From: seekerk ofpa <seekerk@...>
Subject: RE: [BBS_Open_Discussion] Re: hello everyone
To: bbs_open_discussion@yahoogroups.com
Date: Tuesday, January 6, 2009, 10:17 PM

please do not take it personally. we like to jump up and down but know better then to take ourselves seriously.
ONe more mile

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To: BBS_Open_Discussion @yahoogroups. com
From: medickat37@yahoo. com
Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2009 16:01:45 -0800
Subject: RE: [BBS_Open_Discussio n] Re: hello everyone

Look I was asked a question about how I knew that alcoholism was considered a disease and I answered. There is no reason for any of you to jump down my throat about it..... I know the Big Book just as well as any of you.                                                              Sincerely, Kat                                EMT-P                    Flint, Michigan --- On Tue, 1/6/09, les hymel <cajunles2000@ yahoo.com> wrote: From: les hymel <cajunles2000@ yahoo.com> Subject: RE: [BBS_Open_Discussio n] Re: hello everyone To: BBS_Open_Discussion @yahoogroups. com Date: Tuesday, January 6, 2009, 3:34 PM OK we'll get to change the BB, 'cause it's wrong! Les Hymel 678-936-1080 --- On Tue, 1/6/09, Kitty <medickat37@yahoo. com> wrote: From: Kitty <medickat37@yahoo. com> Subject: RE: [BBS_Open_Discussio n] Re: hello everyone To: BBS_Open_Discussion @yahoogroups. com Date: Tuesday, January 6, 2009, 2:04 PM as afr as I am concerned the issue over whether alcoholism is a disease or not was brought up and I have a source that says it is a dibilitating disease...It is not irrelevant at all.                                                              Sincerely, Kat                                EMT-P                    Flint, Michigan --- On Tue, 1/6/09, les hymel <cajunles2000@ yahoo.com> wrote: From: les hymel <cajunles2000@ yahoo.com> Subject: RE: [BBS_Open_Discussio n] Re: hello everyone To: BBS_Open_Discussion @yahoogroups. com Date: Tuesday, January 6, 2009, 11:58 AM It's all "Outside Issues", therefore irrelevant Les Hymel 678-936-1080 --- On Tue, 1/6/09, Kitty <medickat37@yahoo. com> wrote: From: Kitty <medickat37@yahoo. com> Subject: RE: [BBS_Open_Discussio n] Re: hello everyone To: BBS_Open_Discussion @yahoogroups. com Date: Tuesday, January 6, 2009, 11:51 AM Because I used to be a union stewart for a local hospital and I read the disabilities act due to having to defend a coworker.                                                              Sincerely, Kat                                EMT-P                    Flint, Michigan --- On Tue, 1/6/09, Christine Berger <colleenchris1966@ yahoo.com> wrote: From: Christine Berger <colleenchris1966@ yahoo.com> Subject: RE: [BBS_Open_Discussio n] Re: hello everyone To: BBS_Open_Discussion @yahoogroups. com Date: Tuesday, January 6, 2009, 10:42 AM How do you know that?? --- On Tue, 1/6/09, Kitty <medickat37@yahoo. com> wrote: From: Kitty <medickat37@yahoo. com> Subject: RE: [BBS_Open_Discussio n] Re: hello everyone To: BBS_Open_Discussion @yahoogroups. com Date: Tuesday, January 6, 2009, 10:33 AM Alcoholism is covered under the American Disabities Act as a dibilitating disease.                                                              Sincerely, Kat                                EMT-P                    Flint, Michigan --- On Tue, 1/6/09, seekerk ofpa <seekerk@msn. com> wrote: From: seekerk ofpa <seekerk@msn. com> Subject: RE: [BBS_Open_Discussio n] Re: hello everyone To: bbs_open_discussion @yahoogroups. com Date: Tuesday, January 6, 2009, 10:26 AM The AMA says it is a Disease. The program has not changed but what we know about alcoholism and the meetings have changed over the years. Also the idea of what is a disease and what is not has change. Back when the big book was written lou garics was not a disease either, neither was alzhimers or dozens of others that we now know are caused by physical, not mental causes. Many peole do lean on the idea that since is is a disease they are helpless. I have another disease that leads me to a whole new way of thinking. In some ways it is like AA, and AA has helped me trememdously with it. I have to decided every time I eat or think about eating weather to be in pain and ill or not. I now have the wisdom to know what was killing me so now I have the choice. I can not think my self able to do what I once did and think this time will be different. In that illness just one will make me sick and I just be on constatant watch because people love to hide it in food and think of it as a way to celabrate cheer. Funny thing is it also leads to mood swings, depression, brain fog and killing parts of my body. It is a disease and i choose to live in recovery not in Illness. Same with AA where do I want to hang my hat? Am I a sick and hopless drunk or have I found the solution? Peresonaly I don't really care what lable anyone gives AA. If I follow the program as written in the big book I stay sober. It does not matter what I call it what matters is how I choose to act on it. ONe more mile To: BBS_Open_Discussion @yahoogroups. com From: cappyquinlan@ bigpond.com. au Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2009 16:24:57 +1100 Subject: Re: [BBS_Open_Discussio n] Re: hello everyone Your last para says what I wanted to say ,better . I knew there was something amiss when I had grown tired of hearing  that we have  a disease  and i thought this is being pushed too hard  .Then I progressed to learning more AA history and found more in the Big Book ,but more importantly what wasnt there ,ie  a definition of alcoholism saying it was a disease . The guys who were pushing it as a disease also didnt appear to be too hot on working the steps ,also gave me a clue to what was going on in the Fellowship as opposed to the Program . Thank you . Frank Quinlan On 06/01/2009, at 3:24 PM, les hymel wrote: Actually from what i read on the history, Bill wanted to call it a disease, however, he didn't want to offend the medical community, who didn't think it as a disease.  Now I suppose u could consider alcoholism a form of spiritual disease, however the BB doesn't say it is one.  In the forward to the 2nd edition on page xx(4th Ed.)/page xviii(3rd Ed), second paragraph-Alcoholic s Anonymous is not a religious organization.  Neither does A.A. take any particular point of view, though we cooperate widely with the men of medicine as well as with the men of religion.  Also the 10th tradiotio, particularly the long form.   Additionally I hear the argument that it wasn't classified as a disease until 1965.  We have had 2 Editions printed since then and numerous printings of each edition.  The internet as we know it only evolved in the 1980's or so and the 4th Edition has mention.   My main beef is that if I look at it as a disease, then I have something outside of myself to blame it on, as opposed to a spiritual disease within me, of which I alone am responsible for taking necessary action. Les Hymel 678-936-1080 --- On Mon, 1/5/09, Mark Matta <mjamatta@yahoo. com> wrote: From: Mark Matta <mjamatta@yahoo. com> Subject: RE: [BBS_Open_Discussio n] Re: hello everyone To: BBS_Open_Discussion @yahoogroups. com Date: Monday, January 5, 2009, 10:50 PM Les,    Sorry, but I should have been more through and considerate in my questioning.  I see the term malady used rather liberally in the text and see that as near, but not the same idas as the term disease. Bill was fond of using many different terms to make the same point or idea present for us.  Where did the term or ideal of the "disease concept" originate?  Les is most correct that the Big Book especially the Dr's Opinion does not use the word disease except one. Big Book, Page 64 where it describes the spiritual problems(disease) that evolve from resentments that many people alcoholic and non-alcoholic alike abound. I always heard the disease concept in meetings and after reading Les's comment I am having a few new thoughts on the matter. The disease term, may not be the way the author intended if he went to such lengths to use other terms with near complete exclusion of the word disease.  My compliments on your timely and accurate statement.    Yours in Fellowship,   Mark Matta 724-219-3789 Pitcairn 12&12 3/24/97     -----Original Message----- From: BBS_Open_Discussion @yahoogroups. com [mailto:BBS_Open_Discussion@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of les hymel Sent: Monday, January 05, 2009 3:35 PM To: BBS_Open_Discussion @yahoogroups. com Subject: Re: [BBS_Open_Discussio n] Re: hello everyone Rhine I have to disagree with part of what u said.  Nowhere in the basic text does it say that alcoholism is a disease Les Hymel 678-936-1080 --- On Mon, 1/5/09, rhinebeck2007 <rhinebeck2007@ yahoo.com>wrote: From: rhinebeck2007 <rhinebeck2007@ yahoo.com> Subject: [BBS_Open_Discussio n] Re: hello everyone To: BBS_Open_Discussion @yahoogroups. com Date: Monday, January 5, 2009, 2:15 PM From an opening statement at my home group.  "Here, we believe that everything you need to know about recovery from the disease of alcoholism can be found in the Big Book of Alcoholics Anonymous. Our message is that recovery is possible for anyone who is willing to follow its suggestions and put the principles of the 12 Steps to work in their life." I know this to be true. I also know that much of what one hears in the rooms of AA today is either only partially true - hence false - or absolutely false. It was not until I became "willing to follow its suggestions and put the principles of the 12 Steps to work in my life" that I was able to recover from alcoholism.  In Fellowship, Mike W.