software so I can provide a maximized list.

demo soon to be ready for primetime at
http://om.neurd.net/tiki-index.php
---

More:
http://www.complementarycurrency.org/software.html

Cyclos http://project.cyclos.org
Timekeeper for Time Dollar
http://www.timekeeper.org/timekeeper/index.html
Ripple http://ripple.sourceforge.net/
Open Money http://www.openmoney.org/go/cc.html
CCLite http://hughbarnard.org/index.cgi?name=cclite.html
XO Barter software http://www.barter-software.com/
Local Exchange http://sourceforge.net/projects/local-
exchange/
BCI barter software http://www.barter-software.net/
iWAT http://www.media-art-online.org/iwat/
more about WAT
http://home.debitel.net/user/RMittelstaedt/Money/watto-e.htm
uniLETIM http://uniletim.sourceforge.net/
Ecomoney http://www.ecomoney.co.uk/
DualCurrency Systems http://www.dualcurrency.com/
Geek credit http://home.gna.org/geekcredit/
PyLETS http://copsewood.net/py_lets_cgi/index.html
Greetings, Sjaak Adriaanse, Tekst & Uitleg tel. (+31) (0)165 546 557



--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics

JCT: Tuesday are my last two chances to explain how a
Brantford Timebank would work. The Brantford Kiwanis Club
are doing interviews with each of the "two" favored
candidates they know but have not taken on any new ideas.
Kiwanians are usually oldsters without much of a feel for
democracy, after all, most of their lives, they've never
looked at all the candidates' ideas before and there's no
reason for old dogs to learn new tricks now. Kiwanis
Democracy goes on.

And the Brantford Expositor is interviewing each of the
candidates they know so well. And Saturday, they had two
articles in a page and a half.

>Brantford Expositor
>Mayor candidates in re-match
>Race again shows dramatic contrast in styles
>Date: Saturday, November 04, 2006 @ 01:00
>By Michael Allan Marion, Expositor Staff

MAM: Brantford is being treated to an electoral rematch in
the 2006 race between Mayor Mike Hancock and predecessor
Chris Friel that shows more than ever a dramatic contrast in
styles.

Listen carefully, though, to the two repeat the 2003 clash
that had a 15-year councillor best a nine-year mayor by 15
votes, and you'll not hear much difference in each
candidate's vision of the city's future. As the race
approaches the home stretch, the differences are more
articulated in the intermittent criticisms that each makes
of the other's actions and decisions while in the mayor's
chair.

At 64, Hancock is sticking to the undramatic, quiet,
capable, steady-as-she-goes, consensus-building style of
management that saw him through the 2003 race. For the past
three years he has used that style to preside over a
disputatious council marked by a strong divergence in
viewpoints, and put together the building blocks of a deal
to bring a Ferrero plant to Brantford. In successive all-
candidates debates during the past three weeks Hancock has
characterized his style as an effective combination of
vision, leadership and the ability to get people with
divergent opinions to work together toward a common goal. He
says his style is a good complement to a politically potent
council that he presents as "vibrant" and "the best I've
served with" in his 18 years in politics. Together, Hancock
says, they have assisted a huge expansion in the Laurier
Brantford-Mohawk College-Nipissing University downtown
campus, written a new community strategic plan and started a
review of two-dozen city services to make them better. He
also credits the "dynamic" relationship with achieving the
full-flowering of the downtown grants program with several
new apartment buildings and businesses, taking the civic
square project to the brink of construction, and cleaning up
many brownfield sites. All of these matters, he says, are
creating the better Brantford of tomorrow.

Friel is presenting himself as a sort of Back To The Future,
visionary candidate with a more complex political character.
The charming, eloquent politician spent most of his stint in
office overcoming the "boy mayor" moniker given him when he
was first elected at 27 in 1994. He had to wait until the
third term for his "visionary," assertive, "populist"
approach to allow him to accomplish the beginnings of
Laurier Brantford and the downtown revitalization effort.
Now he is asking the voters to believe he is an "older,
wiser" leader who, at 39, has learned "life lessons" during
his three years in enforced private life. Make no mistake,
Friel assures everyone, he'll still be the 'unorthodox
mayor" he's always called himself. He'll be just as brash,
he further assures, but owing to his older, wiser ways, he
will probably be less combative with councillors and others
who disagree with him. Friel says he wants to return to
office partly to rescue the downtown renaissance effort
which he contends has strayed from the program's original
intentions, and he wants to speed up the redevelopment of
brownfields that he says is proceeding too slowly. This
time, though, he says he will be known as an "environmental
mayor," closely examining policies and decisions for their
impact on "the "air we breathe, the water we drink and the
ground we walk on."

Many of those themes were evident in separate wide-ranging
interviews that a panel of Expositor reporters and editors
held with Hancock and Friel this week.

JCT: Presenting the whole picture to the Brantford
community, the David Judd way.

MAM: On Tuesday, Hancock sat in the board room in much the
same manner he did in a similar encounter three years ago.
Nothing in front of him but a sheet of quick cue notes that
he rarely referred to during the next hour. He was grilled
on his handling of the $2-million civic square project which
has been delayed through prolonged disputes on council
during the previous six months. The wrangling culminated in
a 6-5 vote against proceeding with a tender that would take
the project $455,000 over budget, followed by a decision to
retender the site preparation and construction in two
phases. That meant that a signature project of his term
would not be finished by December as planned, but would have
to wait till spring with completion in the autumn  about 10
months behind schedule. Hancock said he was disappointed at
the outcome, but refused to say it demonstrated a failure of
leadership in bringing council together. He said it is
important to understand the political environment around
council and the factors of the situation. "With this
council, every serious vote has been 6-5," he offered, "and
it wasn't supposed to be on the agenda for a council meeting
that day." He was on a "working holiday" in Europe at the
time as a goodwill ambassador with the Paris and Port Dover
Pipe Band, he explained, when his office informed him by
Blackberry that the vote was coming. He said he flew back a
day early from Europe, put in calls to councillors and made
his pitch at the meeting, but came up a vote short. "How can
you say it was a failure?" he responded to one questioner.
"I tried as hard as I could to get six votes. I did my
best."

Hancock also said some councillors were confused by the
issues and he knows at least one voted the wrong way. "The
money that might be saved wasn't important at that stage,"
he said. "It was about living up to a commitment to people
in the downtown. "Ninety-nine per cent of the time I have
won these close votes. This one didn't happen."

When Friel appeared before the panel the next day, he was
asked to account for his three years out of office that he
says taught him "life lessons" and gave him more wisdom. He
recounted his time at three different employment pursuits in
the past three years: a first foray at consulting for
planning and development projects that he said was never
"seriously" followed; a stint as manager of an economic
development program at the Native Affairs Secretariat until
the department was restructured and his job eliminated; and
as a manager at Wurth Industries, a new subsidiary of an
American service supply operation that set up shop in the
area. That job came to an abrupt end with a severance
package, less than two weeks before Friel filed his papers
on the last day of nominations to run for mayor.
"Unfortunately, as much as I tried, fasteners just didn't do
it for me," he said. "It was more my decision to go." He
said he had actually pondered running for mayor again about
a year before, but couldn't pursue it.

In the middle of it all, Friel recounted how he also had to
deal with a grave, life-threatening illness suffered by his
wife, Wendy Farrant, that rendered her paralyzed for several
days and required several months of extensive recovery. He
said the heart-wrenching time changed him personally in many
ways.

Also in the mayoral race are Winston Ferguson and John
Turmel, a perennial candidate in local municipal, provincial
and federal races who preaches the virtues of social capital
and volunteer credit approaches to financing.

JCT: Another in-depth report from Michael Allan "Tape
Recorder 101 wasn't so hard" Marion. He may hear the virtues
of social financing but can't explain it. Someday,
journalism students will study this kind of biased coverage
in their "what not to do" course.

And another big article titled:

>Candidates have contrasting styles

JCT: First headline was "Race again shows dramatic contrast
in styles" and now "Candidates have contrasting styles."
Such diversity of investigation! When you are low-tech
reporters who can't handle high-tech substance, what else
can Judd and Marion do their interviews on but style.
---

>Date: Sat, 04 Nov 2006 22:52:00 +0000
>From: wldlfe57@... (wldlfe57)
>Subject: [Brantford] turmel
>To: brantford@yahoogroups.com

John Turmel for Mayor... of Afghanistan
And he can take Friel with him.

JCT: I wouldn't want to be the mayor of the town of
Afghanistan though I'd bet wldlfe couldn't find it on a map.

>Date: Sat, 04 Nov 2006 19:30:43 -0500
>From: iggabod@... (". - Lori - .")
>Subject: Re: [Brantford] turmel
>To: brantford@yahoogroups.com

> John Turmel for Mayor ... of Afghanistan
> And he can take Friel with him.

rofl!

JCT: I didn't think it was that funny enough to be "Rolling
On Floor Laughing" but if that's your sense of humor.

I know some voters may prefer to have low-tech reporters
dumb-down their information for them but for those who do
not, here are the last two meetings where all candidates
have been invited to present their ideas, a discourse the
politically-challenged voter may not appreciate.

Tuesday Nov 7
9am-10am
Laurier University Odeon Bldg. 50 Market St. Brantford

6pm-9pm
St. Gabriel School, Flanders & Shellard Lane. Unfortunately,
it's not listed under schools in the yellow pages so there
is no address. It's a 10-minute opening statement! No one's
dumb-down to the Tim Philp level with tiny Tim-bits of
information.


--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics

JCT: It didn't start all that well when Friel, Hancock and I
were in the staff room and teacher-organizer Geoff Goodall
warned that he'd seen the Rogers debate on Thursday night
and was not pleased at the personal attack on the city's
editor. I figured he was talking about me but I didn't
defend my base conclusion, "David Judd, you're a pig." But
when he continued to warn against foul language, I asked him
if he meant me saying "dog shit" instead of "doggy-do." He
couldn't point out anything else so I just bemoaned "shit"
being called "foul language."

Students from several other high schools had been invited,
including some from Brantford Collegiate Institute which
just happened to make the news last Saturday:

>Five charged in drug bust near BCI brantford
>Date: Saturday, October 28, 2006 @ 01:00
>Brantford Expositor

>Five people, including three 17-year-olds, were arrested
Thursday after selling drugs to undercover police officers
near Brantford Collegiate Institute. "We will not tolerate
drug dealing in our community. When our street crimes unit
heard about drugs being sold near a high school, they jumped
right on it," acting Insp. Geoff Nelson said Friday. "They
initiated an investigation right away."

JCT: Drug dealing! Oh no.

>Police seized some cocaine and marijuana following the
arrests. Earlier, officers in the street crimes unit
arranged to buy some drugs after hearing reports of dealing
going on near the school. A man met an undercover officer to
complete the transaction and was subsequently arrested. He
was found with 0.5 grams of crack cocaine. Police then
arranged to purchase drugs a second time. This time, two
youths showed up to complete the transaction and were
arrested. The older teen had seven grams of marijuana while
a younger youth had 6.3 grams of marijuana. Police continued
investigating and found two other teenagers involved in drug
dealing. One of the youths had 26.2 grams of marijuana; both
were subsequently arrested.

JCT: Brantford is now safer from these threats. The serious
threat of a dozen joints from one criminal and almost a
whole ounce of danger from the other have been averted.

>William Smith, 21, of Palace Street is charged with breach
of probation and possession of a controlled substance
(cocaine) for the purposes of trafficking and possession of
proceeds of crime (cash).

Joshua Brown, 19, of Palace Street, is charged with
possession of proceeds of crime (cash) and possession of a
controlled substance for the purpose of trafficking.
Also charged are: a 17-year-old with possession for the
purposes of trafficking and breach of probation; a second
17-year-old with breach of probation, three counts of
trafficking, one count of possession for the purposes of
trafficking and possession of proceeds of crime; a third 17-
year-old with breach of probation and three counts of
trafficking and one count of possession of proceeds of
crime.

JCT: How much court crime to be dealt with?

>breach of probation
>possession for the purposes of trafficking
>possession of proceeds of crime (cash).
>breach of probation;
>possession of proceeds of crime (cash)
>possession for the purpose of trafficking.
>possession for the purposes of trafficking
>breach of probation,
>three counts of trafficking,
>one count of possession for the purposes of trafficking
>possession of proceeds of crime;
>breach of probation and
>three counts of trafficking and
>one count of possession of proceeds of crime.

JCT: Wow, all that crime or the courts to deal out of an
ounce of pot. Har har har har. Notice 4 out 5 were out on
bail already! Real winner crime prevention.

So I decided to save timebanking for questions and explained
the marijuana pitch to the students. They loved it. Of
course. I explained that laughing grass felt good because
growing new brain cells feels good. Drink alcohol and
tomorrow's hangover is because you destroyed brain cells.
Grow new ones and it feels good. So I told them to spread
the word to the BCI kids who were busted I could help them.

And then, I explained how the LETS software worked. Michael
Allan Marion came in late so  he missed the marijuana
speech. In my closing remarks, I pointed him out to the
crowd, then pointed out how the Expositor reports were
biased toward the major two and almost nothing on the
technical one. What to expect from a guy whose greatest
claim to technical fame is passing Tape Recorder 101. That
got a huge laugh. Hope Marion enjoys being laughed at
because it's his fate every time I catch the low-tech scribe
in the audience.

After the meeting, I was sitting on the edge of the stage
with the Brantford Timebank flyer on one side and the
marijuana flyer on the other. The teacher, Goodall, who had
insisted on putting me in my place before the debate came up
to me and asked that I not pass out the marijuana flyer. The
Timebank flyer, sure. I refused. I wasn't going to let these
voters get away without one of them. I stepped away to get
something out of my case and when I got back, he had picked
up my marijuana flyers.

I calmly sat down, reached over and yanked them out of his
hands and started offering them to students who were
surrounding me saying: Be bold, read what they don't want
you to read. Read the banned flyer. Many kids did. The
teacher asked me to leave. I told him no. I wasn't so get
out of here and leave me alone. He rushed off to get the
principal. When he showed up, he too said they didn't want
any pro-drug material offered and I told him I wasn't going
to be censored. He asked me to leave and I told him: Call a
cop. I'm not leaving. And don't touch me or I'll charge you
with assault. All the while bemoaning: imagine trying to
censor my paper. He departed the scene, whether to call a
cop or not, I don't know but I did not tarry. It's always
funny to see cops rushing in as I'm exiting. Then the
callers have to explain what I did to necessitate their
help. Har har har har.

Goodall followed me out to the door. I asked him how it felt
to run into an immovable object? He said it showed the
weakness of democracy and wished him a fun time explaining
to his adult voting students why he should be censoring what
they get to read.

I was followed outside to the main drag by several students
and before long, there were 40 or 50. A couple helped answer
their friends' questions before I could. One kid saw it as a
labour exchange. A Local Employment-Trading System, a
labour exchange? Yes. They didn't seem to have the same
problem of failing to see the benefits of a Brantford
timebank account like their beaten- and dumbed-down parents.

Did the altercation over the attempt to censor the marijuana
flyer make the news? Har har har har.

>Brantford Expositor
>Students grill mayoral candidates
>By Michael-Allan Marion, expositor staff
>Date: Tuesday, October 31, 2006 @ 01:00

MAM: About 200 students from three city high schools got
their chance to hear starkly different presentations and
styles from Mayor Mike Hancock and predecessor Chris Friel
in a city mayoral debate at Pauline Johnson College on
Monday.

Brantford College Institute, St. John's College and PJ
students filled the cafeteria to hear Hancock defend his and
the current council's record of "dynamic" achievement with a
burgeoning economy, a "completely successful" series of
downtown revitalization projects and the growth of a
university campus. "Brantford is a city with incredible
promise. I see a prosperous, proud, dynamic city," he told
students, while asking any who can vote to give him another
term to carry on in serving the public of a city he has
loved since he arrived in the mid-1980s.

Friel exhorted the youthful audience to recognize their
hidden power as young citizens craving change. "You have
more power than you think," he told them. "You should at
every opportunity always exercise your franchise and vote,"
he continued. "We need to start listening to what you have
to say. You have the power to tell us what you think and and
we have the power to use the resources of the municipality
to work for you."

A third candidate, John Turmel, preached the virtues of
using social currency to finance public projects, and a
volunteer time banking system that he said students could
take advantage of by volunteering time in public service in
return for credits they could use later on trips and other
desires.

Winston Ferguson, the fourth candidate in the race, did not
participate.

At the end, the debate's two student moderators, Ali Thomson
and Emily Vandermeulen, both 17-year-old PJ students, said
they and their peers were the better for the experience.
Although the two can't vote in the Nov. 13 municipal
election, "we heard things we should be thinking about when
we're of the age to vote," said Vandermeulen. "It provides
good insight for the years to come," said Thomson.

Note
Marion interviewed the students who can't vote instead of
those who can!

MAM: The candidates answered questions on the state of
downtown revitalization, brownfields, the prospect of a
city-county deal on boundary adjustments, whether the mayor
should have cancelled a rally at a local public facility
concerning frustration over the continuing native occupation
of a housing project site in Caledonia, relations with Six
Nations and cleaning up Mohawk Lake and Mohawk Park.

Hancock insisted he made the right decision "in the
interests of public safety' in refusing to let Richmond Hill
agitator Gary McHale and his wife hold a rally at the Lions
Park arena about three weeks ago. "Have you seen his
website? It's pretty scary," he said. "I will always err on
the side of safety." Friel said he would have let McHale
have his rally. Although he didn't support any of the
comments on the website, he said he didn't think they were
scary, and preferred to let people exercise their right to
free speech.

JCT: So did Turmel.

MAM: He said the rally and other manifestations of protest
spoke to frustration over a long-standing problem, which he
blamed on previous and current governments that won't
negotiate land claims and settle legitimate native issues.

Hancock said the current council has made great progress in
cleaning up the city's 15 brownfield sites and looks forward
to the them no longer being a city issue by the end of the
next term of council.

Friel said progress has taken longer than it needed, due to
time-consuming studies and meetings that aren't bringing the
province to the table. "We're not going to wait for the
province to come in," if he's elected mayor, he said. The
reality is," he added, 'that not all of these brownfields
are as polluted as believed."

Both Friel and Hancock agreed it's important to clean up
Mohawk Lake.

JCT: I wanted to clean it up too

MAM: "We're going to have the opportunity when the federal
government gives the $12 million they promised to give,"
Hancock said of the grant for the cleanup of the Greenwich-
Mohawk brownfield area, which is right beside the lake.
Hancock defended council's record of dispensing $8 million
in downtown grants and the civic square to generate a total
$45 million in new investment.

Friel repeated his oft-made criticism that virtually all of
the grant money has gone to large projects and major
investors. "People who want $50,000 or so for a project
can't get it. All the money is going to the big ones."

JCT: And I said nobody would need grants, corporate charity,
if they had interest-free credit at the banks.

One interesting thing was that Chris Friel told the kids to
listen carefully to what I was saying. Though he didn't
agree with everything, he did agree with lots. You can bet
the scribe didn't like it being pointed out that the stuff
he couldn't keep up with had merit.

And of course, he came in late to miss the part about
marijuana so he didn't know why the marijuana flyer was such
an issue. So he didn't report it. Sad to think people's
information has to be dumbed-down to the level of the
dumbed-down scribe.

As for Fuhrer Philp saying marijuana was not a municipal
issue, Ottawa Mayor Bon Chiarelli raised it:

>Mayor targets 'high' schools, Wants more cops in schools to
weed out 'rampant' pot
>OTTAWA SUN
>By JORGE BARRERA,

JB: Mayor Bob Chiarelli says there's a drug epidemic in city
schools and he wants more cops policing pushers and stoned
students. Up to 60% of Ottawa students are getting high on
pot during the school day, Chiarelli said yesterday as he
unveiled a plan designed to attack drug pushers in the
hallways and playgrounds.

JCT: And still passing their grades. That's the real truth.
Better stop whatever it is they're doing that's not hurting
their grades.

JB: "There is a rampant problem of drugs in our schools,"
said Chiarelli, who has been badly trailing mayoral
candidates Larry O'Brien and frontrunner Alex Munter in the
polls.

JCT: Bob's desperate. Given he was the Liberal campaign
manager in my very first election in 1979, Bob heard about
social currency and hasn't caught on longer than any other
politician in the world. Unfortunately, Alex is another who
never caught on to how social currency works.

JB: Chiarelli promised to ask the Ottawa Police Services
Board to deploy 13 more officers to act as school resource
officers. This would increase the ratio of officers in
schools to one for every 10 schools, up from one for every
15 schools. The mayor said the additional officers would
come from the 180 new police hires expected over the next
two years.

JCT: Need lots of municipal funding to prevent what's not
hurting their grades. Guess not everyone agrees with Fuhrer
Philp that marijuana is not a municipal issue since it uses
up municipal funds. Oh well, Philp isn't the sharpest tack
in the box.

JB: 'HAVEN FOR DRUGS?
Chiarelli said principals and vice-principals have told him
that 40-60% of the student body could be smoking pot in the
course of the school day. The mayor said he was told by a
vice-principal at a Barrhaven school that 45-55% of students
were "doing drugs every day." Ottawa-Carleton District
School Board trustee David Moen said district staff have
never mentioned anything about a drug epidemic in the city's
schools. "It is news to me that students are using that rate
during the school day," said Moen, trustee for Innes, Beacon
Hill-Cyrville. "We are always concerned by inappropriate
drug use, but we have no information that there is a massive
use rate."

JCT: You'd think so much "drug" use would have hurt their
grades, right? Maybe learning high isn't so bad at all?

JB: When pressed on his pot-smoking data, Chiarelli referred
reporters to background documents. The documents make no
mention of school-based drug use in Ottawa. Documents did
cite Statistics Canada data that said the rate of youth drug
offences had dropped over the past three years, including a
12% decrease last year for pot-related offenses.
OFFENCES UP
StatsCan did find that offences related to harder drugs had
increased. Health Canada data said that one-third of youth
aged 15-24 had used pot at some point in their lives. Ottawa
police data showed a 2% increase in drug-related calls last
year.

JCT: 33% used pot once and Bob says 60% use pot daily. Must
be really desperate. Next he'll be warning of weapons of
mass destruction being built in shop class.

>Chiarelli Crackdown Will Saddle 60% Of Our Future Workforce
With Pot Convictions
>OCTOBER 25, 2006
>NATIONAL CAPITAL REFORMERS SAY THAT'S BAD FOR BUSINESS, BOB
>Russell Barth & Christine Lowe 613-248-9190 kegan@...

RB: It happened with Light Rail, and now it's happening with
drug policy: with incumbent mayoral candidate Bob Chiarelli,
there seems to be an issue with the numbers. But this time,
the stakes are higher: the human resources of the economic
future of Ottawa. According to Chiarelli, school officials
are reporting to him that 60% of their youth are daily
marijuana users yet according to the 2005 Ontario Student
Drug Use and Health Survey, only about 18.1% of students use
marijuana every day. Interestingly, courts have ruled that
smell alone is not a standard of proof for indicating
marijuana use, which is likely what led these school
officials to their wild overestimates.
Still, Chiarelli wants to hire more police to catch youth
smoking pot and give them criminal records.

JCT: Like our expert law enforcement in Brantford.
Unfortunately, Fuhrer Philp says it's not a municipal issue
and didn't allow any questions on his staged Rogers debate
where all questions were from the media panel or pre-
screened. Censorship of the issue is just as effective as
censorship of the speaker.

RB: "Since a lot of our government, defense contracting, and
high-tech industries need people with reliable background
checks, Chiarelli's crackdown might cripple some of our
future leaders because they just happened to be caught,"
said Russell Barth, who holds a federal medical marijuana
licence. "Most Canadians want marijuana legalized and don't
buy the police and political rhetoric attached to the drug,"
continued Barth. "Meantime, the mayor wants to perpetuate
this policy. That's bad for business and that's bad for
Ottawa, Bob."
"Chiarelli's goal is noble." Said Barth's wife, Christine
Lowe, also a licence holder who uses cannabis to manage
epilepsy. "One should not be introducing pot, caffeine,
alcohol, sugar, or any drug into a brain chemistry system
that has not yet finished developing.

JCT: Hey, marijuana is good for the brain says a U. of
Saskatchewan study last year.

RB: Also, it is simply disrespectful to teachers. However, I
think Chiarelli is being reactionary - reacting to an
existing problem rather than trying to prevent a newer
bigger one," said Lowe. "With Chiarelli's right-wing-
sounding crime rhetoric, he is also trying to steal the so-
called Tim Horton's vote from Larry O'Brien, and
differentiate himself from Alex Munter, who may be perceived
as progressive on the issue."

"Increased enforcement will likely foster even more
resentment towards authority, making more kids do more
drugs, or even drop out of school entirely. What is really
needed - and has been lacking for decades - is a
straightforward, honest drug education program, free of all
the hyperbole and fear-mongering of standard "drug
education" programs." said Barth.

JCT: Since they're lying about marijuana, maybe they're also
lying about heroine?

RB: Ottawa doesn't need more police to enforce our failed
pot laws. It needs a new approach to drug education that is
health based, not punitive. More doctors, less cops.

National Capital Reformers are a collective of independent
community members dedicated to highlighting options and
alternatives in the municipal and federal drug policy
debate.

JCT: Anyway, despite Tiny Tim-bit thinking, marijuana is a
municipal issue even if I'm the only candidate challenging
Fuhrer Philp's censorship of the topic.



--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics

JCT: http://www.historybites.com plays on the Comedy Channel
Expressview 625 and is one of the funniest best-researched
peeks at history from a futuristic TV newsroom angle and
ranks right up there with the "Yes Minister" series for its
precise portrayal of political and historical truth. It is
one great series.

I was watching Episode 80

Goodnight Good Knights TEMPLARS 1307 AD

"A group who have dedicated themselves to charity and
Christian works are suddenly accused of the vilest crimes
imaginable. These crusading Christians known as the Knights
Templar are rounded up by French authorities, and tortured
into confessions. It's an unholy crusade against some holy
crusaders, presented by Bill Kurtis on Medieval Justice.
Other parodies include Ed Sullivan, The Weakest Link, and
Furniture On The Mend.
Written by:
Danny DiTata, Jeremy Winkels, Rick Green

Starring:
Ron Pardo, Janet Van De Graaff, Bob Bainborough, Teresa
Pavlinek, Duncan McKenzie, Rick Green

JCT: What an incredibly talented cast of players!!!

The best part is the setting of the play, Bill Kurtis
hosting an "American Justice" show as the Templars are
tortured into confessing.

Amerika no longer abides by the Geneva Prisoner of War
conventions. Nothing hard to do. James Bacque's "Other
Losses" detailed how General Eisenhower starved over 1
million German Prisoners of War to death by changing their
status from "P.O.W." who are entitled to Geneva Convention
protection to "D.E.F." Disarmed Enemy Forces, not entitled
to Geneva Convention protection and cutting their rations
until they starved to death! One change in status and we're
all incarceratable and eliminatable. Liquidatable?

What's funny about Americans thinking it's okay because the
torturing is going to be done to bad guys is they didn't notice
that in the fine print is not only "doing terrorism" but
"supporting terrorism." In a possible thousand ways. For
instance, Bush has already argued that buying marijuana
provides funding for terrorists. A whole new class of people
he can make disappear without trial forever (with death
penalty at his disposal, at least in Stalin's days, they got
trials). Your mosque once hosted someone who later
kamikazeed the invaders of whatever land Amerika happens to
be in occupation of at that particular time, and your mosque
can be targeted as "supporting terrorism" and your support
for your mosque can be targeted as "supporting terrorism
too." So another convenient group the Bush-whackers may wish
to oppress. Librarians who did not obey the Patriot Act have
certainly abetted the terrorists and when martial law comes
to Amerika, they'll be the early ones in the FEMA
concentration camps I've heard them building over the past
25 years. I wanted to joke, why not use those empty FEMA
civilian internment camps for Katrina refugees?

The standard Bush canard is: What if the guy won't tell
where he's hidden a nuclear bomb, wouldn't you torture? To
say okay, only in the case of imminent mass destruction,
they say "terrorism is such a threat so torture is
acceptable." So Amerikans buy torturing terrorists without
realizing almost anyone can now be declared a terrorist
supporter. It's not only aliens made vulnerable to legal
disappearance down the Amerikan Gulag Hole. It's not just
Arabs who resist Amerikan dictatorship who can be
disappeared like Mayer Arar almost was, it's also Canadians
(like Mayer Arar was) and Europeans and everyone. The Bush
Dictatorship has declared war on anyone who resists its
inherent goodness. Amerika Good ergo Resistance Bad?

So, probably protesting at an army base will soon be called
"supporting the terrorists." Pacifism will be termed
"supporting the terrorists." Dictatorships have always used
the "You're with us or you're against us and we attack you,"
just like they used, we just found out, on Pakistan to help
their posse chase after framing the Taliban 911.

I'm glad to see the legitimate Taliban coming back into
government as the Nato invaders are convinced to leave
rather the U.S.-supported CIA opium-lords. Yet, most farmers
only growing poppies because there are no markets for any
other agricultural products. But they could grow some pretty
good cannabis marijuana and they certainly had a good
reputation for hash in days of my youth though I'm sure the
prices won't be so high once prohibition of cannabis has
been abolished.

The world has never had such a clear-cut Nuremberg case to
prosecute. The falsehoods of the leaders inducing their
forces to invade the wrong guys are on videotape for history
to view. Nothing but censuring these perpetrators of this
last, best, televised, crime against humanity can be our
duty to posterity. Hugo said it best. You don't deal with
the devil. I will for the rest of my life applaud any
efforts to bring the liars who caused the killings of
innocent millions by innocent soldiers guilty of obeying
orders in the 911 Frame-up wars.

Anyway, watch for this episode 80 "Goodnight Good Knights
TEMPLARS 1307 AD" if you ever want to see the arguments of
the torturers parodied to shame.

If you live in the Amerikan Gulag, this video could help
scare people into seeing the looming danger before the very
last of their right to individualism is gone.

This the second time I cite History Bites. Once posted:

>"Father of Dentistry Pierre Fauchard used Urine!
>JCT: I've attested many times to the greatest cure I ever
enjoyed, a miracle according to orthodox dentistry. I had a
root canal infection and was told there had to be an
operation. No way to cure it. Yet, I swished for only 2 days
with miracle water and cured it avoiding a $1000 operation.

>I was watching one of the greatest Canadian shows called
History Bites produced by Rick Green and one of the skits
had the Father of Dentistry Pierre Fauchard touting his
dental cure made up of urine. Of course, that would seem
funny to most, unlike me who cured an uncurable root canal
in only 2 days miracle water, so I Googled for "Pierre
Fauchard" and got:
http://www.fauchard.org/publications/remembrance.htm
Pierre Fauchard, father of Modern Dentistry
Who is Pierre Fauchard ?
A Remembrance by Monsieur Jean Claude de Vaux

JCT: Anyway, Rick Green has created a series he can be
really proud of. This one presents torture brilliantly.


--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics

JCT: My earlier report detailed the Rogers debate. This is
the only comment on the show so far:

>Brantford Expositor
>Letter to the editor,
>Nov 2 2006
>Brian Woodley, RR1 St.George

BW: Let your heart decide your vote
I caught most of the city's mayoral candidates debate on
cable TV Oct 26. I found it very enlightening, delighting,
and exciting.

JCT: Weren't Mike Hancock, Chris Friel and Winston Ferguson
the same three candidates in 2003? I wonder what made it so
"enlightening, delighting, and exciting" this time?

BW: Sure beats conventional TV. It was quite surreal and an
unreal reality show.

JCT: What made a municipal debate so surreal an unreal
reality show that could be termed "enlightening, delighting,
and exciting?"

BW: But from my perspective, I perceived it as a battle
between poor and rich or a conflict between the downtrodden
and the fortunate.

JCT: Who representing the poor and who the rich?

BW: Maybe when we vote this time, let not your intellect be
your guide, but why not vote with your heart?

JCT: Sadly, intellect is rarely the guide. Many voters are
committed to their friend or party color regardless of what
an opponent may be offering but most are gamblers trying to
pick the winner. . 2% or 3% are trying to vote for the best.
Needless to say, votes to pick the best are usually
overwhelmed by votes to pick the probable winner.

BW: Sometimes things aren't what they appear and your tax
dollars soon disappear. The main thing a community needs is
unity. Wealth and stealth collaborate. So let your heart
concentrate.
Brian Woodley, RR1 St.George

JCT: Still, why can't heart and brain agree? Regardless,
Brian found it "enlightening, delighting, and exciting."

How did the Expositor find it:

Expositor Oct 27 2006
Past and present mayors battle it out
By Michael Allan Marion

JCT: Marion reported on how this election is about the
former mayors' leadership style.

"Turmel spent much of the debate promoting different ways to
finance community endeavours."

JCT: That's it. Nothing on the actual different ways to
finance community endeavours. Marion certainly didn't find
it "enlightening, delighting, and exciting."

Just a little more on Tim-bit Brain's article;

Expositor Oct 30 2006
The contenders ward by ward
Tim Philp

JCT: For Ward 5, looks at the "two main challengers. As for
the other candidates in ward 5, Adam King, Duanne Leeallen
and Russell King, little needs to be said."

JCT: What a pig. Same swill as Judd, same trough as Judd.
Imagine doing a book report and leaving out half, then
telling the teacher: little needs be said about the rest. As
if Philp has some kind of claim to intellectual integrity.
All this shows is that he can't handle more than Tiny Tim-
bits of information and only about people he's known for
years. Forget about Tim-bit brain looking at new people.
"Little needs to be said" when you haven't done your
homework.

Anyway, somethings' going to have to be done about the
garbage coming out Rogers and Expositor troughs. To leave
moderating municipal debates under control of such an
intellectual pygmy is an insult to democracy. Let's see if
we can't get rid of him and his Tim-bit brained crew before
the next elections come around.

Besides, if you go to the Expositor site and search for
Chris Friel and their search engine comes up with nothing!

And their editorial page still advertises:

>Ontario Press Council
>The Expositor is a member of the Ontario Press Council,
which considers complaints against member newspapers.

JCT: What a joke. They don't say they can ignore any
complaints in which case the Council does nothing. But it
sure gives the impression that there is some recourse to bad
journalism. It's false. When I complained, the O.P.C.
refused to consider my complaint against their member
newspaper when Judd refused to respond. I had included a
tape of the meeting to prove Judd and Marion had mis-
reported what I had said. So the OPC does not "consider
complaints against member newspapers" when member newspapers
refuse to defend their injustices because they can't.

Anyway, if the Expositor didn't find that it was an
"enlightening, delighting, and exciting" show, I guess it
wasn't the usual cast of characters who made it so.


--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics

JCT: I've explained in past posts how I supported Brantford
Mayoral candidate Chris Friel's request for 5-minute opening
statements during our mayoral election debate but Rogers
Cable television simply told us to take our free time the
way they gave it to us or leave it. They think that because
they televise City Hall meetings, that we use their
moderator, so they get to call the shots in rule-making.
Note in US presidential elections how the participants agree
to the rules, they are not imposed by the media.

Maybe it's time to have City Hall run the municipal debates
from City Hall and Rogers can cover it, not run it. All we
have to do is get rid of the Rogers moderator. Then, with
Philp gone next time, and Rogers simply covering the
proceedings, not running them, maybe the candidates will
have some input in how we want our positions presented.

Anyway, moderator Tim Philp explained that the evening's
questions would be from the media panel: Rogers TV reporter
Joe Persia, CKPC radio reporter Samantha Lee, but  instead
of the usual Michael Allan Marion from the Expositor, they
had a Laurier journalism student Stephanie Quatrociocchi. I
saw Marion taking notes from the audience. Finally, there
would be some questions from members of the audience
"framed" with the help of Philp's assistant Jacquie. You can
bet Fuhrer Philp wasn't going to be letting in any questions
on marijuana or social currency financing since topics can
only be raised by his media panel or by his pre-screened
questions. The Fuhrer Philp Format with Fuhrer Philp in 100%
control of all topics through a media panel and pre-screened
questions. Fuhrer Philp Format has debate dumbed down to the
level of the tim-bit thinking moderator.

"No signs or banners permitted in the audience and no
buttons, badges or props will be permitted for use by the
candidates." Under the Fuhrer Philp Format, no political
color is allowed. A whole history of use of buttons, badges
or props has been negated under the Fuhrer Philp Dictate.
If, next time, we can get rid of Philp as moderator and rid
of Rogers running the show, then maybe we can allow
candidates to add a little color to the show. If Friel gets
elected, he should also be pretty eager to get rid of the
Big Brother control and have the City host the City Hall
debates, not the scribes.

And instead of a quiet cue for 15 seconds left, Tim-bit
brain decided to use a bell which disconcertingly and
noisily interrupted everyone's train of thought. Another
winner innovation in televised debates. Next time, a gong?

I led my speech with the Our Father which says Thy Kingdom
come when Thy Will be done on Earth as it is in Heaven. We
can have Heaven on Earth if no one's chasing anyone for
debts and we have tomorrow's bread. Nothing better. I told
them I'd be talking about the LETS software, Timebanks, (I
pulled out my LETS diskette badge and showed it even if I
didn't put it on - Fuhrer  Philp had two cops at the door
again, bet Brantford's is the only Rogers debate where cops
are part of the expenses. Certainly not in my last Ottawa
Nepean provincial by-election. No cops at that Rogers
debate. Only cops needed when using the Fuhrer Philp Format.

Philp: I would ask you remember our prohibition against
badges and buttons.

JCT: The Fuhrer's law against badges and buttons. For
showing a decal of a diskette with the word LETS. I didn't
need the hassle and am surprised I didn't say "Call a cop"
and put it on. Then again, I'm still on probation and
getting taken away means not getting out. Not over a badge.

After Winston Ferguson had finished, Philp used his favorite
put-down, "looks like it's going to be a long night."

Q1: Samantha Lee: Should Brantford property be the next
occupation site for the Native protests and should the
Iroquois be notified of development applications.

JCT: Of course, it's about them getting their fair share in
a world where's there's not enough (money) to go around. So
I explained:

Turmel: They're in favor of continued talking and so am I.
But, the Six Nations were part of the Iroquois Confederacy
many years ago and they used to use "wampum" which was a
form of "social currency." Every indian had the right to
issue his own bead worth a beaver pelt or an eagle feather
and that became the currency within the region. Then the
white man came over and talked them into giving up their
wampum and getting in the unemployment line with the white
man but there's no reason a social currency system set up
for Brantford wouldn't be able to deliver the same sort of
financial services back to the indians that they used to
have. Once again, from out of history, we find that people
who ran their own currency systems didn't have to get in
hock to the loansharks and didn't have to suffer poverty.
They were smart enough to use interest-free wampum in the
past, I'll talk them into using interest-free wampum again.

Q2: Joe Persia: Phrase to summarize your leadership style.

Turmel: When they OPP busted my casino, the biggest bust in
gaming house Canadian history, they called it Project Robin
Hood. Spartacus, Anti-poverty engineer, poker systems
engineer, I've been called so many things, I don't know what
I'm proudest of. But, Anti-poverty engineer for having
engineered the social currency software that's spreading
around the world is my claim to fame. So, "money systems
engineer." I'm going to fix the money system and stop you
from being poor.

JCT: I guess I should have said I have no style, I have only
new software.

Q3: Stephanie Quatrociocchi: People have said Friel's
apology to veterans was 3 years too late and somewhat
convenient now that he's running again. Any comment?

JCT: Friel restated he had apologized right away and again
repeated he wasn't trying to insult the veterans. Hancock
passed on the question.

Turmel: I like the article in the newspaper by Ms. Brush who
said that her father's generation had the kind of class
where, when someone apologized in public, you didn't
question their motives, you just accepted it. I think that
poll in the newspaper was absolutely no-class disgusting. To
discuss whether or not we should refuse a public apology.
How dare anyone say that? So I think that's the most
shameful blot on an election I've seen, the sleaziest slur
I've ever seen by a newspaper; doing a poll on whether we
should refuse a public apology, that puked me right out.
David Judd, you're a pig.

JCT: Though the Fuhrer had it set up so almost nothing could
be picked up without his leave, some laughter did make it
through. No one booed.

Winston "Bucky" Ferguson told Friel not to apologize, "it's
a sign of weakness." I shouted I was tired of him
apologizing too, enough is enough. No more apologizing. You
can hear the guffaws from the audience even if you couldn't
hear what I said on TV. Viewers must have wondered what the
funny stuff Philp wouldn't let them hear was about. Philp
said he had wondered how long it would take for him to lose
control of the debate, it wasn't long. Right, something
escaped his control which made people laugh. Of course, his
Rogers viewers didn't get it. Back to the media panel:

Q4: Lee: Present council didn't do much. Are you
disappointed with lack of progress.

JCT: Friel agreed, Hancock disagreed.

Turmel: I agree with their grand visions of what they want
and they're all limited by insufficient funds. That's the
difference. I can make the money go farther. Many years ago,
your grandparents could help rebuild a barn, help build a
road, they could build a bridge, and they got paid with tax
credits for their work. So you didn't have to pay your taxes
only with cash, you could pay with work, with labor. You
could have kids shoveling the snow if you don't have adults
to do it. You could have all sorts of municipal work-bee
projects paid with tax credit notes, Brantford Bucks, that
we could then use to pay our taxes. So using social
currency, even for small amounts, 10% of everyone's salary,
would make the federal cash go farther. And that's why
social currencies are spreading around the world, it's in 58
countries, just Google for social currencies and see it to
believe it.

Q5: Persia: How's downtown then and now.

JCT: After his 1-minute attempt to explain, Chris Friel took
his shot at the Rogers organizers. "I don't have enough time
to take about this issue. A minute is just ridiculous."

Turmel: When I first came to town, there were 65 out of 85
stores on downtown Colborne St. that were closed and boarded
up. Not many have opened since then. But in Ithaca New York,
the Ithaca Timebank issues loans to businesses to help them
get going and those community currency loans did help the
businesses get going. So I agree we need all these wonderful
things we could have and I want to deal with coming up with
the money to pay for them. I could tell you I want
everything they want too. But I've got the money, a special
kind of money, that we use in Brantford, but at least it's
better than no money at all.

Q6: Quatrociocchi: Restaurant owner complaining about lack
of parking. Mayor said no parking was understood. I passed.

Q7: Lee: O.P.P. review on grants. Everyone said yes. Mayor
said it worked fine.

Q8: Persia: Taxation too high. Assure no increases?

JCT: Friel bemoaned big city taxes and small-town services.
Need better transparency. Hancock agreed citizens should
know how it's spent.

Turmel: It's not limited resources, it's limited money.
We've got lots of men, materials and tools, just no pay-
checks. As for making sure where the money's going,
I'll pay my tax for army and police to handle strife,
I'll pay my tax for doctors, nurses who protect my life.
I'll pay my tax for all engaged repairing road and sewer,
I'll pay my tax for social servants helping out the poor,
I'll even pay my tax for bureaucrats with no regret.
I only object to paying tax for interest on debt. If you
have a source of interest-free credit, you can back-tax
instead of front-tax. Now they tax you up front and you
worry about whether they spend it right. Imagine if they
borrow,  spend, and then tell you what they spent it on
before they tax at the back. You can only tax at the back
when you have your own social currency bank. If you don't,
you have to tax up front, budget and pray you do it right.
So back-tax is the answer. Front tax is the problem. Social
currency bank is needed.

Q9: Quatrociocchi: Create safe environment? More police?

JCT: Friel added a platoon, almost 40 police between 1999
and 2003 and we need half a platoon more. Hancock in favor
of safety too.

Turmel: Once again, timebank to the rescue. Mike or Chris,
as mayor, signs a bunch of tax credit notes and asks the
police: will you take 10% of your pay in Brantford Bucks. If
you can free up some federal cash, replacing it with
Brantford Bucks, you can now hire more police. That's a
standard way of filling the gap, using Brantford Bucks to
freed up cash. Number two, less crime. If they weren't out
there playing "cops and gardeners" chasing marijuana
growers, slinking around school yards looking for marijuana
smokers, we wouldn't need so many cops. We've got stupid
laws. I would certainly de-fund the narc squad. If they want
to chase marijuana, go out in the bush but stay away from
people in town. Marijuana is a safe herb, a medicinal herb,
and if you want to get your parents and adults off the
bottle and off the chemicals, get them on the herbals. And
if the kids are sick, hit them with a marijuana muffin, no
Ritalin and Prozac.

JCT: There was a big rush of audience bemusement which could
barely be heard by viewers.

Winston Ferguson: I don't remember the questions after
following John's answer. More bemusement made it past Fuhrer
Philp's cut button.

Q10: Lee: Family violence and child abuse.

JCT: Everyone was horrified. Mayor Hancock set up a task
force on domestic violence, an action committee, to achieve
an awareness campaign.

Turmel: Do we really need a committee to raise our
awareness? Is there anyone here unaware of the violence and
abuse going on? We see it in our newspapers full every day?
So why do women and children stick around? Do they enjoy
being punching bags? Why don't they leave?... They've got no
money. They've got no credit at the bank. They're not worthy
of credit, they've have no collateral. Sure, in the Timebank
system, your willingness to work, that's your collateral,
but in today's banking system, willingness to work is worth
nothing. You need a car, a house. And women and children,
with no credit, they've got to take their beatings or go
live in a shelter. I want to give them all interest-free
credits cards. Go stay in a hotel.

JCT: Bucky agreed with more money. Friel said it was an
issue that had to be addressed now. Versus those who want it
addressed later?

Q11: Persia: City's strategic plan, what role publicly
funded recreational centers.

Turmel: Recreational centres happens to be one of the major
uses of social currencies around the world is for paying
volunteers to staff community centres. If you don't have any
money, you let them put in their hours, they register the
hours that the community owes them and then, they can call
on people to come and work for them in exchange. That's how
a timebank works. Instead of the kids cleaning up the river
on a Sunday once a year to get a free hot dog from the
mayor, why doesn't he just register: "Plus 4 hours of work"
on the internet and that becomes currency they can spend all
around the world. All the mayor has to do is sign "thank you
for 4 hours of labor, kid" and he can use that 4-Hour bill
in Europe to stay overnight somewhere. So, have a work-bee,
clean up the river every weekend and pay the kids with these
new kind of currency issues.

Q12: Persia: Any cuts to recreation programs? Everyone
wanted more.

Turmel: Is there a way of finding money for recreational
centres? And that's the limitation they all come up with.
And again, hundreds of years ago, most people would take a
tax credit note from their government to do stuff. Is there
anybody in this room who wouldn't take a $10 tax credit note
from Mike  or Chris if they're mayor?... Anybody think a $10
tax credit note payable for Brantford taxes is worth
nothing?... That they'd say no?.... (No response) All right
boys, are you getting the message? Everybody here realizes
that if you guys sign a tax credit note, we'll work for it.
So instead of having to go find scarce financing at a bank,
let's let these guys sign their own tax credit notes, and we
will work for those notes, as long as we can pay our taxes
with it and everybody in town can pay their taxes with it
too. It worked in the past, it can work again.

Q13: Quatrociocchi: Mr. Hancock, Council has been called
dysfunctional and you've been criticized for your lack of
ability to maintain control. Please comment?

JCT: Is she ever full of nasty questions. Hancock said he
disagreed, Friel said he agreed. I repeated I could do more
because I don't have the financial limitations of the other
guys.

Q14: Lee: Is it worth continuing King & Benton negotiations
for 500 million development, 5000 jobs?

JCT: Everyone said to stop negotiations. Just kidding.
Everyone said they were for continued negotiations to get a
good deal. I parroted Mayor Mike's answer: "Yes, it's got to
be a good deal."

Q15: Persia: Negotiations with county over new land.

JCT: Mayor said the deal was almost done.

Turmel: Wonderful, a deal with Brant over land, some cash.
They're going to do a deal. And the only difference is,
maybe we can talk them into taking a little bit of Brantford
Bucks if we're short. So if they can't do the deal because
they're a little bit short, I might have a way to come up
with a little bit more currency to do the deal. That's the
advantage of having a social currency to fill the gap.
Things that would cause my opponents to fail would not
necessarily make me fail. That's the advantage when you have
a solution to a problem that the other guys don't have. And
since it works all around the world and I haven't had much
time to explain it to you in these tiny "tim-bits" of
information, you have to check it out yourselves. Google for
social currency and timebanks and see what we could be doing
for ourselves.

Q16: Brett (selected audience youngster with question framed
by Jacquie): Mr. Friel, what would you do to prevent
domestic violence and what do you mean by pro-active?

JCT: That's on the agenda, for sure, because it was asked
once before. Oh well, why not do the same question twice.
Friel explained that help was now reactive, after the
beatings, and we need to go ahead of that and not be
reacting all the time. Violent people must be dealt with
before they're allowed to harm somebody. Hancock explained
the committee is pro-active, with 8 programs, the biggest
one being raising awareness.

Turmel: Nothing can help short of giving them a way of
escape. I've explained the last time the same question was
asked: Why would they stick around and take their beatings
and abuse? And I pointed out the only reason they stuck
around to take their abuse is that they don't have any way
of escaping. If they had credit at a bank, or a sugar daddy,
or a rich uncle, so that the family could go rent an
apartment, new furniture, get set up to go back to school,
then you wouldn't need all these committees to discuss what
must be done for this horrible problem. So give them a
method of escape, give them the money to escape and the
abusers had better wise up or the families are going to be
gone.

Q17: Peggy (audience question read by Philp): What is your
plan to address the displaced youth and lower-income
residents of the downtown core?

JCT: I should have said "Greetings to the displaced youth
and lower-income residents of the downtown core, is how I
would I would address them. Framed properly, it must have
meant addressing the needs of poor people in the downtown,
as opposed to poor people in the outskirts.

Turmel: Okay, you take all the unemployed youth in town and
sign them up to the Brantford Timebank and you give them all
a bunch of empty checks and say: go out and find any retired
old person, anybody at all, and ask them if you can do
something useful for them: run an errand, walk their dog,
clean the street, commit to pick up the gum, the garbage,
and the dog shit on Main Street. Do anything good and get
some oldster to sign: "Thank you for 1 Hour of labor" and
that becomes the money. So you could have a whole army of
youth out there looking for oldsters, retired people, to
sign these "Thank You" notes and these "Thank You" notes
become the money. As opposed to just sitting there and
saying "something must be done," like these other guys with
no money, I'm pointing out how a Brantford Timebank would
allow every youth to sign up, register the labor he does,
and that becomes money all around the world.

Philp: Mr. Turmel, I would remind you that this is being
broadcast into people's living rooms and I think we need to
be careful with the language that we use.

Q18: Quatrociocchi: King & Benton are going to need a $20
million subsidy to set up and isn't it a precedent?

JCT: Everyone said negotiations should continue on ways to
dispense with development charges, etc.

Turmel: Very often, we do do deals with corporations to
offer them tax benefits to come to our community, right?
Well, how about we give them the $20 million in tax-credit
notes in $10 bills that they can pay directly to their
employees who will spend them back in our community rather
than have the money leave town? At 5000 employees, $20
million is 4000 a head. Surely they can take half of it at
least in tax credit notes instead of cash. Why empty our
bank account? It they're going to spend it in our community,
why can't we fund their development with our own community
currency, like they did in Ithaca New York. There's no
reason we couldn't give them tax credit relief, except,
let's give it to them in small pieces of paper that they can
pay their employees with and they'll spend it back in our
community, in our businesses.

Q19: Lee: Mayor Hancock led way to lobby for Hwy 424. How
important is it?

JCT: Hancock said "very." Friel said "very very."

Turmel: Similarly, just like tax credits could be used to
fund recreation centres, to fund police, to fund firemen, to
fund hospitals, we can also fund road construction using a
certain percentage in community currency instead of cash
thus freeing up that federal cash for other reasons. So, if
it's undoable with the financial limitations faced by my
competitors here, I don't have those same limitations
because I'll set up a Timebank which will allow us to do it
for cheaper cash, get more for our money basically, by using
our own Brantford Bucks. So yes, same situation applies to
the underfunding of the roads that applies to the
underfunding of everything else we've mentioned tonight and
a Brantford timebank will solve that underfunding problem in
exactly the same way it solved all the other underfunding
problems we've mentioned tonight.

Q20: John Baldwin (selected audience question framed by
Jacquie): To Hancock and Friel, raw sewage is going into a
stream and no one's checking it out.

JCT: Everyone said that it should be fixed by government.

Turmel: Yes, we know how effective they were at Walkerton.
It's the same lack of cash all the time which doesn't allow
them to pay for maximum people to do the job, right? Lack of
cash again? Underfunding again? Inability to do it right
because there weren't enough people were hired to do it
right. Now, if they can't even come out and check it, again,
it's got to be a shortage of manpower. They certainly aren't
over-staffed and not coming to check you out. So, once
again, the solution to the underfunding problem is to come
up with more funding which I know how to do.

Winston Ferguson: I agree with John.

Q21: Chuck (selected audience question): When you each had
an opportunity to debate each other at the Kiwanis debate,
would you share with us some of the high-lights of your
opening statements?

Hancock: Thank you except that while I was at a Kiwanis
debate today, I was by myself, for whatever reason...
Turmel: We weren't invited.
Hancock: I was able to speak to them about... and then a
very stimulating question period.

Turmel: When the election was announced, this was the press
(showing large front page story) and it said "John Turmel is
running too." And then after the big debate at the Rotary
Club, there was the big article (showing large article) and
it said "John Turmel put forth his ideas.' Another article
is coverage of the candidates (showing Marion column) but
not a word about John Turmel's ideas. So if you want to know
what's going you, you can't find it here and you can't find
it in the Expositor. They won't even invite us to a debate!
Imagine that. Only the mayor got invited to the Kiwanis
debate. I didn't get invited. So if you want to know what's
going on with my campaign, you have to go to Yahoogroups,
Brantford. There you'll find Brantford information from all
the people without David Judd censoring what you're going to
read. So don't expect to get the whole truth out of the
Expositor, please, but it is available online, you've just
got to dig it up, don't expect service from your daily
newspaper.

Friel: As for the Kiwanis situation, I believe it's that
this week, it's a presentation by the mayor and next week is
my presentation and we have an have an opportunity to
discuss after that.
Turmel: And I don't get one.
Friel: Sorry John but I don't know if you were invited or
not.
Turmel: It's your Kiwanis Club.
Friel: I'm not a Kiwanian....

JCT: Good for him. I'd be ashamed to be.

Philp: I need to address all of the candidates. While
another candidate is speaking, please remain a respectful
silence so that everybody can have an opportunity to express
their opinions.

JCT: My interchange wasn't disrespectful to Mr. Friel, it
was disrespectful to Fuhrer Philp's Formal Format. No
interchange between candidates allowed in a Rogers debate.
As if I care that he doesn't recognize the whom to which my
disrespect is addressed.

Q22: Persia: Funding for an adult day program for elderly.
How will we guarantee funding?

Turmel: If you Google for Timedollars, you'll find out that
the Timedollar system in the States originally really
expanded when volunteer organizations at retirement homes
started registering their hours and then old people would
start reading to each other, earning hours doing stuff,
helping with the care of other patients which reduced the
cost of their care. So Timedollars allowed some retired
people to earn hours of care from the group by working,
instead of needing cash. So, again, it allows a situation
where the elderly can actually help each other do something
useful for each other and get credit for doing it without
having to be paid in cash which the government has in short
supply. So if you read the wonderful stories about
timebanking in the States, it's mainly about oldsters who
join a timebank, help each other out and make their..

JCT: "lives better." Fuhrer Philp often cut off last 1
second of a sentence. So he's so concerned with cutting me
off that he has no time to follow what is being said if he
doesn't see the end of the sentence two words away. A
moderator with zero tolerance for an extra second ruins the
show.

Ferguson: I agree with everything you say John, except the
Timebank.

Q23: Craig: (audience member) Mayor Hancock, why not full
disclosure on OPP investigation?

Hancock: It's a police review, they'll tell us when. I
passed.

Q24: Quatrociocchi: It's said mayor has laid-back style,
full time, and Friel appears aggressive, not 9-5 style. What
effect would this have on the new council? (always having
trouble reading 'her' questions)

JCT: Friel said he's calmed down and Hancock said he had
passion and wasn't so laid-back.

Turmel: Well, he may not be laid back but I am. And he may
be aggressive but I'm not. (some laughing) You can expect a
nice calm reasonable explanation of how funding with
timebanks seems to solve all our underfunding problems and I
just don't think I'm going to have all many problems to
spend very much time to be worrying about so I too won't
have to do a full-time job, I hope.

Q25: Ashley: (selected lady) How to improve transit service?

Turmel: The Calgary transit system accepts Calgary
Greendollars for people who want to use their social
currency to ride the buses in Calgary. And in Argentina and
other countries, they use social currencies in their
communities too. It's one of the uses of community currency.
Pay your taxes and ride your buses with the same Brantford
Bucks. But what I've always wanted and someday I will see is
100% subsidized public transit so that it's free to the
riders. We have to maximize ridership and we have to
minimize the use of automobiles and the best way to affect
our environment by cutting back on cars is free public
transit. It can be done if we finance it with social
currency, community currency, it can't be done in any other
way. But, getting people out of their cars onto a better bus
system is the only solution to saving ourselves and you
can't do it unless you use some community currency,
Brantford Bucks, to fill the gap.

Q26: Lee: Cat licensing by-law to regulate cats.

JCT: I had no real answer so when the mayor ended his answer
that it should be looked at carefully...

Turmel: I agree. It should be looked at carefully.

Q27: Persia: senior programs outside usual health care.

JCT: Hancock explained Ontario's the only place where health
costs have been down-loaded to municipalities.

Turmel: I do my share, I play my accordion, do concerts, at
Amber Lea, John Noble, Riverview, Hardy Terrace, St. Joe's,
Six Nations, yeah, I'm the guy playing the accordion, vote
for me, (waving into camera). And I wish I could get credit
for my time. I'd love to be able to continue volunteering
and getting credit for my time. Then I could spend it. So I
want to start a timebank so I don't have to volunteer any
more. So the hours I give to the community, someday when I'm
old, someone's going to come and serve me back. So I don't
mind earning hours, I just want them credited somewhere, and
I'm sure someday, I'll be able to spend them back in the
same way. So anyway, you oldsters out there, I'll get you an
interest-free credit card and all your health woes will be
gone.

Final statements

Turmel: Obviously, you're not going to hear about me in your
local press and if you want to know more about what you can
do with a timebank and how it could solve your problems,
you're going to have to go online, probably to the Brantford
Yahoogroups and see there what's being offered. I've
explained this twice now for several hours to my opponents
and I'm hoping that they're catching on, how every time they
couldn't offer a solution, they could just say "I'm
concerned, I'd like to do something," I got up and said:
"see how they would have done it in the past with tax
credits and work bees and ways they used to do it then. Why
can't we do it now." Well, if I don't get elected, at least
these guys who will will have heard of a possible solution
to our underfunding problems. Then I'll be able to bug them
and say: "why don't we do it too." And if they don't, then
I'll be able to say, just like Tim who has heard me in three
straight election debates, Tim never caught on.

JCT: That got a few laughs. Expositor report and some
reaction next. Anyway, I've got to make an issue of getting
rid of Philp and Rogers running the debates.


--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics

JCT: It had to be a pretty special lead-up for me to use
such crude conclusion to a statement on the mayoralty debate
televised by Rogers cable 20 television that will be shown
on 3 Sunday Oct 29 at 8pm, Nov 5 at 9pm, Nov 12 at 8pm.

Fuhrer Tim-bit Philp's Format had set the debate up so
candidates only got an opening 1-minute hello and closing 1-
minute goodnight with 22 questions from a pre-selected panel
and 5 questions from the audience selected by Philp
and friend.

Fuhrer Philp had written that money reform or marijuana
weren't going to be allowed on the agenda and none of the
questions selected for the scripted show dealt with them.

No questions on marijuana so I had to raise spending city
funds to play "cops and gardeners" hiding in bushes to catch
teens smoking pot under a health care question, and no
questions on using social currency to end funding shortages
though there were over a dozen questions on how the funding
shortages should be shared around fairest.

Though I'll print a transcript next week, one one of the
stacked questions was on why people should accept Chris
Friel's apology with so many people saying they did not.

Hancock passed on the question, I quoted the Brush letter in
the Expositor which pointed out how her dad's generation had
the class to accept public apologies without questioning the
motives. Judd's Expositor poll asking how many people wanted
to publicly refuse to accept Friel's apology made me "want
to puke."

I'm thinking "what kind of animal stirs up such shit?"
What wallows in such shit?" And remembering the answer
everyone else should also conclude, I ended: "David Judd's a
pig!"

And I didn't hear anyone disagree.

Sunday Oct 29 8p
Sunday Nov 05 9p
Sunday Nov 12 8p


--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics

>Marijuana crusader wins appeal
http://tinyurl.com/y3znxj

>Canada: Supreme Court Overturns Conviction of Medical
Marijuana Activist
http://tinyurl.com/wub4j

>Verdict up in smoke
http://tinyurl.com/y4x9f3

JCT: Fooled you. Yes, Marc "the narc" Emery's Alan-Young-
inspired Krieger case to the top did win. But, what did
Krieger win for Canadians:

>Alberta Marijuana Grower Is Entitled to a New Trial, Court
http://tinyurl.com/yyjyhp

>Pot activist to get new trial; Judge 'usurped' jurors'
function by ordering conviction, top court rules
http://tinyurl.com/y7an8f

JCT: For Canadians, Krieger won nothing.

But for Alan Young, winning nothing is better than his usual
results considering how his and Paul Burstein's HITZIG case
brought the law back to life on the very same day, Oct 7
2003, that the court uphelp Parker's motion to declare that
the marijuana prohibition had been invalid since Terry
Parker Day, Aug. 1, 2001. Oops.

Canadians learned Parker had won the invalidation of the law
two years earlier on the same day they learned York
University Osgoode Hall Law School professor Alan Young had
had the law resurrected on the very same day! "Marijuana's
been legal for the past 2 years but Young ended it on the
day Canadians found out." Court Clutz Causes Cannabis
Prohibition Resurrection.

So winning nothing is a refreshing change in results for
Maxwell "Not-so-smart" Young.

Notice how much press Krieger's loser move gets while Derek
Francisco's beating his charge on merit got none.



--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics

>GAMBLERS CONFIDENCE is the most important for con money
>Posted by: "Stan Szopa" sszopa@... sszopa
>Date: Thu Oct 26, 2006 7:20 pm (PDT)

On Thu Oct 26, 2006 10:22 am John Turmel wrote:

>JCT: There is nothing as lied about and confusing as
"inflation" and yet there are only two possibilities: More
money chasing goods or less goods for same money."

Stan: It is true when money is used for goods and services
exchange only. It is not that simple when a huge amount of
money is tight up in speculation on the foreign exchange
market.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exchange_rate

JCT: Stan, you challenge the Laplace Transform of the
banking system? You think that splashing money in the pool
to treat the symptoms is going to affect the increased
amount of debt owed to the pump-house?

Stan: "...The foreign exchange market is one of the largest
markets in the world. By some estimates, about 2 trillion
USD worth of currency changes hands every day..."
http://www.womenswork.org/articles/reinventing.html

JCT: It's splashing in the pool.

Stan:"...Like a casino, dollars are chasing more dollars
with 95% of the foreign exchange transactions consisting of
sheer speculation. Less than 5% has to do with exchanging
real goods or production and that amount is dominated by the
largest 500 multinational corporations...

JCT: It's splashing in the pool.

"...The Queen of England might notice the two million
dollars a day that she receives in interest and the
child who is sold into sexual slavery to pay off her
parents debts might realize the dire straits of her
family's circumstances..."

JCT: It's splashing in the pool.

Stan: Non-productive financial speculation and interest
payments suck up huge amount of money.

JCT: "Non-productive financial speculation" is a symptom in the
pool and "interest payments" to the pumphouse is the cause
even if both do "suck up huge amount of money. But the
banking system blueprint 1/(s-i) says only pumphouse cause
"i" needs to be addressed, while the symptom of speculation
in the pool is irrelevant.

Stan: Jack Weatherford in the book "The History of Money" in
chapter Domination of Digital Money is explaining how
GAMBLERS CONFIDENCE of financial markets in currency is
extremely essential for a particular country value of
currency. Best regards,   Stan

JCT: And you haven't yet grasped the difference between
losing gamblers and professional winning gamblers.
Your constant labelling all "gamblers" as being off-target
smears the professional with the loser. Mr. Weatherford also
seems not to  distinguish between his generation's "all
gamblers are lottery losers" and this generation's "some
gamblers are poker winners." You and Weatherford are from
their generation of losers and keep failing to realize we
are a generation of winners on the horizon. "Gambler" isn't
the insult you presume it to be. So make the distinction
because I'm offended every time you slam all gamblers
because I know you're aiming it at me.

Finally, you dare presume to challenge the 27-year Professor
of Banking Systems Engineering as you continue to fill this
group with your erroneous pontifications. You should finish
your studies before you speak up in community currency
engineering class because if you kept quiet, no one would
know how error-prone your thinking is, but your constant
erroneous statements force me to keep correcting you in
public and remove all doubt.

No go back to http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel/bankmath.htm
and re-study the lecture on banking systems engineering
again because the next time I have to prove you wrong, I'll
not only prove you wrong on your current mistake but I'll go
back a year until I find the discussion when Leonardo proved
you wrong, (I'm sorry I never publicly declared you winner
at the time, Leonardo) and then cull every one of your
blueprint mistakes since then.

Like I told you, your many errors have forced me to skip
your long posts which probably introduce more errors. After
all, if you failed the primer in Social Currency
Engineering, why spend time reading your stuff other than to
correct it for those who don't see the errors.

But think of how much time I've spent in past years
correcting your errors. Not once have you ever been able to
say my critique of your improper analysis of the blueprint
was wrong. So how much time have I had to spend correcting
your errors? Wouldn't it have been better for the sociable
credit revolution if you'd kept your thoughts to yourself?
Haven't you cost us a lot of time in diversion from
engineering our salvation to explaination of why you are
off-track?

JCT: I don't mind the stuff you publish that is right, I
only mind what is wrong. The fact you'll argue with the
Prof, Professor or Professional, indicates your purpose is
disinformation rather than enlightenment. What else can be
said about someone who can't follow the community currency
blueprint but insists in disrupting the considerations of
those of us at IJCCR, this "International Journal of
Community Currency Research" who do. If you can't even pass
the primer on the banking system blueprint, what are you
doing here talking? Do you like being proven wrong? Or is
costing us time the name of the game?



--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics

JCT: Tonight's debate at City Hall is being televised by
Rogers Cable television so they think they control the rules
of the contest.

I wrote in support of Chris Friel's request for 5-minute
opening statement and resented Rogers' Jeremy Clark's flimsy
rationale for refusing with no consultation with the other
players in the game.

He said we'd get our messages out in Questions and Answers,
an obvious empty promise, that 1 minute had been a success,
as compared to what that had not?

>Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2006 17:57:43 -0400
>From: Jeremy.Clark@... (Jeremy Clark)
>Subject: RE: Rogers Cable debate
>To: turmel@...
>Cc: christopherfriel@..., mhancock@...,
slittell@..., Rick.Rathwell@... (Richard
Rathwell), brantford@yahoogroups.com

Mr. Turmel,
JC: As I indicated to Ms. Littell on October 16th, and will
repeat again here, we are going to follow the format
described in the rules which have already been circulated.

JCT: And I thought Fuhrer Philp was bad. Fuhrer Clark will
be obeyed. It's his debate. He controls all.

JC: If you do not wish to participate in the televised
debate under those rules and format you are under no
obligation to accept our invitation.   Jer.

JCT: It's Jeremy Clark's show so it's Jeremy Clark's debate
rules. TV controls the debate because TV controls the show.

>Wed, 25 Oct 2006 11:44:02 -0400
>From: "Sally" <slittell@...>
>To: <Jeremy.Clark@...>
>Cc: <mhancock@...>, <johnturmel@...>,
>"'Chris Friel'" <christopherfriel@...>
>Subject: Mayoral Debate

SL: Good Morning Jeremy:
I wanted to touch base one last time before the debate on
Thursday for two reasons.
First I would like to thank you for taking the time to get
back to me on the questions I had regarding the format for
the upcoming Mayoral debate. I appreciate that these past
few weeks have been very busy and I thank you for addressing
my issues, although I respectfully disagree.

JCT: I thought he acted uppity.

SL: I appreciate that Rogers has set the format for the
debates in a manner that it considers to be successful but
having viewed this format in action on two occasions now,
and having spoken to candidates, both incumbents and
challengers, it has become clear to me that although the
format may work for Rogers and perhaps the moderator, it
does not, in my opinion work for the viewing public or the
candidates.

JCT: As if it matters to the Fuhrers of broadcasting. If
they cover it, even at City Hall, they run it. Maybe?

SL: Important issues are being raised both by the press and
the guests in the gallery during the two hour question and
answer period and candidates are restricted to frame their
response, address the issue and provide an alternative in
just 60 seconds.  The moderator is repeatedly cutting off
the candidates' responses which says to me, the viewing
public, that one minute is not enough time to properly
answer a question.  Given the scope of issues facing Mayoral
candidates, and the impact of the issues on the public, I
wanted to once again express my displeasure with the format.

Second, I also wanted to thank you for assuring me that no
bias will be expressed by the moderator during the course of
the debate.

JCT: Fuhrer Philp's already shown his bias in his newspaper
article.

SL: Of course, one could argue that in the editorial
commentary liberally expressed by the moderator throughout
the ward debates, opinion is introduced in a less-than
subtle way; I will trust in your assessment that the Mayoral
debate will be hosted in an unbiased, fair manner. Having
said that, in watching the two ward debates I am uncertain
how the order of response to questions is determined; could
you forward the rules for how the moderator chooses who
answers questions in what order? I understand that speaking
order is determined by lottery before the broadcast but once
the questioning starts the moderator alternates speaking
order. How is that determined?

I was interested to see that audience members are given the
opportunity to speak directly to the candidates. Given that
Rogers has altered the distributed rules by allowing
audience members to ask their own questions (see rule #8), I
respectfully ask that you advise the candidates of any other
changes to the format that you will be making.

JCT: But no change in time for an opening statement?

SL: Again, thank you for the opportunity for Chris to
present his platform to the citizens of Brantford through
your debates.

JCT: Why do the reporters covering our race get to dictate
the agenda of our race?

SL: I look forward to your response and to attending on
Thursday. Regards, Sally Littell Campaign Manager
Friel for Mayor

JCT: Sadly, only Hancock's support for the candidates can
swing it in our favor. If he's a "do what they say" kind of
leader, it puts us in the same situation as in a 1985
Ontario provincial byelection when Liberal Lowell Green and
Tory Graham Bird walked off a CTV debate to protest the
exclusion of the 3 minor candidates and the NDPer who
stayed, Evelyn Gigantes, got all the time and won the
election. The NDP leader supported her decision. Without
Hancock's input, we won't get the format we want.
---

>Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2006 13:48:00 +1300
>From: blair@... (Blair Anderson)
>Re: TURMEL: Rogers debate dumbed down to Philp level?

BA: Hi John the hardhat kid!,

re: the insulting to every one who votes and probably more
so to those who dont - *

"....issues that have nothing to to with our municipal
election. He does, however, have a right to run for any
office he chooses.... "

* This guy is an R-Sole! But I was disspointed with your
retort. It was below your usual standard.

JCT: What would have been better in response to Tiny-Tim-Bit
Brain's failure to see the congruence?

BA: Drug policy and in particular cannabis policy is a civil
matter at a community level. Just ask a politician, he'll
say go get the consent of the community. [reform sentiment
doesnt require 51% majority any more than it would be fair
to say if 51% of people arent gay, then homosexuality should
be illegal.]

JCT: Right, if he's not bothering me, I don't care if only
10% want to do it, whatever it be.

BA: I know that here in Christchurch NZ where I have run for
Mayor, the city by-law 'enforcement' and budgets determine
and transcend many health and safety issues *and* national
laws. Not the least concerning alcohol and tobacco (and fast
foods). Place, who gets a licence, who gets fined and who's
not allowed to talk intersectorially (publicans are
forbidden to have a view on drug policy, or loose managers
licence.) Urban design has become intrinsically 'safe' as
does perceptions of a city's quality of life, tourism
perceptions and of course, citizens sense of 'wellness'.
(wellness is not measure by the absence of disease) Public
health budgets, health promotion etc... all drug related.
Youth alienation from social mores and rule of law... tell
me that isn't a community issue.
Those who have an aversion to discussing this are dangerous.
Don't cow-tow to the prohibitory. It's our conversation to
have, not theirs to approve. Drug Policy reform is the stuff
of social capital.
Blair Anderson
Corporate Technology Consultants
ph (643) 389 4065   cell 027 265 7219

JCT: I guess I can put Mike Hancock and Cris Friel on the
spot about ending "cops and gardeners" with Brantford tax
dollars after I put them on the spot about a Brantford
Timebank.

Tonight's broadcast on Cable 20 in Brantford region will be
re-played on Sunday Oct 29, 8-10pm;  Sunday Nov 5, 9-11pm;
and Sunday Nov 12, 8-10pm. No week nights and pretty well up
against the Sunday line-ups to be successful at minimizing
ratings. And three live meetings.

I'm going to ask them which will support the City operating
a Brantford Timebank. If Stockport can use the LETS anti-
poverty system in the UK, why can't Brantford?

Both may say yes, or both may say no, but if one says yes
and the other says now, what possibilities for political
theatre! King-maker time. In Ottawa's mayoralty, I got over
4000 votes and Bob Chiarelli beat Peter Clark by only 2000
votes. Hancock beat Friel by 15 votes in 2003, can't be much
closer than that.

I could swing not only Timebank supporters but marijuana
supporters who would never vote for me (who can't win) but
would for someone who can win, gamblers who would never vote
for me (who can't win) but would for someone who can win.

And I have a huge "Vote Turmel" sign hanging outside my
window right across from the Brantford Bridge with 20,000
cars going by every day! If I switch to
"Turmel voting for XXXXXX,"
everyone in the city will know in no time.

I've never endorsed another candidate before. My only
dilemma is if they both say they'll get the City Hall
computer programmer to install an interest-free time-based
community currency system. Then I shouldn't care!

And if both say no, it's normal brow-beating of slow
learners.


--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics

JCT: There is nothing as lied about and confusing as
"inflation" and yet there are only two possibilities: More
money chasing goods or less goods for same money.

>Subject: Inflation
>From: Hunter - coaster132...
>Date: Sat, Oct 21 2006 6:15 pm
>Groups: sci.econ

Isn't the "decline in the value of the dollar" simply
another term for inflation? But the former is said to have
been great and the latter to be under  control. In other
words the inflation raises geezers get annually on their
Social Security is linked to the lesser of two different
measures? But then they probably are essentially the same
and we're simply being  deceived.  HW
-------------------------------

From: John Turmel
Date: Sun, Oct 22 2006 9:40 am
Groups: sci.econ, can.politics, alt.fan.john-turmel
  "Hunter" (coaster132... writes:
> Isn't the "decline in the value of the dollar" simply
> another term for inflation?

Jct: Shift A inflation, more money chasing the collateral,
or is it Shift B, same money chasing less goods?
See: http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel/bankmath.htm
-------------------------------

Subject changed: The Piss Boy
From: w_b_ryan@...
Date: Sun, Oct 22 2006 3:19 pm
Groups: sci.econ, can.politics, alt.fan.john-turmel

-------------------------------

Subject changed: Inflation
From: The Right One <senatorte...
Date: Mon, Oct 23 2006 8:10 am
Groups: sci.econ, can.politics, alt.fan.john-turmel


JCT: Thanks for changing the topic back from William B.
Ryan's urinary obsession.

>> Isn't the "decline in the value of the dollar" simply
>> another term for inflation?

S: No it's not

JCT: Sounds a pretty clear observation. Too bad you don't
back up what you think.

> Jct: Shift A inflation, more money chasing the collateral,
> or is it Shift B, same money chasing less goods?
> See: http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel/bankmath.htm

S: Neither one  --  Terry Pearson

JCT: Again, too bad you don't back up what you say. You must
be an expert on what inflation isn't to be sure our
statements of what inflation is are wrong. But we're not
discussing what inflation isn't, we're discussing what
inflation is. My advanced engineering analysis points out
there are only two possible inflationary shifts. So bright
boy, please back up your criticisms. If you can. Of course,
you're so sure what inflation isn't that you didn't even go
find out the two shifts inflation may be. Scared of a little
algebra, bright boy?
It's better to keep you mouth shut and let people think you
don't know than open it and remove all doubt.

S: Dean Of Politics  http://www.rightpoint.org
<http://www.google.com/url?sa=D&q=http://www.rightpoint.org>

JCT: The Dean of Politics challenging The Engineer of
Politics. Har har har har.

"Tommy Douglas' vision for the NDP was to amalgamate the
farmers and the labourers, who are productive members of
society. But instead the party turned out to be a
conglomerate of street bums, and campus radicals."

JCT: William Aberhart's solution was to socialize the credit
system: social credit. Tommy Douglas's led the NDP as the
Judas Goat who got people to fight for socializing every
system but the anti-social credit system. No wonder he's so
lionized by Big Brother for having led Canadians astray.
Much like Mr. Yunus was awarded the Nobel Prize for getting
people to think his Grameen micro-loanshark (20%) bank might
have a solution to world-wide debt slavery other than
UNILETS.
-------------------------------

From:Roy -
Date: Mon, Oct 23 2006 2:58 pm
Groups: sci.econ, can.politics, alt.fan.john-turmel

Inflation for Terry is blowing up his rubber dolly that he
sleeps with. Ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

JCT: I guess you and Terry know each other.
---

>From: The Trucker -
>Date: Mon, Oct 23 2006 3:07 am
>Groups: sci.econ
  "Hunter" <coaster132... wrote
> Isn't the "decline in the value of the dollar" simply
> another term for inflation?
> But the former is said to have been great and the latter
> to be under control. In other words the inflation raises
> geezers get annually on their Social Security is linked
> to the lesser of two different measures?
> But then they probably are essentially the same and we're
> simply being deceived.

TT: The word "inflation" is too imprecise to have any real
meaning any longer.

JCT: There are only two possible true definitions for
inflation of monetary tokens. An increase in the chips in
the casino or a decrease in the collateral in the cage. So
it really can't be "too imprecise." The problem isn't it's
imprecision, it's that the false definition, Shift A, more
chips, is used by Economics. The true definition, Shift B,
less collateral, isn't known. I, John The Engineer, am the
discoverer of Shift B inflation definition.

TT: There was probably a time when the word had precision
like when we were on the gold standard.

JCT: Doesn't matter whether the medium is gold, silver,
paper, computer credits, inflation is a function of the
amount of collateral and the number of chips, not the medium
of the chips.

TT: Now it is  difficult to tell what is happening as the
central banks all try to play God. Each nation looks at the
elephant while wearing blinders.

JCT: They've been fooled by constant repetition of the Big
Lie of Economics, inflation is too much money, Shift A. See:
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel/biglie.htm a shorter
version of bankmath.htm

TT: But in any particular sovereignty the price of goods
seems to be the yardstick by which "inflation" is measured.
And while the dollar price of oil, gold, and land has
doubled, the price of labor has been cut in half due to the
addition of China, and India, and others in the supply of
labor. As I said, the word is too imprecise to be useful. It
is now used as a "Satan word" to scare the masses.

JCT: And yet, any time you do try to compare values of
money in different times, you must always revert to the
value of an hour of labor. They built Hoover Dam for $20
million, the cost of a small mini-mall today. After the war,
my mother Therese was a school teacher making only
$90............ a year. Under 5 cents an hour. In Canada. If
you want to compare, you must use the Time Standard of
Money.
---

>From: 2006wells -
>Date: Thurs, Oct 26 2006 2:35 am
>Groups: sci.econ

"The Trucker" <mik...  wrote
>> The word "inflation" is too imprecise..

>The word inflation was first used in the US to refer to the
depreciation of  the currency that occurred at a time when
we were not on the gold standard, during the Civil War. It
referred to an inflation in the currency, increase in
supply. The term depreciation was used when a country was on
the gold standard and referred to a rise in the price of
gold or a rise in the price of foreign exchange.

JCT: Of course, now the accept definition is erosion of
purchasing power by increase in money supply (Shift A) or
the unknown (Shift B) decrease in collateral supply.

>> But in any particular sovereignty the price of goods
>> seems to be the yardstick by which "inflation" is
>> measured. And while the dollar price of oil, gold, and
>> land has doubled, the price of labor has been cut in half
>> due to the addition of China, and India, and others in
>> the supply of labor. As I said, the word is too imprecise
>> to be useful. It is now used as a "Satan word" to scare
>> the masses.

>It's really nice when you can just make up the facts. It
saves so much time.

JCT: What do you expect? There are only two possibilities, A
or B, and he has rejected both of them. With nothing left,
is it any wonder he has to use his imagination?



--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics

JCT: You'll remember the invitation to the Rogers debate
moderated by Fuhrer Tim Philp:

1. One minute opening Statement
2. One minute closing statement (if time permits)
3. One minute to answer each question
4. All time limits STRICTLY enforced

JCT: And of course, no interaction between candidates. Must
keep it as bland and unexciting as Fuhrer Philp's taste.

Why do I call him Fuhrer Philp? He moderated the first ever
Rogers community cablevision debate where I was not allowed
to wear my trade-mark white hard-hat during my introduction
nor my trade-mark LETS diskette (button) on my lapel since
1980. Fuhrer Philp even called the police to stop me from
wearing them. If I wasn't on bail at the time, I would have
stood my ground and made the fuhrer of the debate order the
police to take me away (he thinks those are his air-waves,
they're not) but I was free on bail at the time for my House
of Commons bust on Parliament Hill for "possession for the
purpose of trafficking a life-sentence 7-pound supply of
marijuana with a pound each to Prime Minister Chretien, the
Justice Minister, Supreme Court of Canada, Superior Court,
Royal Canadian Mounted Police and Ontario Provincial Police.
So if I had stood up to Fuhrer Philp and tried to wear my
hat, and he used the police he had requested for our debate,
and was arrested, they wouldn't have let me out. So I had to
bow to Fuhrer Philp's command and leave my trade-mark at the
door. (Though I did take out my LETS diskette and put it on
my lapel before the end of the show and dared him to have me
arrested.)

Before I go into it, yesterday's post had a typo. I was
making fun of Philp for his saying that my international
large-database UNILETS program couldn't be applied to
Brantford's small database but omitted that point in his
quote:

"Sadly, the mayoral race has been tainted by the addition of
two candidates who don't stand a chance of election...John
Turmel is not so harmless. Turmel has used his candidacy in
the past to tout his personal crusade for international
monetary reform and marijuana legalisation - issues that
have nothing to to with our municipal election. He does,
however, have a right to run for any office he chooses and
the rest of us will just have to do our best to ignore the
noise."

JCT: Sure, legalising marijuana is a federal issue, but if
the Province helps in the attack, it can become a municipal
issue if I offer to cut funding to the drug squad. Officers
creeping through the bushes to bust high-schoolers with
passing grades for smoking marijuana (which a U. of Sask.
study found regrew brain cells) is a waste of municipal tax
money. No more "Cops and Gardeners" either. So Philp may not
want cannabis prohibition to be on the municipal agenda but
it can be if I want cutting drug-squad funding to be.

And Philp may not want the interest-free time-based UNILETS
"United Nations International-Local Employment-Trading
Software" to be a municipal issue but it can be if I want to
offer a Brantford Timebank based on the same program. And
just because Tiny Tim Brain can't stay with the discussion
is no reason not to have that discussion.

So I'm going to bring ending marijuana prohibition into our
campaign in my own ways by promising to cut funding to on a
crusade against any funding any chasing of herbalists
instead of chasing drunken drivers, drunken wife-beaters,
and drunken politicians. And I'm going to bring setting up a
Brantford Timebank to the debate. And all Philps can do to
shut out my issues is to keep my free-time to speak to a
minimum. And there's nothing Fuhrer Philp can do to shut out
my issues other than keep the candidates' time to speak on
the candidates want to a minimum.

>From: Sally Littell [slittell@...]
>Campaign Chair Friel for Mayor 519-754-7675
>Sent: Monday, October 16, 2006 3:00 PM
>To: tphilp@...; Jeremy Clark; Richard Rathwell
>Cc: christopherfriel@...; mhancock@...;
>johnturmel@...
>Subject: Rogers Mayoral Debate

SL: Dear Mr. Philp, Mr. Clark, Mr. Rathwell and Mayoral
Candidates:

I am pleased to inform you on behalf of Chris Friel that he
will be attending the Mayoral Debate on Thursday, October
26, 2006 from 6:00 pm in Brantford City Council Chambers.
Having reviewed the rules for the debate structure we do
have one significant concern that we would like to have
resolved prior to the debate. It is our opinion that a one
minute limit for opening remarks is not only unduly
restrictive for each of the candidates, it does a disservice
to the viewing public for whom this may be the only
opportunity to hear the candidates and their platforms.

JCT: Absolutely. I don't like having our political discourse
dumbed down to the Tim-Bit level. One minute may be all the
bit he can follow but I agree that most people can handle
more. 117 minutes for Questions and Answers and only 3
minutes for candidate statements is right Tiny Tim Brain's
alley but not essential to the show. Especially when most
questions are repetitions of previous questions with
different groups raising their particular underfunding
problem, repetition which Tim-Bit Brain doesn't even notice.
I, too, want more time to speak about what we, the
candidates want to be heard on rather than what the Big
Brother wannabe moderator wants us to be heard on.

SL: I can tell you that to condense Chris' platform in to a
one-minute capsule (including time for a greeting and thank
you) is impossible and I am certain the other candidates
would be equally better served by even a few additional
minutes.

JCT: Of course, Fuhrer Philp's purpose isn't for us to get
our messages out, it's for him to control what the audience
gets to hear about us. 39:1 Q&A:Statements is a pretty good
way to do it.

SL: With the debate lasting a full two hours, it would seem
that allowing the candidates a total of 20 minutes (five
minutes per candidate) to express their platforms and
provide not only a basis for questions but a more
comprehensive representation of their vision is a balanced
and democratic approach to this important community event.

JCT: Sounds great. 20 minutes for 4 candidates, 100 minutes
for Q&A. 5:1.

SL: As you have stated, there will be no further opportunity
provided by Rogers Television to participate in a debate;
should we not offer the viewing public a full and
comprehensive view of the individuals who wish to become the
next Mayor? I thank you in advance for your consideration
and I look forward to your response. Sincerely,
Sally Littell Campaign Chair Friel for Mayor 519-754-7675
---

>Subject: RE: Rogers Mayoral Debate
>Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2006 19:11:36 -0400
>From: "Jeremy Clark" <Jeremy.Clark@...>
>To: "Sally" <slittell@...>, <tphilp@...>,
<Rick.Rathwell@...>, <mhancock@...>,
<christopherfriel@...>, <johnturmel@...>

GC: Good evening, I appreciate the confirmation that Chris
Friel will participate in our Mayoral Debate. With respect
to the debate format, we are going to continue to follow the
format as described in the debate structure rules. We have
had success with a one minute opening statement,

JCT: Bland, boring, repetitious has proven to be a success.
No discussion, no debate, it's been dictated to the
candidates.

GC: it ensures the debate gets off to a quick start and
allows us to capture more questions from the panel and the
live audience.

JCT: What's the rush to get to the 117 minutes of
repetitious questions? This is our candidate debate, not the
audience debate. We should decide on the format we want to
compete in, not Big Brother staging what Big Brother wants
to have heard. And again, though repetitious underfunding
questions may seem exciting to Tim-Bit Brain but it can't be
good television to impede the variety of political
presentations that candidates wish to present rather than
the same old repetitious issues Fuhrer Philp can follow.

GC: We advise the candidates of this duration in advance so
they have the opportunity to prepare a statement which will
fit into that time.

JCT: We can do the same for 5 minutes too.

GC: Our expectation is that over the two hour debate there
will be ample time for the candidates to respond to
questions and ensure their platforms are clear.

JCT: His expectation is not only false, it is presumptuous.
Nothing can be more satisfying to the candidate than saying
our piece. To say that handling questions will ensure our
platforms are fully covered is an empty promise, and
presumptuous to boot.

Jer. Jeremy Clark  Regional Station Manager
Rogers Television Local Matters
Tel: 519-759-7711 x8120  Fax:   519-893-5861

JCT: I too want a 5-minute opening statement and if Mike
Hancock agrees, we can demand our 5-minute statements right
there or we make our 1-minute statements and threaten to
walk out on Rogers' immovable format.

I'd prefer not to walk but I'd bet they eject Fuhrer Philp
and let someone who can cope with 5-minute discourses to
finish the show. Better yet, ditch Philp and we'll time each
other's answers. No one needs Tim-bit thinking or control.

So I wrote a letter to Rogers in support of Chris Friel's
demand for 5 minute opening statements:

Mr. Jeremy Clark <Jeremy.Clark@...>
Rogers Cable television
Oct 24 2006

Dear Sir:
Chris Friel's Campaign manager Sally Littell wrote you
asking to increase opening statements for the 2-hour show
from 1-minute to 5 minutes explaining that: "to condense
Chris' platform in to a one-minute capsule (including time
for a greeting and thank you) is impossible and I am certain
the other candidates would be equally better served by even
a few additional minutes."

A few hours later, without consulting with the other
candidates, you wrote dictating you are "going to continue
to follow the format as described in the debate structure
rules."

You said: "We have had success with a one minute opening
statement." Perhaps success at keeping what the candidates
want to say off the agenda but not success at getting what
the candidates wanted to say.

You said: "it ensures the debate gets off to a quick start
and allows us to capture more questions from the panel and
the live audience." What's the rush to get to the 117
minutes of repetitious questions? This is our candidate
debate, not the audience's debate. We should decide on the
format we want to compete in, not Big Brother staging what
you want to have heard.

You said: "We advise the candidates of this duration in
advance so they have the opportunity to prepare a statement
which will fit into that time." We can do the same for 5
minutes too.

You said: "Our expectation is that over the two hour debate
there will be ample time for the candidates to respond to
questions and ensure their platforms are clear." Nothing is
more satisfying to a candidate than saying our piece but to
say that our handling questions will ensure our platforms
are fully covered is an empty promise. Your peremptory
rejection of Mr. Friel's request shows a uppity presumptuous
attitude candidates should not have to put up with.

If Mr. Hancock agrees, we will insist on a 5-minute
presentation we want to make or we'll threaten to walk out.
We're the ones in the race and we'll decide how we want to
play the game, not back-room controllers who do not have the
audience's best information nor our best interests at heart.

So I too want a 5-minute opening statement.

JCT: I've always said that if the candidates all insisted,
there's nothing much the moderators can do. Why should
the moderator get to dictate the rules of our game? I'm just
glad Chris Friel had the get-up-and-go to ask for better.


--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics

JCT: Good news for my UNILETS program of macro-lending of
social currency. An inferior program for micro-lending of
anti-social currency just won the Nobel Peace Prize for
doing some good, if not most good.

>Nobel winner's Bangladesh bank helps make poor self-sufficient
>BY FARID HOSSAIN
>ASSOCIATED PRESS
>October 15, 2006

FH: Life-altering idea rewarded
Bangladeshi Nobel Peace Prize winner Muhammad Yunus is
hugged by his daughter Dina after receiving news of his
award Friday. Yunus' bank has given access to credit to
people too poor to get traditional bank loans.

DHAKA, Bangladesh -- Five years ago Gulbadan Nesa was
destitute, unable to feed her family. A simple yet
revolutionary idea -- in the form of a $90 loan -- changed
her life, pulling the Bangladeshi villager out of a
devastating cycle of poverty.

On Friday, that idea -- lending tiny sums to poor people
looking to escape poverty by starting businesses -- won the
Nobel Peace Prize for economist Muhammad Yunus and the
Garmeen Bank he founded. "I can't express in words how happy
I am," the 40-year-old Nesa said after hearing about the
award. She used the money she borrowed from Grameen in 2001
to buy egg-laying chickens, and parlayed her investment into
a business that today sells construction materials. "Not
long ago I was almost begging for money to feed my family,"
she said from the village of Bishnurampur in northern
Bangladesh. "Today, I've got my own house and enough money
to feed my children." She's not alone.

JCT: And this is with a loan of only a couple of dozen hours
worth of labor but to a starving person. So even a micro-
loan seems a god-send to a destitute person.

FH: Yunus' notion -- today, known as microcredit -- has
spread around the globe in the past three decades and is
said to have helped more than 100 million people take their
first steps to rise out of poverty. Some bought dairy cows,
others chickens. In recent years, money for cell phones has
helped start thriving enterprises in isolated villages
without phone lines from east Asia to west Africa.

JCT: I first heard a presentation on micro-lending at the
1999 ATTAC conference in Paris France where I had been
invited to make a presentation on a world-wide interest-free
LETS time-based community currency.
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel/lp.htm to
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel/t99eu3.htm

FH: "Lasting peace cannot be achieved unless large
population groups find ways in which to break out of
poverty," the Nobel Committee said in its citation in Oslo,
Norway. Though it is not the first time the committee has
chosen to honor economic development as a contribution to
world peace, rather than the more usual diplomacy, rights
advocacy or philanthropy, it is the first time the prize has
been awarded to a profit-making business. The 65-year-old
Yunus said he would use part of his share of the $1.4-
million award to create a company to make low-cost, high-
nutrition food for the poor. The rest would go toward
setting up an eye hospital for the poor in Bangladesh, he
said. The food company, to be known as Social Business
Enterprise, will sell food for a nominal price.

JCT: Taking care of the symptoms of poverty, not the cause.

FH: Grameen, which means "rural" in the Bengali language,
was the first lender to hand out microcredit, giving small
loans to poor Bangladeshis who did not qualify for loans
from conventional banks. No collateral is needed for Grameen
loans, which average about $200. But there is social
pressure to repay. Recipients form groups of five, and
members qualify for future loans only if all are current on
their old ones. The results are hard to argue with -- the
bank says it has a 99% repayment rate. The bank says it has
loaned $5.72 billion to 6.6 million Bangladeshi, 97% of whom
were women, and today provides services in more than 70,000
villages. But Grameen is not without critics, many of whom
focus on the bank's high interest rates. Its business loans
carry a rate of 20%.

JCT: 20% micro-loans get a Nobel Prize. Can't wait until
they find out about UNILETS 0% macro-loans.

FH: "While the poor pay 20% interest for their loan, the
rich pay much less. It can't be called social justice," said
S.M. Akash, an economics professor at Dhaka University.

JCT: But even loan-shark rates is better than no loan at
all, most borrowers think.

FH: Reports routinely circulate in Bangladesh's media of
people being forced to borrow from second or third sources,
often at higher interest rates, to repay Grameen loans.

JCT: Of course, loan-sharking must be as harmful to the poor
by small banks as it is to the wealthy by big banks.

FH: Bank's impact on Bangladesh
How much impact Grameen has had on Bangladesh's economy
remains an open question. Poverty has decreased since
Grameen was founded in 1983. Bangladesh's per capita income
has grown from $280 in 1985 to $440 in 2006, according to
World Bank figures. And even if per capita income has
increased, Muslim Bangladesh remains one of the world's
poorest countries, a land beset by political unrest and the
ever-present specter of another military coup.

In fact, the spread of Yunus' and Grameen's microcredit
schemes around the world -- they are now considered a key
approach to spurring development -- is arguably one of the
few bright spots for Bangladesh since it won independence
from Pakistan in 1971. Worldwide, microcredit financing is
estimated to have helped 92 million families last year
alone, according to Jove Oliver, spokesman for the
Microcredit Summit Campaign, part of the Washington-based
Project Results Educational Fund. Yunus told the Associated
Press in 2004 that his "eureka moment" came while chatting
to a shy woman weaving bamboo stools with calloused fingers.

Sufia Begum was a 21-year-old mother of three when he met
her in 1974 and asked how much she earned. She replied that
she borrowed about 5 taka, the equivalent of 9 cents, from a
middleman for the bamboo for each stool. All but 2 cents of
that went back to the lender. "I thought to myself, 'My God,
for 5 takas, she has become a slave,' " Yunus said in the
interview. The following day, he and his students did a
survey in the woman's village, Jobra, and discovered that 43
villagers owed a total of $27. "I couldn't take it anymore.
I put the $27 out there and told them they could liberate
themselves," he said, and pay him back whenever they could.
Over the following year, they all paid him back -- day by
day.

JCT: And he could have minimized his need of federal
currency if he'd also instituted a LETS complementary
currency to work with it side by side.
---

>Khaleej Times Online -
>Bangladesh Nobel laureate vows to make poverty history(AFP)
>15 October 2006

>DHAKA - Bangladesh's microcredit pioneer Muhammad Yunus
vowed to make poverty history as he announced a raft of new
plans aimed at transforming the fortunes of the rural poor,
after becoming the impoverished country's first Nobel
laureate.

JCT: By going after the symptom and not the cause?

>"I think poverty eradication is very much possible. You
change the environment, and we will lift thousands and
millions of people out of poverty," Yunus said at the
weekend. "They don't need any grant to change their life.
People have this power in them. You remove the lid of the
hidden power and poor people will automatically change their
lives,' he said. Yunus and his Grameen Bank, which offers
tiny loans to very poor borrowers to help them become self-
employed, were jointly awarded the Nobel Peace Prize on
Friday. "I think it's quite possible to eradicate poverty
from this world. I think we can halve the poverty level in
Bangladesh by 2015. And in the next 15 years we can rid this
land of it," he said.

JCT: And I can end poverty as fast as I can upgrade the
banking software to UNILETS time-based zero-interest
software. I can end poverty, shortage of money, in the
switch of a diskette but Mr. Yunus' plans will take years.
Hugo Chavez will do more volume of good with social
currencies in Latin America in the next few years than
micro-lending has ever done.

>Yunus added that he was now planning a string of new
initiatives including health insurance for the poor, as well
as information technology, solar energy and organic
fertiliser projects.

JCT: Alleviating more symptoms.

>"Day by day we crossed the poverty line with the help of
Grameen Bank and all our three children go to school.
(Before) nobody's children could go to school due to poverty
and we used to force them into child labour. "Everyone was
landless and we could never have thought of getting a loan
from a bank.' Grameen Bank began life as a pilot project in
1976 when Yunus was a professor of rural economics at
Chittagong University.
---

JCT: I came on the money reform scene in 1979, LETS social
currency credits hit the news at TOES in 1985. Me at TOES in
1997. How could he have missed such a great banking reform?
And now for a dose of reality:

>Article #275900 (275911 is last):
>From: "Steven L. Robinson" <srobin21@...>
>Newsgroups: sci.econ
>Subject: The Myth of Microloans
>Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2006 21:12:15 -0700

CounterPunch/Weekend Edition
October 20 / 22, 2006

A Nobel Peace Prize for Neoliberalism?
The Myth of Microloans
By Alexander Cockburn

AC: The committee that gave Henry Kissinger the Nobel peace
prize has given it this year to Mohammed Younus, the
economist who put the word "microloan" on the map with the
Grameen Bank in his native land of Bangladesh. That's
progress of a sort. But in terms of hot air, any sentences
linking "peace" with "Henry Kissinger" aren't immeasurably
more vacuous than the notion that microloans can help -- to
use the language of the Nobel Committee's citation "large
population groups find ways in which to break out of
poverty."

Throughout the late Eighties and Nineties, in the verbal
currency of first-world do-gooders, "microloans" became one
of those magically fungible words, embedded in a thousand
Foundation and NGO annual reports, like "sustainable". What
could be more virtuous in terms of prudent philanthropy than
giving very small loans to very poor women? Microloans
breathe healthful uplift, as divorced from the sordid world
of mega-loans (though not, it turns out, mega interest
rates), as are micro-brews from Budweiser. The trouble is
that microloans don't make any sort of a macro-difference.

JCT: He made the joke before I could.

AC: They have helped some poor women, no doubt about it. But
in their own way they're a register of defeat. Back in the
early 1970s there were huge plans afoot to change the entire
relationship of the Third to the First World, to speed Third
World economies towards decent living standards for the
many, not just the few. At the United Nations radical
economists were hard at work drafting plans for a New World
Economic Order. All that went out the window and here are
the caring classes thirty years later, hailing microloans.

JCT: So micro-loans of anti-social credits are the Judas
Goat leading people astray from demanding macro-loans of
social credits.

AC: Microloans are micro-bandaids in a scale of things today
where -- to take the example of India -- well over 100,000
farmers, including a large number of women, have killed
themselves because their federal and state governments, plus
large international institutions, have promoted the savage
priorities of neoliberalism.

JCT: Blaming it on the "Neoliberalism" boogieman. What kind
of code word is "neoliberalism?" I like "debt-slavery."
Neoliberalism??? 100,000 have killed themselves because
their poverty! Is it any wonder the Bible calls interest on
debt the "yoke of oppression?"

AC: As the economist Robert Pollin put it pithily when I
asked him what he thought of the award to Younus,
"Bangladesh and Bolivia are two countries widely recognized
for having the most successful micro credit programs in the
world. They also remain two of the poorest countries in the
world."

JCT: Har har har har. Yunus got the Prize mainly for having
had no measurable effect. Unlike social currencies which
have been hailed around the world for measurable effects.
One reason UNILETS time-based currency is in the UN
Millennium Declaration and micro-lending usury-bearing did
not.

AC: In the statistical tables of human development
Bangladesh ranks 139th, worse than India, with 49.8 per cent
of its population of 150 million below the official poverty
line. In the homeland of the Grameen Bank, about 80 per cent
of the people live on less than $2 a day.

JCT: Which is why they'll happily pay loanshark rates, just
like Money Marts and Payday loans in North America, preying
on the weakest members of our First World communities.

AC: A UN Development Program study in the early 1990s showed
that the total microcredits in Bangladesh constituted 0.6
per cent of total credit in the country. Hardly a
transformation. Against this backdrop, what have microloans
achieved? I put the question to P. Sainath, author of
Everybody Loves a Good Drought and India's most outstanding
journalist on rural destitution and the consequences of
economic policy. Yes, he said, microloans can be a
legitimate tool in certain conditions, as long as you don't
elevate the tool into a gigantic weapon. No one was ever
liberated by being placed in debt.

JCT: At 20%.

AC: That said, a lot of poor women have eased their lives by
using microloans, bypassing bank bureaucracies and money
lenders. But today the World Bank and the IMF, along with
state-owned and commercial banks are diving into
microfinance. The microloan business is fast becoming a
gigantic empire, bringing back into control the very banks
and bureaucracies women have been trying to bypass.
Microcredit is becoming a macro-racket.

JCT: At 20%, they're wanting a cut of the action too.

AC: Sainath points out that the interest rates micro-
indebted women are paying in India are far higher than
commercial bank lending rates. "They are paying between 24
and 36 per cent on loans for productive expenditures while
an upper class person can finance the purchase of a Mercedes
at 6 to 8 per cent from the banking system."

JCT: The rich get richer as the poor get poorer, the richer
get richer faster as the poorer get poorer faster, and the
richest get richer fastest as the poorest get poorer
fastest. It's called Reverse Robin Hood.

AC: The average loan of the Grameen bank is $130 in
Bangladesh, lower in India. Now, the basic problem of the
poor in both countries is landlessness, lack of assets.

JCT: Assets backing social time-currencies is labor which
they to not lack.

AC: In the Indian province of Andhra Pradesh, where there
are thousands of microloan groups, land costs 100,000 rupees
an acre, poor land maybe 60,000 rupees--over $2000. $130
doesn't buy you the ranch, not even a good cow or buffalo.
So how many poor women have escaped the poverty trap in AP,
Sainath asks. "Try getting an answer." "With that $130 the
most basic assets do not come to you," Sainath says. "The
amount is tiny. Interest rates are high and the default
sanctions savage.

JCT: Third World Moneymart making Payday loans to destitute
gets Nobel Prize.

AC: During recent floods in AP, freelance journalists came
to a village where everything had been washed away. The
first people back in were the micro creditors threatening
women, demanding monthly installments from women who had
lost everything." Governments like microloans because they
allow them to abdicate their most basic responsibilities to
poor citizens. Microloans make the market a god.

JCT: Collection department gets Nobel Prize too.

AC: Let's suppose USAID or some kindred agency decides to
put $10 million into microloans. What used to be an
initiative of a group of women at the village level, has
become a high-profile, international funding activity. Long
before the first rupee is seen by women in a village, NGOs,
consultants, bank managers and their relatives have all
taken their cut. By the time the loan gets to the women in
the village the cost is prohibitive, with the very poor and
women of low caste often excluded. On top of this, some
revolving-fund models require each women to put in a rupee a
day. But often women don't have a rupee a day, so they go to
the local moneylender to be able to repay the microloan.

As Sainath says, microlending can be a useful tool but it
should not be romanticized as some sort of transformational
activity. On that plane it's useless.

JCT: Which is why UNILETS interest-free macro-loans is on
the Millennium Declaration and Yunus' interest-bearing
micro-loans is not. It's no solution. It's just more of the
same, debt, with poorer suckers paying the vig.

AC: By contrast, as Bob Pollin stresses, "the East Asian
Tigers, like South Korea and Taiwan, relied for a generation
on massive publicly-subsidized credit programs to support
manufacturing and exports. They are now approaching West
European living standards.

JCT: So even programs of macro-loans of anti-social credits
have worked better than programs of micro-loans of anti-
social credits. But none can work as well as macro-loans of
zero-free sociable credits.

AC: Poor countries now need to adapt the East Asian macro-
credit model to promote not simply exports, but land reform,
marketing cooperatives, a functioning infrastructure, and
most of all, decent jobs."

JCT: Actually, they need to adopt the UNILETS Time Standard
of Money, macro-social credit model, not adapt the macro-
anti-social credit model.

AC: The trouble with publicly-subsidized credit programs is
that they're public and they're large and run contrary to
the neoliberal creed. That's why Younus got his Nobel prize,
whereas radical land reformers get a bullet in the back of
the head. http://www.counterpunch.org/cockburn10202006.html

JCT: True, if Big Brother is giving them a prize, you can
bet it's because it helped the masters, not the debt slaves.
Of course, if an economist doing some small-time good with
micro-lending of anti-social credits is worthy of a Nobel
Prize for bringing some Peace to the world, is it any wonder
I predicted 25 years ago that engineering an interest-free
UNILETS time-based social currency to restructure the global
financial architecture is worthy not only of the very last
Nobel Peace Prize once war is successfully de-funded; but
also the last Nobel Prize for Economics once the banking
system engineering programming is successfully debugged by
the Miracle "U=I/(P+I)" equation and a Nobel Prize for
Science once the [1/(s-i)] debt slavery system software is
upgraded to the LETS [1/s] interest-free social currency
software world-wide.

Yunus is an economist, no wonder he has not seen the vast
world-wide social credit solution. If the economist who
engineered a micro-solution using anti-social credits is
worth one Nobel, isn't the engineer who engineered a macro-
solution using social credits is worth more?

Microcredit may be a means in which to break out of poverty
for a few but I'd bet more people have been helped by macro-
loans of social currencies than micro-loans of anti-social
currencies. All of Argentina, for instance, and soon, all of
Latin America. Plus people in 58 countries where community
currencies are installed.

Microcredit alone is not an overall solution, UNILETS is the
one elegantly engineered solution. It's why UNILETS made it
to Millennium Declaration and mini-loansharking did not.

I think the worst part of all this is that focusing on mini-
loansharking has drawn away interest from real solutions.
It's sad he never thought to use a social currency in
conjunction with his cash. Imagine how far more she could
have done with a credit line of 10,000 GreenHours (5
Greenyears) to change her life. If even anti-social credit
that is loansharked out in dribs is of such benefit in
helping destitute people, just contemplate how much getting
their true time-credit worthiness could have helped.

Which is why the anti-poverty engineer worked to get
interest-free UNILETS sociable credits to all citizens in
abundance while the "anti-poverty economist" worked to get
interest-bearing anti-sociable credits to citizens in peanut
amounts.

Anyway, over 25 years ago, on Sep 18 1980, the Ottawa
Citizen published my boast that my "Abolish Interest Rates"
project would earn me 3 Nobel Prizes, including the last
Peace and Economics prizes. If Yunus' micro-solution had a
positive effect on peace, there'll be no more need for peace
prizes once the complete UNILETS social currency solution is
implemented world-wide. And I'd expect the last Economics
prize because, once it's admitted that my
U(min)=J(min)=I/(P+I) models the flaw in the present system
and it's fixed once and for all, who needs prizes for coming
close to solving it. And I'd expect to share the ongoing
Science Prize with LETS software co-engineer Michael Linton.

So, 25 years after my prediction of a triple Nobel prize for
switching off the debt slavery system by updating the
interest-bearing banking system software to the interest-
free LETS banking software to eliminate the "yoke of
oppression?", it bodes well for my vast world-wide zero-
interest UNILETS solution to poverty's cause if a less than
half-vast solution to poverty's symptoms wins a top prize.


--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics

JCT: I wonder when it's going to end but Brantford Expositor
editor David Judd keeps publishing letters to the editor
focused on why Chris Friel's apology for skipping a parade
in 2003 should not be accepted, the big issue of the
campaign to this pea-brained low-tech scribe.

I've pointed out how he keeps trumpeting parade attendance
as the major municipal issue in Brantford. Okay, he's not
trying to impress anyone as to his intelligence by stressing
such a minor priority, he's just use the Brantford monopoly
on print media to smear Friel for Hancock's sake.

It was the big story over at Rogers web site too.
http://www.rogerstelevision.com/option.asp?lid=45&rid=7&m=1
Election Tracker - Week of October 16 |
Friel speaks out, apologizes to veterans
Mayoral candidate Chris Friel apologized to veterans for not
attending Remembrance Day ceremonies after losing the 2003
municipal election.
In his blog, Friel posted a transcript of his statements
during a Rotary Club debate. Here is an excerpt:
"I want to clear up one issue. I have one real concern. And
that is Remembrance Day 2003 and how it spun out of control
and developed a life of its own.
I would never want to hurt or offend or insult any veteran,
any member of a veteran's family or any member of the
community.
I could stand up here and tell you the story of what
happened, I could make excuses, I could tell you why I was
completely shocked and taken aback when the story broke, but
I won't, because I don't want to politicize this issue any
further.
What I want to do is what is right.
And for those reasons I want to offer my heartfelt apology
to the veterans, their families and anyone else in our
community who was offended. It was never my intention. I
can't change what happened, but I can make amends and that
is my intention."
Mike Hancock used his time at the debate to highlight his
accomplishments over the past three years, including a
community-based strategic plan to guide decision-making in
the city.
John Turmel passionately spoke about his ideas on interest-
free loans for Brantford.
Winston C. Ferguson did not participate in the debate.

JCT: Of course, Tim Philp, who also provides garbage from
Judd's Brantford Expositor boor sewer is the Rogers debate
moderator. Remember what Philp wrote about me:
"John Turmel is not so harmless. Turmel has used his
candidacy in the past to tout and marijuana legalisation -
issues He does, however, have a right to run for any office
he chooses and the rest of us will just have to do our best
to ignore the noise."

JCT: Which explains why Philp still doesn't grasp LETS
social currencies despite his having presided over 3
televised debates where I explained it to him. You can't get
slower than that.

Philp has managed to ignore the "noise" about how social
currency would help his community as it has helped so many
other communities around the world, a Judas Goat if anyone
ever fit the description of a willful ignoramus. So the big
Rogers story focused on isn't about a Timebank promised to
Brantford whose engineering Tiny Tim-Brain Philp can't
follow, it's about Friel missing the 2003 parade again.

On Friday Oct 20 2003, the Expositor finally did publish two
pro-Friel letters: "Appreciate his accomplishments" by Helen
Downham and "Veterans would accept his apology" by Joy
(Duguid) Brush. Brush made the point that her vet dad was
"raised in an era when people were polite and learned good
manners, if someone apologizes, however suspect or late,
they would graciously accept the apology."

And even after printing how it's bad manners not to accept
someone's public apology, David Judd's boorish crusade to
refuse Friel's apology sucked 41% into not graciously
accepting the apology. Rather than quit while he's ahead,
Judd had to find some old patsy stir up the stink some more
in Judd's "ungracious" crusade to refuse Friel's apology.

>Many veterans reject apology
>Brantford Expositor  Monday Oct 23 2006
>Letter to the Editor
>Harold Gustin

HG: I am writing this on behalf of the many veterans whom I
know are very disturbed about Chris Friel's arrogance on Nov
11 2003. Many will not accept Friel's apology.

JCT: Yeah, Judd's muck-raking got you riled up enough to
forget the good manners of your era.

HG: I am  quite sure many of the people voicing their
opinions do not show any respect by attending the
Remembrance services on Nov. 11 at 11am each year.

JCT: My grandfather Adelard Turmel was drafted to fight in
the First World War. L'abbe Leclerc (?) told him and his
brother to hit the woods and if the government came for
them, "tuez-les pas mais faites les mourir s'ils le
veulent." (Don't kill them but make them die if they
insist." (Tapes Adelard Turmel)

Can anyone remember the good reason for the World War
crusade my grand-dad sat out? No most can't. So my gramps
was pretty smart to refuse to serve in foreign wars (if
soldiers all stayed home, they can't have foreign wars) and
I pity those who fell victim to Robert Borden's, especially
those city boys who couldn't hide out to escape their
conscripted fates but would have dodged the draft if they
could have. Lt. Watada in U.S., who has refused to serve in
Iraq, an immoral war, is such a hero.

So I remember their sacrifice in a futile cause with pity,
but cannot honor such sacrifice as worthwhile if Adelard
decided it wasn't worth fighting for. Blind loyalty has
always been abused. And the fact no one can remember what
good World War One did is proof enough it wasn't worth the
lives sacrificed to the cause.

HG: I have always showed my respect to all veterans whether
it was cold, freezing rain, snow, etc. I was in attendance
in 2003. Every year I try to assist a veteran by taking them
down to the Remembrance Day service, as I did on Nov 11
2003, but then mayor Chris Friel could not find his way to
the downtown war memorial. Of the many letters to the
editor, I do not recall anyone who came forward to thank
Mike Hancock, who graciously stepped up to the plate and
performed the duties that were the responsibility of Friel,
when he had not even taken over the mayor's duties.

JCT: Yes, such a sacrifice to show up in public beside his
vanquished opponent and be ready to step in and pinch hit
for all the photos.

HG: Veterans would like to take this opportunity to thank
Mike Hancock for his dedication and the respect he showed on
Nov 11 2003. It has been remembered by all of us.

JCT: By David Judd, in particular, over and over and over,
ad nauseam.

HG: I would like to thank our veterans, men and women, for
all the sacrifices they have made for our freedom and
country.
Harold Gustin

JCT: Sad that Judd just had to get in his last smear shot.
If it is his last shot with the missed parade.

Still lots of time to keep finding more oldsters too riled
up by Judd's bad manners to remember their good manners.

All Turmel posts can be found at USENET can.politics and
http://yahoogroups.com/group/brantford or
http://yahoogroups.com/group/turmel


--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics

JCT: It seems obvious since Argentina announced in January
2006 that they had paid off all foreign IMF and World Bank
loans after being broke in 2001 that something different had
taken place. I believe I was the only person in the world
advising people that "Investors betting on Argentina early
will reap the rewards."

So here's an article from 2001 explaining why I was betting
on I was betting on Argentina as they were going broke. You
can search at google.com/groups for:

TURMEL: Argentina resorts to UNILETS  "bond-currency"

>JCT: This article is from Bloomberg, a financial newspaper,
so I expected it to be slanted. I unslanted it by moving
paragraphs 12,14,15 up to the front to expose the smear for
what it is. (My numbered comments later)

Ottawa Citizen Wednesday Aug. 22 2001
NEW CURRENCY SPAWNS ANXIETY (1)
by David Plumb
Bloomberg News, with files from Eliana Raszewski and Charles
Penty

Picture Caption: Buenos Aires Gov. Carlos Ruckauf shows
patacons, a new half-currency, half-bond and the planned
savior of for Argentina's $153 billion debt. Economists say
the bills undermine the peso's one-to-one exchange with the
dollar. "Argentina is bankrupt" Mr. Ruckauf said.

Argentines in Buenos Aires province fear patacons are
worthless, David Plumb reports (2)

Buenos Aires

P1. The cash machine at Banco de la Provincia Buenos Aires
spit out part of Carlos Rodriguez's $1,400 U.S. monthly wage
in crisp, 20-patacon notes.

P12. The provincial governor in Buenos Aires, Carlos
Ruckauf, asked companies to accept patacons as currency
alongside the peso, and said they could be used as payment
for federal or municipal taxes.(3)

P14. Water utilities Azurix SA, and Augas Argentinas SA,
phone companies Telefonica SA and Telecom Agentia, Stet-
France Telecom SA and railroad Metrovias SA have all agreed
to accept the patacon. McDonals Corp. said it expects to
take the currency in exchange for a new meal it plans, the
Patacombo. Some banks said they would accept the notes as
payment on personal and home loans.(4)

P15. Osvaldo Rial, president of the Buenos Aires Province
Industrial Union, offered "total support" for the new
currency while Alto Palermo SA, which runs seven shopping
malls, is negotiating with stores to accept the notes.
Argentina's world champion soccer team, Boca Juniors, will
let fans pay for tickets with Patacons, treasurer Orlando
Salvestrini said. "For many months, people are not going to
have another currency," Mr. Ruckauf yesterday in a televised
news conference. "Argentina is bankrupt."

P2. "I don't know if my salary has been devalued or not,"
said the 43-year-old Mr. Rodriguez, one of 160,000 employees
and retirees in the province of Buenos Aires getting paid in
the new currency. "It depends on how I'll be able to use
these patacons."(5)

P3. As the patacon - a one-year security with 7% interest -
went into circulation yesterday, residents weren't sure what
it is worth. Economists said the bills undermine the peso's
one-to-one exchange rate with the dollar, the economy's
anchor for a decade.(6)

P4. The Buenos Aires province, Argentina's largest with 14.4
million people, more than a third of the nation's
population, printed $95 million of the new notes after banks
limited access to loans. Provincial employees began
withdrawing in patacons the portion of their July salary
above 740 pesos - three weeks after the payment was due.

P5. Other provinces, strapped for cash, plan to follow
Buenos Aires' lead.(7)

P6. "When the pile of worthless paper the provinces are
printing avalanches, the federal government will not be
politically able to stand by and just watch the Argentine
people suffer the consequences," said Colin Negrych, manager
of the Centaur Fund, a hedge fund in New York.(8)

P7. The new money, which looks like an oversized peso bill,
arrived as Argentine officials entered a 12th day of
negotiations with the International Monetary Fund for as
much as $9 billion in new loans to help the country avert a
default. In all, the federal and provincial governments have
$153 billion in combined debt.

P8. Brazil's GloboNews network reported Argentina may
announce an agreement for new IMF loans as early as tonight.

P9. The benchmark bond, due 2005, fell 2.25 to an offer
price of 67.063 to yield 32.5 percent on growing concerns a
default is imminent. The bond was yielding about 17.5
percent in early July.(9)

P10. "Already some residents fear the patacon has no
value."(10) The province plans to print a total of $400
million worth by year end in bills as small as one patacon -
which has a face value of one peso and pays seven percent
interest at maturity.

P11. Eventually, the federal government plans to issue a new
note that would replace the patacon and other provincial
currencies alongside the peso, giving them nationwide
circulation.(11)

P13. At the Alto Avellaneda shopping mall, Hugo Noblega
doesn't trust the plan. "We don't know what to do with
them," said Mr. Noblega, sales manager at a branch of
Kartum, a cosmetic retailer. "My worry is - what happens if
we take them and then someone comes along and changes the
rules?"

>JCT: So that's David Plumb's hatchet job on Argentina's new
local currency. He chose to highlight the opinions of idiots
who worry about what they spend their money on despite
finding out "almost everything in town."

Of course, in the article, only at the end do we find out
that almost everything in town can be bought with the new
money. Had he put that at the start of the article like I
did, David wouldn't have been able to keep citing all these
people asking "what's it worth?" when they sound like idiots
once you've heard what it's worth. A "1-Pero Bond" is worth
a "1-Peso Bill." All those repeated anxieties and doubts
about Patacons being worthless and then we're told the
doubts themselves are groundless. The admission of the truth
at the end destroyed the whole previous inferences of
worthlessness. It makes the whole piece look like a tissue
of lies.

Of course, when the alternative is using no federal currency
or using some local currency, regardless of whether
businesses want to accept the currency or not, if they
refuse to accept the only currency that everyone has and
insist on selling for only currency that nobody has, then
they won't stay open long enough to oppose it for long.
After all, like the governor says, it's the only currency
they're going to have, everyone's going to be using it. And
like I say, what idiots would say such negotiable paper has
no value and where did David Plumb find them? My comments
will follow, but first, my contribution to this debate:

1982 ARREST AT IMF-WORLD BANK TORONTO MEETING

As the world's first anti-globalisation protester, when I
was arrested picketing the IMF/World-Bank meeting in Toronto
in 1982, it brought attention the pamphlet I was passing
out. http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel/imf82.htm

Quebec Social Credit first argued for a national LETS
currency. But Canada Social Credit didn't agree and threw me
out and changed their policy from prohibition of interest
rates to 6%. So I founded the Christian Credit thinking that
credit could only be christian and friendly if there was no
interest.
This is the way I explained then what are the Abolitionist
Party programs of today:
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel/abprogs.htm
I reproduce the bit about bond-currency here:

THE CHRISTIAN CREDIT PROGRAMS:
1) The abolition of interest rates;
2) The establishment of a government dividend;
3) The establishment of no-premium fire and auto insurance.

1) The abolition of interest rates:

Consider how governments presently finance their activities:
If the city has expended the money allocated for snow
removal and is hit with a major snow-storm, Council calls an
emergency session and authorizes the issuance of $1,000,000
in municipal bonds. The mayor has them printed up and
exchanges the $1,000,000 in bonds with a banker for
$1,000,000 in dollar bills bearing 20% interest which happen
to weigh 100 pounds in all.

Council pays for the $1,000,000 job of snow removal with the
100 pounds of bills. The merchants and their employees
accept the 100 pounds ($1,000,000) of bills in exchange for
their goods and services but at the end of the year, because
the banker demands the repayment of 100 pounds ($1,000,000)
in principal and 20 pounds ($200,000) in interest at 20%,
Council must demand 120 pounds ($1,200,000) of bills in
taxes from the citizens who only received the original 100
pounds ($1,000,000). Because every level of government uses
this super stupid way of financing civic services, the tax-
payers find themselves in the impossible situation of having
to repay a greater amount of money than is issued into
circulation. Interest is the root of the evil.

The solution is to be found in the Bible: "Let the exacting
of interest stop" Nehemiah 5:10. Accepting that credit is
only christian when the exacting of interest has ceased, the
major goal of the Christian Credit Party is the total
abolition of interest on credit. This will be accomplished
with the use of small denomination interest-free bonds in
lieu of small denomination interest-bearing bills. If
Abraham Lincoln could get it implemented 100 years ago, we
will certainly get it implemented due to our powerful
computer technology.

When elected, a Christian Credit Council would also
authorize the printing of $1,000,000 in municipal bonds to
get the snow cleared except that the mayor would bypass the
banker by printing up $1,000,000 in dollar bonds bearing no
interest which happen to weigh 100 pounds.

Council will pay for the $1,000,000 job of snow removal with
the 100 pounds of small denomination interest-free bonds
instead of the 100 pounds of small denomination interest-
bearing bills. Because the bonds retain the value of the
original services performed, inflation will cease to exist.
The merchants and their employees can accept the 100 pounds
in bonds from the civil servants in exchange for the same
goods and services that they would have delivered for the
100 pounds in bills when they realize that at the end of the
year, because the banker middleman was cut out, Council will
only have to demand the 100 pounds ($1,000,000) of bonds in
taxes to pay for the principal saving them the 20 pounds
($200,000) in taxes to pay for the interest.

Having demonstrated that small denomination interest-free
bonds cleared the snow as well as small denomination
interest-bearing bills, council will print up enough bonds
to hire all the able-bodied people on welfare and
unemployment to build themselves some affordable houses that
can be bought interest-free because they were financed with
our new interest-free paper.

With less people on welfare and unemployment, our taxes must
be reduced. With more people paying their share, our taxes
must again be reduced. The abolition of interest must
benefit even the rich man by resulting in tax cuts so
massive as to exceed the spread between what he gets in
interest and what he loses in inflation. In days of old,
interest did benefit the rich man because on foreclosure,
the debtor would become his slave and be put to work. Today,
foreclosures do not add to the rich man's wealth by the
addition of profit-producing slaves but actually decrease
his wealth but increasing his taxation to care for the ever
increasing number of unemployed. The abolition of interest
will benefit both the rich man and the poor man.

Though participating is completely voluntary, only those
merchants who have accepted the bonds in lieu of the bills
will save the interest. Those who have not accepted the
bonds in lieu of bills will not save the interest tax and
will be allowed to enjoy the ever increasing taxes that they
now enjoy.
THE CHRISTIAN CREDIT ENGINEER

>JCT: That was my main political program back in 1982. Then
a couple of years later, I read:

Thursday November 28, 1985,
The Charlotte Observer,
CASH-STARVED ARGENTINE PROVINCES TURNING OUT THEIR OWN MONEY
By Andres Oppenheimer, Knight-Ridder News.

MIAMI -- Two remote Argentine provinces, short of cash to
pay public employees, have come up with an easy solution.
They're printing up their own money, to the chagrin of the
national and international banking authorities.
"We are paying all our public employees with provincial
bonds," Roberto Romero, governor of the northern Argentina
province of Salta, said in a telephone interview. He said
Salta started printing its own IOUs because it wasn't
getting sufficient federal currency fast enough.
"People can change these bonds for money at any bank,"
Romero said. "They can use them to shop at supermarkets and
to buy cars or any other products."
The Argentine government is not smiling, and world bankers
are worried that other cash-starved states will copy Salta's
financial extravaganza and jeopardize Latin efforts to curb
inflation and pay huge foreign debts.
The International Monetary Fund (IMF), the world's main
financial inspector for debt-ridden countries, was concerned
enough to bring up the issue in recent talks with the
Argentine government, said sources in Argentina and
Washington. The IMF does not comment on negotiations with
individual countries.
After Salta started quietly issuing its own IOUs in
September last year, the nearby province of La Rioja started
printing its own bonds too. Four other Argentine provinces
have either begun adopting similar programs or are preparing
to do so.
In all cases, the bonds are good only within the province
where they're issued.
But the government of President Raul Alfonsin says the
provincial bonds are expanding the country's money supply
and are undermining efforts to remove Argentina from the
list of world inflation leaders. Earlier this year,
Argentina had a 1,000% annual inflation rate.
Alfonsin made headlines worldwide in June when he launched
an austerity program built around a commitment to stop his
government from printing money. Since then, inflation has
dropped to 3% a month, a record low in recent history.
The bonds printed in Salta come in denominations of 10, 100,
and 1,000 australes, the same as ordinary Argentine currency
bills. They pay no interest and can be either exchanged for
Argentine currency or used to buy goods.
Romero, of the opposition Peronist Party, and officials of
other provinces claim their bonds are not really new
currencies because they are no good outside their provinces.

>JCT: So using small denomination bonds as provincial local
currency worked then and it will work now, even with the 7%
usury. As long as the government keeps printing the money to
pay the interest, everything will balance in the end. As
long as they're not in debt to banks who are the only guys
who can print the money, all will work well.

So there, I hope, is the genesis of the LETS bond-currency
proven so effective in Argentina that they used it the last
time their money system broke down and they're having to
turn to it again now.

Comments on the latest article:

(1) "New currency spawns anxiety" only in New York banks
that won't be getting any interest on currency created by
the Argentines themselves. The Argentinian workers who
accept the bonds will be getting the benefit. A kind of
"demurrage" that LETSers will love but that a casino chip
purist like me finds technically unnecessary though I'll
admit this could prove to be the spark that makes UNILETS
go.

(2) That "Argentines in Buenos Aires province fear patacons
are worthless, David Plumb reports" is quite a
misrepresentation. The three Argentines he quotes do not the
province make, especially when he found them in an insane
asylum.

(3) Great, The Engineer's Number One Prime Feature for
saturation is the demand that they "be used as payment for
federal or municipal taxes." Any piece of paper people can
pay their taxes with is instantaneously valuable to
everyone, a saturated market. King Henry's Tallies were
government IOUS, Lincoln's and Kennedy's Greenbacks were
too.

(4) Even better than just being able to spend it on taxes.
All those people in the article who kept asking "what's a 1-
peso bond worth?" it's a peso worth water, communications,
transportation, or rent or taxes. If you think it's
worthless, throw them out over here.

(5) Still the big question in the article is "How to use the
Patacons?" Of course, a 1 peso bond can pay his water bill
as well as a 1 peso bill, a 1 peso bond can pay his
telephone bill as well as a 1 peso bill, a 1 peso bond can
get him transportation as well as a 1 peso bill, and a 1
peso bond can pay his house mortgage as well as a 1 peso
bill and a 1 peso bond can pay his federal and municipal
taxes as well as a 1 peso bill too. And he's asking "how
I'll be able to use these patacons."

Of course, in the original article, the reporter put the
fact that all the large corporations are going to be taking
the new money at the end of the article and the opinions
expressed of his doubters aren't provably laughable at this
point for this reason. So while you are unaware that all the
big companies are going to take it, you can take their
comments seriously. But learning about the companies
earlier, then the stupidity of these quotes becomes clearer.

>JCT: (6) We're endangering their anchor. As if it's been
such a great anchor when everyone's screaming that it's not.

(7) When Argentina faced the banks who wouldn't grant the
loan, They said "We'll do like Salta did in 80s: Print our
own.
Any bets that Salta is soon on the list. The Province of
Salta was the first of the six provinces who, when they ran
out of cash in the early 1980s, used small denomination
interest-free bonds to pay all their employees thereby
causing huge drops in unemployment and inflation. The same
thing will happen here even though their 7% interest on the
bonds is an unnecessary, even if perhaps attractive,
feature. It's not so bad thinking when you think that the
worker who accepts the bond for his labor is going to get
the 7% instead of some foreign New York bank. More on the
Salta experiment later.

(8) As for the New York Bond salesman saying that all the
paper that can buy all these things is worthless, did we
really expect the New York bankers to approve an idea where
the interest they used to collect on large denomination
bonds that only they could accept going to the guys who
accepted the small denomination bonds for the the work they
did? All that worthless paper that can only pay people's
water telephone, transport and rent bills. Quick, throw all
that worthless money away, says the Financial advisor. Throw
it over here.

(9) We know it's not our 7% bond they're talking about so it
must be their 17.5% bond to the New York bankers they're
talking about replacing with the 7% bonds to the workers.
And most of the $9 billion will be used to pay the interest
to the New York banks anyway. That's why it's so important
to them and not to Argentine citizens. They certainly aren't
going to see much more it than it passing through their
hands from the IMF to their creditors.

(10) "Already some residents fear the patacon has no value."
Where did he find people as mentally impaired as to ask
themselves if the piece of paper that buys them everything
in town has any value or not? Of course, we still didn't
know about all the companies that were taking it and so this
didn't seem as stupid a statement as we now know it is. And
we know that the reporter was trying to mislead us on
purpose.

(11) Though I do like the idea of the feds issuing their own
bond-currency to finance their activities, there's no reason
to make the provinces give up theirs. It's too easy to phase
the new out and get back to interest-bearing bonds to the
New York banks again.

Early smears of the system are left unchallenged until the
important facts are printed at the end of the article that
defeat the smears. So I moved the last few paragraphs to the
front. Certainly did change things, didn't it. That's an
easy way to defeat propaganda pieces. Look at the part they
put last first.

And finally, Argentina already has the world's largest
private LETS with over half a million people. So even if the
governments hadn't stepped in, many were already finding a
legitimate source of alternate currency to Trade Employment
Locally.

Financial pundits may be fuming and forecasting destruction,
but just like they forecast worse inflation in the 1980s and
inflation went down, not up, from an injection of healing
currency, so too, even with the 7% bonus and despite the
same kind of dire forecasts, I'll bet that things will get
better from now on, not worse. Investors betting on
Argentina early will reap the rewards.


JCT: During the next years, I've written not only how they
were swamped with good provincial bond currency (for
everyone to pay taxes with), farmers' IOUs for grain that
I've already described (search "turmel reuters grain ford"
as private creditos barter currency for 7 million eventual
members before counterfeiters hurt some networks (government
wouldn't help fight private counterfeiting),

And now the financial miracle is going to take place in
Venezuela where President Hugo Chavez' government will be
running the social currency so counterfeiters will beware!
Investors betting on Venezuela early will reap the rewards!


--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics

Afghanistan

JCT: Everybody knows I don't believe Bin Laden and the
Taliban could have pulled off 911: the Islamic Mission
Impossible of diverting the US Air Force to allow two plane-
loads of gasoline to demolish three steel sky-scrapers.

No reputable engineer has ever explained how the third
building #7 which wasn't hit came down in symmetrical fashion
nor how steel could melt in oxygen-deprived fires generating
temperatures below the melting point of steel. Only Amerikan
Bush-whackers could have shut down the Air Force or planted
the explosives for three perfectly symmetrical demolitions.

So I think the Taliban are innocent of 911 even if CIA Bin
Laden may have been in on creating the false-flag operation
to blame some Arabs for an ambush by a bunch of home-grown
Bush-whackers. Regardless, the UN formed a posse to chase an
innocent patsy nation at the instigation of the lying guilty
United States Administration.

>Canada's role in Afghanistan topic for conference
>Brantford Expositor
>Oct 17 2006

Lt.Gen. Michel Gauthier, commander of the Canadian
expeditionary force, will speak about Canada's role in
Afghanistan on Friday at 7pm at Laurier Brantford's Carnegie
Building.
The talk "provides a rare opportunity to discuss the issues
facing Canadians in Afghanistan with a senior command
official," said Terry Copp, director of the Laurier Centre
for Military Strategic and Disarmament Studies.
Gauthier is keynote speaker at a conference sponsored by the
centre and the 56th Field Regiment in Brantford. The
conference will continue Saturday with morning presentations
on the Canadian Army and the First and Second World Wars, and
an afternoon session on modern conflicts.
Captains Chris Marvin and Mark Whitford, two officers of the
56th Field Regiment, who have served in Afghanistan, will
join historian Lee Windsor to discuss past and future
Afghanistan operations.
Admission is free but seating is limited. A full program is
available at www.canadianmilitaryhistory.com

JCT: Wow. a chance to hear the sales pitch for Canadian kids
to go die in foreign lands. And maybe pull off some kind of
anti-war protest coup. Of course, I'm on 3 years probation so
if I'm ever taken away, I don't get out.

There were about 50 people including officers and the
commander of the Brantford militia regiment and quite a few
young people in the audience. Unfortunately, Lieutenant
General Michel Gauthier, commander of the Canadian forces in
Afghanistan, couldn't make it but his deputy-commander,
Brigadier General Davies, came in his place.

B.Gen. Davies was a fighter pilot before going into war
administration. He showed us lots of planning charts on how
we were taking the war to the Taliban, detailing the
problems of soldiers/social workers blowing them up one
moment and putting them back together again the next. He
said he expected a hot time in Question & Answer period at
the end.

Of course, it was a professional PR presentation sounding
much like a U.S. Government pitch but some misrepresentations
and omissions were so egregious, I couldn't contain myself
and had to quip a few barbs. Hey, if the Reserve Officers of
America could keep interrupting Commander-in-Chief Bush to
applaud, I'd get a few licks in. He handled them with aplomb
though. Must be the resident P.R. expert. He didn't know
what was coming up.

When he was explaining how the Taliban terrorists were
attacking the pacifying Nato forces, I noted "and the
government installed by the invaders.'

Another time, when he was explaining we were there for
humanitarian reasons since there was nothing of value there,
I piped up: the pipeline? He said it looked like the Q&A was
going to be interesting.

Finally, he was explaining how important it was for Canada to
be there helping Afghanistan rebuild schools, hospitals,
roads, if they are to have any social structure at all. I
find it so hypocritical when 90% of the world is run by
worse administrations to say we have to help one in
particular so I quipped: "Africa next?" That shot stunned
him and he said he as looking forward to my question.

In Q&A, after a few questions on logistics of warfare, he
pointed at me for my question mentioning I'd probably be
giving him a hard time. I said:

I'm John The Engineer but don't get the wrong impression
here, I was in the Queen's Honour Guard at Canada's
Centennial on Parliament Hill almost 40 years ago. But I
have to wonder how I'd feel if I was serving now. (I should
have mentioned how my grand-father Adelard Turmel was a
World War I draft-dodger after Robert Borden introduced the
draft to send Canadian kids to foreign wars, this one "to
end all wars." Har har har har.)

We've heard plenty on "Who?", "What?", "Where?", "When?",
and "How?" but not so much on the uncomfortable "Why?"

50% of Americans believe the US government had to be
involved in 911, probably more Canadians. As an engineer, I
know charcoal doesn't melt my barbecue and so aviation fuel
doesn't melt steel buildings. So Bin Laden and the Taliban
didn't do 911. I noted the picture of the burning towers
while you were explaining why we're in Afghanistan so our
guys are the sucker posse being sicced on an innocent patsy
by a crooked Sheriff Bush.

When I hear you talking about "killing the Taliban," and I
know they're innocent, this makes it Canada's first bad war,
the first war where we're the bad guys. (Some applauded,
which must have shocked them.) So I want you guys out of
there whether you have to retreat or surrender. (A few
booed, one crying "shame.") I ended quipping: Send your
kids.

Davies said: I didn't hear a question there, next.

I shouted: Is it a moral war or are we the bad guys?"

"Next" was all the general could say as he turned away.

I quipped: "At least the General knows how to retreat."

Going out later in front of all the young job-seeking
cannon-fodder, I quipped: "I don't want any Canadian kids
going to die in foreign lands." So:

General Davies can't deny "we're the bad guys" in Afghanistan


--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics

JCT: The results of David Judd's poll on whether Chris
Friel's skipping a parade to lick his wounds after a heart-
breaking loss of his job is unpardonable or not are in.

>Is Friel's apology sufficient? Will it be accepted three
years after the incident? The voters of Brantford will
decide on Nov 13. But Judd couldn't wait.

>Expositor Reader Poll
>Do you accept Chris Friel's apology for missing the
>Remembrance Day service in 2003?
>To register a YES response: call 519-754-5950
>To register a NO response: call 519-754-5952
>Results of this poll will appear in the Thursday edition.

JCT: A poll on whether Friel's dereliction of duty is
unforgivable. How many people would vote with Judd that the
apology is insufficient?


Brantford Expositor Thursday Oct 19 2006 Page A4
1595 votes
59% found Friel's lapse forgivable.
41% found his lapse unforgivable.

Imagine, over 600 people called in to say it could not be
forgiven, more was needed. Pea-brained and no class, to
boot. But I think in sufficiently large a number that David
Judd, the instigator of this ugly poll, should now tell us
what he thinks Friel must do to atone or why it was so
unpardonable.

Still, 41% out of a pretty big sample so it's shocking there
would so many unforgiving Judd clones out there who seem to
have not heard that "to err is human, to forgive divine."
You know Judd's not divine. Luckily, the majority showed
some divine class Judd doesn't have. Most probably resented
his flogging a dead horse to keep smearing Hancock's
opponent on such a trivial over-sight. Pea-brained and no
class to boot. Still, the good news is that the Judd clones
are in the minority because:
Brantford poll shows 41% pea-brained and not divine




--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics

JCT: More discussion about discredited Socred pseudo-
philosopher Bill Ryan's piss-possessed posts on sci.engr:

>From: Brian Whatcott <betw...@...>
>Date: Tues, Sep 26 2006 11:30 pm
>Groups: sci.engr

BW: I realise it won't do any good, until someone takes up
my offer of a reward for stopping Ryan from echoing Turmel
but it made me feel a whole lot better to send a copy of
Ryans P-Boy note back to his email address - for eac of his
dumb copies. Dozens! Won't you join me? Brian Whatcott Altus
OK
---

>From:  Brian Whatcott <betw...@...>
>Date:  Fri, Oct 13 2006 12:19 am

BW: As a follow on step, I copied his note to the yahoo
abuse line with a request to handle the problem..
---

>From:  Greg Locock <gregloc...@...>
>Date:  Fri, Oct 13 2006 6:58 am
>Groups:   sci.engr

GL: Hi Brian, You are a valued contributor to sci.engr.* and
I always appreciate your posts. But in this case I have to
disagree. Turmel is an egotistial loon, who has destroyed
sci.engr, and adds zero to the newsgroup. While I agree,
Ryan adds nothing positive  to the group, he may,
eventually, drive the completely useless Turmel away from
posting here. He may not, but that seems to me to be a risk
worth taking. Why do you think that the idiot Turmel has a
right to free speech, whereas the monomaniac Ryan does not?
Cheers Greg

JCT: My posts prevent him from reading others'? My posts
crowd out others'?
---

>From:  Brian Whatcott <betw...@...>
>Date:  Fri, Oct 13 2006 7:57 am
>Groups:   sci.engr

BW: Fair question: Ryan's vaporings are repetitious,
Turmel's vaporings are different, every one. A pox on both
of them.
However, a spirit of free speech restrains one from
censoring the endless variety of schlock from T. Ryans
effusions are devoid of new meaning - a definition of
noise.  Brian Whatcott    Altus OK
---

>From:  Greg Locock <gregloc...@...>
>Date:  Fri, Oct 13 2006 6:24 pm
>Groups:   sci.engr

GL: Fair enough, go for it. Sadly neither are really
breaking any hard and fast rules.

JCT: Actually, Brian's point is that "the endless variety of
schlock from T. Ryans effusions are devoid of new meaning -
a definition of noise." It's an abuse.

GL: Still, it's an interesting experiment. Hmm, I wonder if
anyone has tried reporting the contemptible fool Turmel to
his ISP? So far as I am aware the T&Cs do theoretically
forbid abuse of Usenet. Cheers

JCT: Go ahead and form your complaint. Go ahead and make
your case for abuse. Let's see you back up your beefs. I say
you're a big mouth who can't frame an argument. Go ahead.
Make your case! You choose to spout your vacuous mumblings
to an engineering group. Act like an engineer and back up
what you say. If you can. I bet you can't.


--
Abolitionist Slave Leader John C."The Banking Systems Engineer" Turmel
for UNILETS interest-free time-based currency in U.N. resolution C6
to Governments in the http://www.un.org/millennium/declaration.htm
http://www.cyberclass.net/turmel 519-753-0645 USENET: can.politics