I'll have some recipes to post pretty soon for non-keto diets. I made a cheap &
easy nutrition bar (got sick of buying)with oatmeal and whey protein and have a
whole bunch of other "favorites" I have modified and made over more healthfully
(A woman cannot live on egg whites alone).  I'd enjoy making over a favorite or
testing a recipe someone else is curious about, I love cooking.  Eventually I'd
like to make such part of my website somehow. I also am going to be playing
around with getting things into 40/30/30 or actually 40/40/20? ratios.   I've
had a few disasters (some very shiny protein cookies, carbless muffins) but some
keepers too.  (My emphasis, being single working mommy, beyond nutrition is
simple, quick, easy with stuff you typically have in your house already).

Stella
Poised for the post-Creavelle era in Nutrition
http://hometown.aol.com/luvztocook

This is great! I've progressed too fast to keep up with the weight gain in
the chins?

This makes a sick sort of sense.

Craig


> Here's my opinion: you may not be able to "gain" on chinning beause the
rest
> of your body is growing!

;-) Cause I'm too chubby, doll! Or thick or whatever you wanna call it and you
can't see all my muscles (they are there though, I swear!) Really.. I weigh like
153 lbs or something..In Jan bf was 20% (I threw my scale away months ago so I
would not be trying to lose weight and train for a marathon at the same time. I
will weigh in when I get back and also do my body fat. ) The only reason the
webpics are okay is because the before pics are so bad. Maybe when have more
visible muscle like those awesome pics up there now.

Stella


In a message dated Mon, 1 May 2000 10:16:04 AM Eastern Daylight Time, "Delphene"
<dhennig@...> writes:

<< and why not, missy?  Your  pictures on your website are so awesome and
inspirational!  They would make wonderful gallery pictures.

delphene

-----Original Message-----
From: runnerwoman25@...
>Stella
>(you won't be seeing me in the galleries any time soon...MAYBE end of
summer)
>

Cramps can be water related and or electrolyte related (often the same thing in
a way).

>>> <gregg_pinsky@...> 05/01/00 10:03AM >>>


I have heard that Creatine can cause muscle cramping.  I had tried Creatine,
didn't notice any results and stopped taking it about two weeks ago.  I know it
remains in my system for a while.  I remain on my weight training program and
have begun playing on a soccer team to add to my cardio.  Anyway, I have been
playing soccer the last few Sunday's and for some reason, I am getting pretty
severe (in my opinion) muscle cramps in my hams the last three Sunday evenings.
I know I should increase my water intake, but any other suggestions?  The last
two Sundays I was dining out when the cramps occurred.  I tend to make quite a
scene when I grimmace in pain and work to stretch out my hams.  Am I missing
something?  While I'm playing, I feel great - it's not until later that the
cramps come.

Millard:
   Any male whose body doesn't produce enough testosterone to build a lean,
muscular physique is not a healthy male.....true! Now what about if you're a
girl? What about trangendered males who might like to compete in the Miss
America pageant.....just give 'em a little estrogen? Strange days we're
living in!

John wrote:
>Jim, looks like I'm on the "over-zealous list" right now.  So don't
misunderstand my comments that follow.  I agree that negatives have a
place in the training arsinal.  But Craig and John made comments that
indicate their arms and forearms aren't ready to take them to the next
level with negatives, e.g. tendinitis concerns, strong back/weak arms.
<snip>
I gave Craig and John step one.  You've given them at least step two,
maybe step three.  So, Craig and John, keep the negative training idea
in your bag of tricks.  But I'd recommend building up those arms and
grip first to avoid injuries.<

John, good catch.  I wasn't considering the tendonitis angle.  Thanks for
putting it all together.

Best,
Jim L.

<<and why not, missy? Your pictures on your website are so awesome and
inspirational! They would make wonderful gallery pictures. delphene>>

I second this, Stella!

Ivan

On Mon, 01 May 2000 01:33:25 -0700, Draper <irononline@...>
wrote:

> Give us a month and The Bomber
>Blend will be in cute kilogram tubs. Samples, anyone?

Oh, like you have to ask?  Of course!  Where do we sign up?

--dnb

<<...what about Clancy Ross and Chuck Sipes?
Don't tell me they weren't perfect.  They were my idols when the world was
young.

ron>>


I don't know whether these men 'dabbled' in pharmaceuticals on not, but I
can report that Clancy Ross was a fine gentleman.  For many years he owned a
gym in San Leandro (SF Bay Area), before moving to a location in Walnut
Creek (about 20 miles away).  The gym in that space is now a Gold's.  When
Clancy ran it, it was called "Clancy Ross' Mr. America Gym".  I met the late
Don Ross there once as well.  I believe it was in 1984.  I don't know if
they were related but Don was in the process of relocating from the East
Coast to Southern California.  Also a very genuine individual without
pretense.

Bill2

IronOnline@egroups.com wrote:
> > Anyone else who wants to get added to that list, respond here or
> privately your choice. You don't need to write what you're doing,
> just that you're doing something.

Add me to your list as well.  I started the day off with a three mile run.  My
goal for this month is to drop bodyfat.  I am currently at 15%.

David

Try a 99mg potassium capsule/tablet 3 times a day.
As to the creatine I have no knowledge. The people I know who use it seem
kind of "bloaty". I figure I'll soldier on without it.

Chuck

From: <gregg_pinsky@...>
>
> I have heard that Creatine can cause muscle cramping.  I had tried
Creatine,
> didn't notice any results and stopped taking it about two weeks ago.  I
know it
> remains in my system for a while.  I remain on my weight training program
and
> have begun playing on a soccer team to add to my cardio.  Anyway, I have
been
> playing soccer the last few Sunday's and for some reason, I am getting
pretty
> severe (in my opinion) muscle cramps in my hams the last three Sunday
evenings.
> I know I should increase my water intake, but any other suggestions?  The
last
> two Sundays I was dining out when the cramps occurred.  I tend to make
quite a
> scene when I grimmace in pain and work to stretch out my hams.  Am I
missing
> something?  While I'm playing, I feel great - it's not until later that
the
> cramps come.

> In a message dated 4/30/00 3:02:17 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
> IronOnline@egroups.com writes:
>
> << Now then... We seriously don't have ANYONE who's ready to quit smoking
> this  month? Uh, tomorrow, I mean? >>
>
> i am starting on the Nicorette gum today to at least cut the daily
> consumption of cigarettes, does this count. My eventual goal is to kick it
> completely. Anyone else on the list a former smoker? Any tips would be
> appreciated. I feel like a prisoner to nicotine. Anyway to change thought
> patterns?
>

Sure! Change more than the smoking, is what I think got me through it,
finally (I quit end of last year after 18 years). I quit coffee first
(reduce the nervous tension, you'll have FAR too much energy when you quit
the cigs), I quit beer second, and quit cigs third. Take a month or more off
from the things you do when you smoked. Keep very busy. SUperset yur weight
training, and add daily HIIT cardio. Revel in what you can do without the
chains in your blood & lungs. Get so healthy that you couldn't STAND to
smoke.

from an email I sent in Februarry, eight weeks after I quit:



>My crazy progress report: Started eating EVERYTHING, hoping to get into a
>mass phase, and while I've certainly put on 2-3# of fat I've clearly put on
>5-8 pounds of muscle in the last 6-8 weeks. I'm pretty amazed. I'm at 187
>now, and am looking to get to 190-200 with a BF of 10-12 by midsummer. Heck
>of a lot stronger, too. Anyone still smoking? Might be of interest I was
175
>on a Thursday 8 weeks ago when I stopped...

>Craig

And I'm still growing: about the same level of fat, judging by my midsection
(I took a couple months off of cardio to get the muscle growing, I'm back on
it now.) And I'm at 194. SInce 2/23/00 I've added an inch to both arms, and
inch to my calves. Realize I was very weak & skinny a year previous. I went
from 160 to 175 from 2/99-12/99. I've gone from 175 to 194 in five months,
through good training & NOT SMOKING.

Laree will surely hit you with a link to the IOL quit smoking section. I
strongly reccomend a homeopathic withdrawl relief formula, and If you are
interested I'll find out what it is called. You still get crazy, but not as
bad.

Craig

I am 22.  Lift every MWF and skate everday.  Today I heard that a person said
that I look twice as big from the previous time he saw me.  I don't want to
let this add to my ego.   The reason I might look twice as big is because of
this time of year.  I live in south Texas and can loose weight because of the
heat.  How do I do this?  Lots of skateboarding.  I can attribute alot of my
strength to this alternative activity.  Down wind is a breeze, it is up wind
" i think i can " part were you grow stronger.  Its fun to work out this way.
  I would suggest it to anyone.  Thank you for reading this.  In addition when
the weather is nice go carve.

Inspiring those who are not "twice as big"

M. Jackson

Hi IOL members,
Well, I've been sick with that disease, or back, or migraines  for
pretty much all of April.  Had to take a 2 week layoff from the weights
last 2 weeks.

Today, my first workout w/weights(I still walked alot)...and the first
time I've squatted since I tore my knee ligament so badly in Jan, 00!
It was only 10 reps w/bodyweight-and now, my knee hurts fairly strongly,
BUT I'M COMIN' back, baby!

Been Stealth Bombing as I can...Happy B'day to dd...did Shawn leave??  A
shame that.

Well, back to work.  Laree, I want to lose 2" off of my waist this
month-ambitious, yes.  I'd hoped to have 4 weeks last month to give me a
running start, but I was so sick, I didn't eat for days, and passed out
and fell, cutting my thumb badly, and other
assorted bruises/abrasions...but am on the mend.

california dreamin',
barry in PA.
PS- Thanks to the House(Henrik) for a message you sent-sorry I didn't
respond yet-was under the weather.

I shave my body.  I am at the point of hating body hair as well.  I guess it
comes with the territory.  I get some strange looks, and sometimes made fun
of.  But, I think it's worth it.

Raise The Bar!
Tony

I have heard that Creatine can cause muscle cramping.  I had tried Creatine,
didn't notice any results and stopped taking it about two weeks ago.  I know it
remains in my system for a while.  I remain on my weight training program and
have begun playing on a soccer team to add to my cardio.  Anyway, I have been
playing soccer the last few Sunday's and for some reason, I am getting pretty
severe (in my opinion) muscle cramps in my hams the last three Sunday evenings.
I know I should increase my water intake, but any other suggestions?  The last
two Sundays I was dining out when the cramps occurred.  I tend to make quite a
scene when I grimmace in pain and work to stretch out my hams.  Am I missing
something?  While I'm playing, I feel great - it's not until later that the
cramps come.

Chris:
  Back when I competed in bodybuilding I would use barber's clippers to remove
the hair on my legs, chest,forearms, and abdomen. I din't particularly enjoy
doing this, but it was necessary in order to show all of the cuts and
separation which I had trained and dieted so hard to achieve.I have not
competed since 1982, and consequently am no longer concerned about hair
removal.
  One of my gang at the gym where I used to train had more hair on his body
than most of us have on our heads. Several of us had finished our workout,
and when we entered the locker room, a middle aged man bolted out of the
shower room. He had a turkish towel wrapped around his waist, and had a look
of stark terror in his eye. We didn't know what the problem was at first. A
moment later, our pal with the excesive body hair rushed buck naked out of
the shower room in hot pursuit. His face was nearly purple from the bottle of
niacin he had swallowed moments before. In his hand was a straight edged
razor and his body was covered from head to toe with shaving cream, streaked
here and there with blood from where he had apparently knicked himself with
the razor. As he chased the frightened older man up and down the rows of
lockers, he attempted to explain himself: "Aw, c'mon, man, huh? I'm not gay
or nothin'! I'd just like for you to shave my back for me!"

                              MrNH77

Let us not go in the other direction.  One packet of many MRP's is
equivalent to the protein in a pound of cottage cheese.  I would prefer the
cottage cheese but, on the run, the MRP would be fine.  All supplements are
not useless.  Some are quite beneficial.  It is the advertising that is
false.

Just as a red Jaguar does not make an elderly chubby man suddenly sexy,
protein, creatine or any other supplement will not turn him into a champion
bodybuilder either.

ron


> Millard: I might have been 19 when I heard rumors to the effect that the
> bodybuilding champions didn't really use Crash Weight Gain Formula #7 to
get
> so huge. I had been stupid enough to gamble $14.98 on a fourteen day
supply
> and didn't gain very much muscle, but on more than one occasion clogged
our
> plumbing and asphyxiated my family.
>    Most of the bodybuilding supplements out there today are slickly
marketed
> and make promises which they can never deliver.In the mid 1980's Lyle
Alzado
> was doing endorsements for Unipro Amino Acids and Carboplex,and, as we all
> eventually found out,his prowess was largely the result of a $30,000 a
year
> drug habit. When will we ever learn?
>
>                                    MrNH77

Off to a good start on May 1st (Well, I've only been up 2 hours, Lunch
packed for work (Lots of protein, enough carbs, and minimal fat) New mind
set, Ready to rip! (Or should that be get ripped....) Dave D where do I
pre-order "Bomber Blend"??? Good Luck to all IOL's in May!!  Frank J.

Hello, Chris,

Yes, compound exercise seems to be the way to go. Most sound personal
trainers would tell you the same.  The key to size gain is to be patient.
Since you seems to have trained for less than three years, I would not try
so hard to work on exercises to isolate your arms just yet.  Wait till you
get really big and lose the necessary body fat at the same time (of course
without necessarily being ripped to shreds). Exercises like bench press,
narrow grip bench, shoulder presses, squats (if you squeeze the bar for that
extra push and intensity) and deadlifts (forearm and biceps) would do enough
for you. Isolation exercises like cable push-downs, dumbell kick-backs and
even French curl (too dangerous for the elbows) do not do much for me. If
you focus too much on isolation exercises at this stage, you may end up
stifling your growth from overtraining your arms or you may drop in exercise
intensity from overtraining. Either way, you just won't make the kind of
size you want.  It is better to focus on heavy multi-joint movements to
build a firm foundation for future isolation work.

As you may notice all these compound exercises have more tricep involvment
naturally.  That is because the triceps are the bigger heads of the arm, not
the biceps (three heads as opposed to two, get it?).  As some may jest, "curls
are for the girls." (very sexist) Maybe I won't put it that bluntly, but the
point is well made for noticing the importance of triceps for arm size and
strength. Curls are necessary but don't over do them (no more than twice a
week).

Thus, the narrow grip bench press would be the key to both adding arm size
and getting a little inner pec work. This would improve your bench press
immensely and then in turn allowing you to handle more weight on the bench
which in turn allow your triceps to get more work with heavier weights.
Well you get the drift with all the "in-turns".  Another good compound
movement is the old-fashioned dips with weights.  You must seek to increase
in your dips weights.  If you wish, replace the narrow grip bench press with
dips.  Dips tend to give really good pump as well.

I have found Stuart McRobert's latest book "The Insider's Tell-All on Weight
Training Techniques" as an absolutely indispensible tool.  To build bigger arms,
one has to do things "safely". If you do all these movements with bad form, the
chance of injury is greatly increased.  I hope this helps.  Also let the mirror
be your guide, not just the measuring tape.  I have a friend at the
gym who curls and benches about the same amount as I but has at least two
more inches on his arms. That is because we probably have the same amount of
lean mass.  Thus, his extra inches did not really look that big.  He even
jokes, "You cannot tell my big arms because they are so fat."  Right, dude.
So beware of your proportion of strength in relations to the size gain.
Lean and solid muscle mass (with a little bit of fat is OK) is probably a
good way to go.

I checked out your site. Your pictures seem to show that you have already
work an extra bit on arms, especially the biceps (am I right?).  You don't
want to create any kind of muscle imbalance, especially if your proportion
already favors the arms.  Remember that big arms are built on the foudation
of a strong body.  Big arms are just the byproduct or manifestation of a
strong overall built. Guys like the WWF wrestlers are primarily strong
lifters of compound exercise before they received their big arms.  Best of
luck in your pursuit.

Sam


>i am trying to get some suggestions of some mass routines
>size pure bulk in all the  muscle groups
>
>compound excerices  but i'm into gaining arm size as well
>please help me out
>i'm running out of ideas
>
>please look at me page to see me and my body structure
>>
>http://community.webtv.net/HBKBOY/ChrissHBKBOY
>
>http://community.webtv.net/HBKBOY/ChrissPage

Not me... I'm just my hairy self. If I could just move some hair from my chin to
the top of my head though...

>>> <chris.millar@...> 04/30/00 06:46PM >>>


How many of the guys in this iron game wax or shave their bodies??? When I first
started I swore I'd never shave or wax even my legs, now I find myself hating
body hair. Weird how a bit of muscle and definition will remove body hair
quicker than you can drink a protein shake :o)

> How many of the guys in this iron game wax or shave their bodies???

As a  bicycle racer I'd ago grown use to shaving my legs long
before I ever hoisted a bar bell.

Now that I've added body building to my athletic roster it was easy
to just shave the rest of my body during my weekly sheering rituals.

  Seems more consistent and feels much nicer. The lycra goes on
ever so much smoother.

gil

>  Some years ago, no less than Steeve Reeves remarked,"Any healthy male
whose
> body cannot produce enough testosterone to build a lean, healthy physique
> ought to take up a less strenuous sport such as tiddly winks."

But a male whose body does not produce enough testosterone to build a
healthy physique is NOT a healthy male.

Millard Baker
Mesomorphosis
http://www.mesomorphosis.com/

"No, no, we
> don't prescribe anabolic steroids to our patients, we prescribe
> testosterone!"

"Millard J Baker"

"Words, words words, I'm so sick of words."
                                 Pygmalion (GBS)

How about: I'm not on drugs.  I just take a lot of Valium.

John two words -WELL SAID

Thanks for the directions link Laree.  I won't have a problem finding
the place.  I should be in around 1-2pm (and I'm sure I'll be there
for 1-2 hours... very much off dieting with vacation and all :)
Won't say what I've been eating.  Hope to see you (and anyone else
who can make it in) there!  For anyone else out there that's in there
on Monday afternoon I'll be the guy who looks like a tourist :)

Best everybody,
Mark!!!

and why not, missy?  Your  pictures on your website are so awesome and
inspirational!  They would make wonderful gallery pictures.

delphene

-----Original Message-----
From: runnerwoman25@...
>Stella
>(you won't be seeing me in the galleries any time soon...MAYBE end of
summer)
>

Someone asked about the article I talked about with Bill Keyes re: adding 50
lbs. to your bench Here's the link 
www.musclemedia.com/training/bench/bench04.html   Look it over. Someone else
sent this in originally but I already deleted that post.

Revised, updated and revving up for Monday - 51 of us hitting the ground
running....

Ron, Ivan, Bruce, Stella, Tom, Wayne, Jack, Doc, Triff, Joe, Diann, Gary E,
Bill2, Sam, Steve W, Guy, Sandy, Lauri, Adam, Cris, Hugo, me, Gary C,
Gregg, Don D, Gary F, Craig, Penny D, JohnO, Ragtop, Frank, Scottie, Chef
Vince, TitanPeter, Henrik, Simpl667, Susan R, Charles M, Og, Doc Tim,
Chuck, BudLA, Rick C, Tonia, Charles A, Ingrid, Paul W, Bev, Susan Smith,
Delphene, Gil, Captain Marvel

I'm joining the masses, follower that I am, bringing the grand total to five-2.
Hi everybody...it's me, the shadow...the man behind Laree...the thunder of
silence... the ripple in the pond gone dry...the echo of fire and fury
extinguished...It's dave d. trying to sound heavy and trying to get ripped.

The bomber blend project is near completion. We have passed the taste test
with two thumbs up and Laree has designed the label which awaits basic word
revisions (usual hype...twist off the cap and gain 5 to 10 pounds of lean
muscle mass...that's a joke). Today, to compliment our May excursions, we
place our first order with the manufacturer. Give us a month and The Bomber
Blend will be in cute kilogram tubs. Samples, anyone?

I'm planning to up my spin bike output (I'd have to stop for it to be less)
and drop the body weight slowly over the month. Funny thing, as I write
this commitment I notice my hands are struggling with the keyboard...the
fingers curl up into fists and I keep putting them in my pockets. I'm
changing the word 'commitment' to 'suggestion.' There, that's way better. I
tend to lean on my training all the time, you know. But, you can bet Bert
I'll be looking for some thin skin as the month rolls on by. Tuna and
water, anyone?

I don't want the month to roll on by.This is the best time of year in my
neighborhood; warm and brilliant days that never end and skies... why... you
can see forever. Let's hold it right here, Bombers. We can do anything we
set our minds to. Put a wedge in the gears of time. Or stop smoking or
bench 405 or proceed to gain some muscle separation or heal thy back, dear God.

You guys are the greatest.    dd

> Anyone else who wants to get added to that list, respond here or
> privately your choice. You don't need to write what you're doing,
> just that you're doing something.

Sign me up. Should we report on our success (or, <gulp>  failure?

gil