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Re: Hello Elisabeth - Your Enlightenment & the Energy   Message List  
Reply | Forward Message #59 of 242 |
Dear Vaughn,
 
thanks for your continued efforts but frankly, it is just a waste of time for both you and me, and for the many MPRUE initiates that you contacted.  I have visited the website of your young Indian guru, I know about Sai Baba and his background from personal astral encounters, and about people like RaviShankar who are all described by their students (and maybe even themselves) as being enlightened and "allmighty".
 
From what I have seen and experienced, the concepts that you mentioned and that are probably taken from teachings of some gurus, do not hold in reality.  In fact, even the enlightened Buddha died after being sick for days.  And Jesus Christ who healed instantly and was sayed to have awakened the death, sweat blood because of fear, and finally got cruzified.  Did you meet HE Rinpoche T.C. who was one of the teachers of the Dalai Lama and compared his Divine golden aura with his physical appearance?
They all had to go through a learning process as determined by the rest of their karma, inspite of their obvious enlightenment.  We all incarnated for a reason and have to put up with a mortal physical body and the influence of the Universe of Duality. 
 
Then  the term "enlightenment" can not be generalized either as there are many degrees to it depending on the spiritual pre-condition of the person who experiences it. Full and complete enlightenment can not be constant as long as we live in the physical body because the highest energies are too intense and would burn off the physical matter our mortal body is made off, and also our astral body.  Also, enlightenment can take several forms, but always comes along with the absolute certainty beyond any doubt that what one sees or intuits is the truth, and with full comprehension. 
The chronic illnesses you can find in many highly spiritual people are caused by the severe chakra imbalance (higher chakras versus lower chakras) as most just concentrate on their spiritual development and neglect their physical needs of grounding. 
Also, they might be impatient and try to burn off all their rest-karma withing one last incarnation so that they can move on towards higher realms than this Earth plane. 
------------
Anyway, I already got some reactions to your email from a few of my friends and MPRUE initiates/students, I am pasting some here without the names:
 
1)  This guy sounds terribly patronizing, or is it my own impression? Hugs and blessings
 
2)  Dearest E, I have received the communication from this person.  In my opinion you could spend eons debating points of theology with him and it would do nothing to shift his entrenched beliefs. He may have a
point or two, but his agenda is obviously to disprove you and MPRUE, despite his apparent politeness. I think it would be a great waste of your time and energy to continue the discussion with him. You have stated your position; why reiterate?As you have already tried to fob him off politely and he wouldn't be fobbed, perhaps now it is time to ignore him.
For what it's worth, I love the fact that you are humble, honest and human. You teach from your knowledge, wisdom, and the enlightenment you have been granted; you do not play the Great Guru, a temptation into
which so many fall. It is my observation that many who are doing great work in these times are living ordinary and even anonymous lives. As for Jesus, whom the gentleman mentioned, did he not come to earth to do
just that - experience the ordinary human condition, as one of us?
(Well, that amongst other things, if you like.) But here I go into theology, so let's not.
I am in a big rush just now. By all means share this with other initiates if you wish.
Much love

3)  Hello sweet Elisabeth:  I am so concerned for you, I really hope you manage to read this note. There is a person called Vaughn Bentinganan he is sending  letters to the group members questioning your enlightenment. Please, please protect yourself I don't like this guy he is looking to ruin you I think. Loads of hugs and light
 
------------
You see, I am not a "guru" and never considered myself as being one.  I am treating the MPRUE inititates as what they are - companions along the spiritual path, and dear friends.  In the eyes of God all of us are the same - sparks or parts of God.  I am not better and not worse than any of them, enlightened or not.  And all the energies and energy systems are ultimately also parts of God, even the evil ones.  Also animals, plants, minerals, angels, demons, solar systems, the  highest and the lowest energies. We are here on Earth to learn, experiment, and to find our way out of the self-generated illusion back to our own true self - God.  That is the Universe of Duality about.  Seeking instant enlightenment as a hermit and avoiding the karmic lessons is just searching for a shortcut that I do not recommend as it is cheating oneself of valuable karmic lessons, and creating severe energetic chakra imbalance. 
 
Everything has a purpose in life, and everybody feels attracted to whatever energies etc resonate with her/him at a certain point in life. If one feels attracted and resonates with Tera Mai then Tera Mai with it's own energies and vibes is right for her/him just now to learn certain lessons, and later s/he might change to something else.  Same with Sai Baba's teachings or the teachings of your guru, or to energies that are called black magic, alien energies, whatever.  Ultimately, God's energies are just that, neutral energies. What we manifest with the help of them is our own creation and we have free choice.   
 
Anyway, I hope I made my point very clear that it is a waste of time to debate your guru's ideas with us, and trying to cord anyone of us to him and what is behind him. I wish you all the very best for your own spiritual path.
God bless you.
 
Love,
Elisabeth
 
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 11:52 PM
Subject: Re: Hello Elisabeth - Your Enlightenment & the Energy

Dear Elisabeth,
 
Thank you writing me back.  I have included this email to the initiates in your system from your website.  Something this important and for the welfare of humanity should always be brought out to the open for analyzation.  I hope you can help me and explain more about your system and why you wrote what you wrote to me, from my letter to you at the bottom of this email.  If you can clear up my questions and explain, I would be the first to become a disciple of yours, if you truly have gained "Sainthood" through Enlightenment.
 
I have seen many Saints, and have gained benefit from just being in their company.  And if you are, as you say, Enlightened, meaning you are a Saint or True Mystic who knows the Universal Truths and can see the karmas of people you meet, then by all means I would love to meet you.
 
As you may have sensed, I have written you because I too am on a strong mission to inform people of the harms of healing systems that are not full-proof, and to spread the mission of my Guru, Paramahamsa Sri Nithyananda.  I noticed on your website that your wrote:
 
In the MPRUE system, you use certain techniques, methods and symbols to direct the channeled energies for focussed work (energy surgery), for example to remove unhealthy energetic structures, elementals, entities, etc.  The energies connected with the MPRUE symbols are very powerful and pure (because of the short lineage), and they work in harmony with other energies of other healing systems, like Usui, Karuna, Tera Mai, Lightarian, etc.

If you say you really are Self-Realized, then you have reached the ultimate peak that all humans, plants and animals seek out - Sainthood.  And you very well could be...But if you are, then you would know the importance of my constant questioning on authority figures.  And if this is true, then why would you advertise your MPRUE System to work in harmony with the other energy systems, Usui, Karuna, Tera Mai, Lightarian, etc.  These are ALL man-made initiations and attunements.  They were not derived completely and solely by one who Self-Realized, or Enlightened - meaning someone who as completely transformed him/herself and knows the Universal Truths, such as Babaji, Yogananda, Nithyananda, Sai Baba, Buddha, Jesus, Patanjali.

Are you really on that level?  Again, forgive me if you are.  But then again, if you are Truly Enlightened, you would be happy at anyone who questions you this much.  And if you truly have not come to completely "know yourself" as One with God/Divine, etc., as a direct experience in merging, then the energy you received is most likely not complete, full-proof or 100% pure as that of the great Rishi, Nithyananda's, Sai Baba's or the Dalai Lama's.

I am questioning you very much because you told me that you ARE Enlightened.  But on your website you also wrote:

The early days of MPRUE have been rather bumpy, as I had to go through a painful learning process.  At first, I was a bit naive and too ready and willing to believe others, especially the ones who were charming and who used personal manipulation and management techniques to influence and direct me.

In my experience, after visiting True Rishis such as Nithyananda (www.dhyanapeetam.org), Eckhart Tolle (www.eckharttolle.com), Sant Rajinder Singh Ji Maharaj (www.sos.org) , Ammach (hugging Saint www.amma.org), and Siva Baba (www.sivababa.org), Sai Ma (www.humanityinunity.org) I have come to know that there is no such thing as a "naive" Saint.
 
You also wrote:
At the same time I continuously felt attacked by negative energies that I became vulnerable to by allowing one of this two men to charm me.
 
Again, a Rishi, or Enlightened Saint can never be charmed.  They see through everything and know the personal intentions of everyone who comes to them.  They are not mind-readers, they are just omniscient.
 
Thank you for your time.  I hope that you can clear this up with me.  Because there really is no such thing as a "perfect system" or full-proof method of healing if it has not come directly from a Living Master or Saint.
Best, In Nithyananda (Eternal Bliss) - Vaughn, Sri Ananda Chinmay
 
 
ORIGINAL MESSAGES:

Elisabeth Frauendorfer <magnussa@...> wrote:
Dear Vaughn,
thanks, but I am one of the - actually many - enlightened beings incarnated on Earth for a spiritual mission, and I received the energies directly from the Divine. All the problems and considerations that you mentioned below in regards to Reiki and other energies do not apply to me and the system that I founded.
I wish you best of luck and success in spreading your own healing and spiritual system,
may God bless You, Elisabeth
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 8:37 PM
Subject: Hello Elisabeth - About the Energy

Dear Elisabeth,
 
I ran across your website on the internet and felt very compelled to write you.  You sound very well-intentioned in your work and in your ethics to uphold a purity for individuals and societies; and because of this I knew you would take into consideration some of the points that I am going to lay out for you.  As you have assumed a role as a high-level teacher to many people, I am sure that daily reflection on the energy which you attune others to as well as the results of it during healings is something which you also take into account and the responsibility of.
 
Food for Thought... My questions are:

1) If you yourself say that you have not yet Enlightened and have come to know yourself through Self-Realization, then how do you know, or how can you be sure, 100%, that your method is full-proof and completely 100% pure?  ...meaning absolutely no side effects or anyone using your system having an experience where they take on their patients' pains, or pass their own on to the patient?
2) If the great Enlightened Bodhisattva & Rishi, Master Usui, was given the perfect system of Reiki at the time of his Enlightenment, then why have people changed his way of attuning people, making it man-made - and now there are hundreds of ways to attune to Reiki? (all man-made)
3) If nobody ever received permission directly from Master Usui to teach his methods and his attunements, how would they know they are teaching it and performing the attunements 100% correctly?
4) If the system that is being taught is not Master Usui's, then whose is it?  If it has not come directly from a Living Enlightened Master, how would one know that their own mind and desires for Spiritual Realization have led them astray?
4) Has anyone ever experienced a taking over of somebody's pain, or side-effects such as light-headedness or lethargy from using your system of Reiki, or any system of Reiki?

More Food for thought:

There are 2 Living Master Teachers, Bodhisattvas, walking around today who have commented on hands-on healing.  Both of these Teachers are Real & True High Level Teachers, meaning they have Enlightened.  They have come to know themselves as One with the Live Energy.  They both know the Universal Truths back and forth through experience, not from books, and they both have the capacity to create methods of healing and meditations that are "full-proof" and guaranteed to lead one to Enlightenment, or Self-Realization.
 
The 1st is Master Ching Hai.  She enlightened in India after traversing through various cities on foot, working for various Enlightened Teachers until she met her one True Guru who initiated her into the Inner Light & Sound. She stated that laying on of hands is more detrimental to a person's being than helpful.
 
The 2nd is Paramahamsa Sri Nithyananda. He stated that Reiki and Pranic Healing are not full-proof, and because of this, people experience side effects and the taking on of other people's pains. He also stated that the ONLY "full-proof" methods of hands-on healing are those that come directly from the initiation of a Living Master, be it him or another Rishi.

Let's analyze:

The process of Reiki attunements has been passed down from person to person since Master Usui. This passing on of the attunement has caused it to change drastically, and now there are hundreds of ways to attune a person. Moreover, there are many who claim that the Divine gave them another system to teach people.  Yet, if these people have not come to completely know the Divine themselves through Self-Realization, then how can this be?
 
And can these people be sure whether or not their method is completely full-proof and 100% pure?  Why did people change the process or come up with something new if Usui's was already perfect, since he was an Enlightened Being?  Was it not perfect to begin with? Do many, many miraculous healings always happen on a very consistent basis with the man-made attunements? Or is it only a few times?

In Paramahamsa Sri Nithyananda's Ananda Healing Method which he himself, the Living Bodhisattva, initiates people into, he promises 100% that the method is full-proof - that one will never take on another's pain - that very miraculous healings will occur on a regular basis...and they do. Nor is there any pain that any of the initiates have ever taken on from other people.  Nithyananda gives his word that as an Enlightened Teacher, he will always take full responsibility of ALL healings that his Initiates do, and that all healings with Ananda (Bliss) Energy are a guaranteed improvement or cure with the patient.

More on Nithyananda and why he can make these statements. On January 1, 2000, Nithyananda (Eternal Bliss) Enlightened and came to know himself, just as Master Usui did. He fully realized that he was and has always been the Live Energy in everything, and not just a physical body. After his Enlightenment, he spent 9 months laying motionless saturated in samadhi (meditation). Since then, the doctors at his ashram in India have documented over 20,000 miraculous healings which he has performed, 1000 of them being cancer.  And every day, 10,000 people are touched by his Ananda Initiates worldwide, producing miraculous healing results. He has brought people back from comas, cured diabetes in full, cancer, tumors and many other ailments and disabilities. And just 2 weeks ago, April 14, Nithyananda healed a boy in St. Louis, MO from 10 years of paralyzation in front of a Dr. William Collins at Washington University - all of which was recorded and will be written in national and international medical journals soon.

Here are his statements on man-made attunements and why they are not full-proof:

Question: (On Ananda Healing) What is the advantage in Your system of healing?
Today, many systems of healing are there. People do heal and give results. But they don’t have enough maturity or purity. When you get energy from somebody, you receive his thoughts as well. When you go to a professional man for healing, he may give you results but he also passes on his immature thoughts to you. If you go to a Master or people who have been initiated by a Master for healing, you will see that only positive Energy will be received. You will get healed and you will also become more mature in your thoughts.

Why do You initiate people to be healers?
I have only two hands for healing. I need more hands to spread my Energy and so I initiate people to be my healers.

Is there any difference between healing done by You and healing done by Your Healers?
No! absolutely no difference. The same Energy that flows through me flows through them also.

What do You want them to do to take up that responsibility?
Meditate. Secondly, just be in the presence of the Master. It will do a lot of good. Individual instructions like ‘do this’ and ‘don’t do that’ cannot be given. Just be with the Master, it will make you God or Master. When you go near fire, it will consume you and make you also part of it. Likewise, just be with an open mind near the Master. Being with a Master will make your Being into a Master.

Is it possible for You to tell the patient when exactly he will get cured?
Yes. When I meet him personally, I can tell the exact period.

Is distant healing possible? If yes, how?
Distant healing is possible. At the body level, we are different. At the mental level, we are all connected in a deep and unconscious way. Distance and space do not count.

Is the healing that You are doing black magic?
It is not black magic, it is white magic! Energy along with the maturity to handle it is white magic while energy with no maturity to handle it is black magic. If you a give a knife to a child, he might hurt himself or hurt others. He does not have the maturity to handle it. If you give the same knife to a surgeon, he will use it to heal people. It depends on the maturity of the person handling it. In the same way, energy can be used to do good or bad. The man who is spiritually Enlightened will do white magic while the man who has no maturity to handle the energy will do black magic.

Here is his website along with a link to his FAQ's and tour schedule:
http://www.dhyanapeetam.org
http://www.dhyanapeetam.org/faqs.asp
http://www.dhyanapeetam.org/SwamijiDates.asp


He is in the U.S. now teaching and giving extremely intensive meditation camps and Healing Initiation. Anyone can attend his meditation camps for enlightenment. However, in order to become an Ananda Healer, one must become vegetariain - no meat, no fish, no eggs, no products with eggs, as well as no alcohol or smoking. One drink or eating meat, as Nithyananda explains, makes the energy bodies distorted and makes the body a very unfit vessel to receive the most pure energy. He says it would be like playing with "fire" because Ananda Energy is such a powerful and direct beam of light that goes through all of his initiates. He also says that when any of his initiates perform Ananda Healing, they are enlightened - simply because his energy, which comes from the very core of Divinity, radiates through their vessel at a very very high vibration - no side effects, no run-around, guaranteed.

Keep in mind that Nithyananda is not looking for disciples. If people go to other Living Masters, Bodhisattvas, it is perfectly okay with him. At the very least, he wishes that people be Initiated by a Living Master, whoever that may be, and not by someone who has not passed through Self-Realization.
 
With this said, I am sure there is much to ponder upon.  I am by no means here to say what you are doing or the method you have come up with is "right or wrong".  But if I could ask you only one question, it would be this.
 
If you have not yet tasted Enlightenment or Self-Realization as a direct and living experience, then how can you be sure 100% that your method of healing is full-proof and guaranteed to take one to Enlightenment?
 
After all, anyone who has not yet realized their enlightenment cannot teach enlightenment or ascension.  That being said, are not ALL techniques that are not full-proof and guaranteed to take one to Self-Realization or Enlightenment useless and ultimately a waste of one's time?  Because it is not just about being able to cure or heal a few diseases.  It is about the Energy which is being transmitted being able to cure, heal or improve drastically all diseases and take one to Enlightenment in a short time.  And only an Enlightened Teacher would know if their Energy is full-proof or not.  No one else would truly know.
 
Thank you for your time.  Best and Blessings,
In Nithyananda, Vaughn (Sri Ananda Chinmay)

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Wed Apr 27, 2005 8:15 am

elisabeth_fr...
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Message #59 of 242 |
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Dear Vaughn, thanks for your continued efforts but frankly, it is just a waste of time for both you and me, and for the many MPRUE initiates that you...
Elisabeth Frauendorfer
elisabeth_fr...
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Apr 27, 2005
8:16 am

Dear Jean, thanks for commenting. His first email was private, I answered privately and he replied to my private email including all the MPRUE emails he found...
Elisabeth Frauendorfer
elisabeth_fr...
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Apr 27, 2005
10:18 am

Dear Margaret, thanks for your input. The problem is that hardly anybody (even among the highest evolved Lightworkers) is able to detach her/himself to such...
Elisabeth Frauendorfer
elisabeth_fr...
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Apr 27, 2005
12:43 pm
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